Valonqar possibilities

[Victarion Chainbreaker]

i want to love this idea, as sandor is my favorite character int he entire series.

however a few questions make me think its not likely:

1) he's secluded in the isles, with no connection to what is going on, the faith wouldnt know that he is in fact he, (elder brother kinda made it known he wanted sandors existence a secret).

2) even if the faith discovered that sandor is in fact sandor, sandor turned his back and deserted, a fate punishable by death

3) why would sandor return and give up his life of peace to get thrown back into the middle of things? regardless if its gregor or not.

i just feel he has no drive to return to a life of violence to a place he'd come to despise. hed also be held for desertion of the throne. much more, i dont think he'd throw himself in as being so whole heartedly devout and faithful in the eyes of the seven. if anything, after his confrontation with beric, i think he'd grow a faith for rhyllor and overcome his fear of flame.

ETA: i think if anything, he took sansa's song for him to heart, soemthing like tame the fury, teach us all a kinder way, this would imply him living his years as a gravedigger as repentence, and i dont think hed turn his back on that.

I agree with all these points. I don't think we'll hear from the Hound again until the bay freezes over and wights try overrunning the quiet isle

[Luthien Targaryen]

My money is on Jaime, followed by Aegon (even if he is some random kid, he could have had a random elder sibling), but the torture machine idea is very interesting.

As for the younger, more beautiful queen, I guess Dany and Sansa are the most likely but I'd like to see it as Shireen Baratheon, and Cersei realises that beauty is more than skin deep.

I have a deep mistrust of prophecy in this series, I have a sneaking suspicion it's all just a load of.....red herrings?

[Blazfemur]

I agree with all these points. I don't think we'll hear from the Hound again until the bay freezes over and wights try overrunning the quiet isle

thank you kind sir. when the fallen in blackwater bay awaken, we may see him again

[The Fresh PtwP]

I did a pretty definite threat on the all the YMBQ possibilities: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/93920-compiling-the-younger-more-beautiful-queens/ .

The list is a lot longer than just 4, though some are stronger candidates than others.

Then the obvious answer is the High Septon, but realistically the quote means "queen." That is just how English works. For example, if I say "Adam played baseball today, he got three hits." Everyone would assume Adam got three hits. However, some smarty pants might point out that "he" doesn't have to refer to Adam. It could refer to any male. That person should be slapped Three Stooges style.

Still, if you want to insist the YMBQ is not a queen, the obvious candidate is the High Sparrow, who actually sniffed out Cersei's plan, arrested her, got her to confess to embarassing sins, and broke her power by marching her naked through King's Landing with a procession chanting "sinner, sinner" before her.

I keep saying, if you think it is obvious, you just haven't thought about it enough.

So the High Sparrow is younger and more beautiful? The "another" opens up people who aren't currently queens but are both younger and more beautiful (Sansa, Arianne, Asha). Yes i know how english works, I am aware that the person is most likely a queen but the fact that GRRM didn't make Maggy say queen gives him more wiggle room with the prophecy in case he wants to change it. Although as I've said before I think it's Marge and that it's pretty much already done...

[Castellan]

Sandor is someone who's whole personality is defined by being little brother to the Mountain, he's sequestered on the Quiet Isle, surely preparatory to busting out for some exciting plot development, so I think he's definitely on the short list.

Loras also is defined by his relationships in his family - as the youngest brother, not quite so much as Sandor. On the other hand, if the YMBQ is Margaery, the prophecy running on to 'the little brother' makes extra sense.

[Blazfemur]

Sandor is someone who's whole personality is defined by being little brother to the Mountain, he's sequestered on the Quiet Isle, surely preparatory to busting out for some exciting plot development, so I think he's definitely on the short list.

Loras also is defined by his relationships in his family - as the youngest brother, not quite so much as Sandor. On the other hand, if the YMBQ is Margaery, the prophecy running on to 'the little brother' makes extra sense.

hmm.. margaery, and then valonqar being loras. interesting.

the only believable way i see sandor leaving the quiet isles, is if somehow he finds whats going on with sansa/alayne and if he finds out littlefinger is doing her wrong, or attempts something dirty with her. i think that would enrage sandor, and send him packing

[Blazfemur]

p.s. - ever think that Sandor, could be metaphorical Azor Ahai? The Hound is dead... it'd be interesting if Sandor was "reborn" in some way. It'd be a storybook character arc, a person deathly afraid of flames, conquers his fear and serves the lord of light, coming back.

by the way thats never going to happen.

[Drowned_Man]

Although this is my first post I am no stranger to these forums. I am 100% sure that the valonqar refers to the brother of whomever the YMBQ may be.... IMO it's just too easy to suggest Jaime or Tyrion, no matter how sweet their revenge would be

[Buckley's Ghost]

Sansa. Bereft of a wolf, Sansa's warging powers will find an outlet in Sweetrobin, and Sansa will become an expert in warging humans. She will let herself be captured by Jaime, and demand that he bring her back to King's Landing. Cercei's final chapter will be in the Red Keep, watching Jaime dismount from her balcony. Suddenly, Cercei's hands will somehow wrap themselves around Tommen's throat, and strangle her poor sweet son to death. Cercei will regain power over her body just as Jaime walks in the door, only to strangle the monster his sister has become.

Loving it.

[Castellan]

We have Elder Brother's testimony that 'dead' Sandor's whole personality was warped into the desire to kill Gregor. Elder Brother thinks Sandor is reborn but I think he is no more adapted to the Quiet Isle than his war horse. His first motive: rumour that Gregor is still alive and about to represent Cersei in a trial by combat. He will want to kill him finally as he felt cheated at missing out the first time round. Also, I think his own morality would not let him just kill Gregor, but opposing him in a legal combat... And the plot has mysteriously taken him to be in a Sept. I had not realised the potential of his being picked to represent the Faith till I read this thread.

[TheButcherCrow]

How about this, Cersei wins her trial with the use of Robert Strong & then somehow Marge is convicted and sentenced to die, all hell breaks loose again in KL, Tommen is killed and Cersei flees to Casterley Rock. She is trapped there, she drinks more & more, her madness getting worse. News arrives that her daughter, her last child is dead. Still she holds on to the last shred of hope that her Jaime will come back to her, that is until she takes delivery of his golden hand and the news that he is dead (he may or may not actually be dead), this is the final straw, Cersei drinks a draft of The Strangler and rests the golden hand on her throat thus fulfilling the prophecy, HERSELF.

[HosteenOsteen]

Drowned_Man: if you are right, than the YMBQ cannot be Daenerys, only Margaery or e. g. Sansa

[Lady Fevre Dream]

unless im mistaken it was edric that was sacrificed (not to confuse the show with the books), so gendry is still alive if i remember correctly. also - mya stone still alive as well

sorry, i like to think too too out of the box. in the next box.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaat??? LOL I know, it's easy to get details confused especially depending on how many rereads one does, but both of those boys, young men are alive. Edric was smuggled off of Dragonstone by Davos and some trusted King's Men and Gendry is still alive blacksmithing and being angry with The Brotherhood.

(I'm betting this has already been pointed out, but a girl is still.....catching up, and well, I did want to explain a bit of understanding for making mistakes. There are tons of details to remember, and even with a ton of rereads myself, I forget things.)

[Lady Fevre Dream]

The word valonquar might be a clue. It is Valyrian, so I assume the Valonquar is of Valyrian blood.

That narrows it to Aegon, if he is real, or Jaime, if Aerys fathered Cersei and Jaime.

Tyrion is out unless Aerys fathered all of Tywin's children. If he only fathered Tyrion, Tyrion doesn't have full silblings.

Same goes for Jon Snow, if he is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna: no silblings.

So it will be Jaime as I think Aegon is fake and incest runs in the Targaryen family.

I just thought Maggy used the word valonquar to go with the creepy prophecy thing, and it fit with Maggy's own heritage. I'd never considered that it meant the actual valonqar had to have Valyrian blood.

I'm still thinking it has to Jaime or Tyrion, or if not the longshot might be someone else's younger brother and that Cersei sees as someones younger brother. I suppose Tommen as Joff's younger brother, but still I think anyone besides Tyrion or Jaime is a long shot. JMO.

[Blugenes]

There is a chance the Valonqar might be Jon Snow. He might take revenge for his older half-siblings and the deaths/suffering of his family at her hands. Stannis might do the same, especially if he is Hand and uses the necklace of that office (his "hands") to strangle her.

[Soulburn00]

I think it's Peter. I think the person mistranslated the meaning of valonqar and that it was referring to LittleFinger, not little brother. He was the one who had Joffrey killed. And he is the one that is going to put Sansa into power as TYMBQ.

Was it the Septa or her friend that supplied the translation? Either way my money is on Baelish.

I think you're correct about this. I lent out the first book and never got it back to double check if this is in there but in the TV show episode "Lord Snow" Catelyn says "Petyr has promised to help us find the truth. He's like a little brother to me. He would never betray my trust.". If the prophecy is open to a little interpretation that I think this could be a good clue. Can anyone confirm if this dialog is in the book?