ghosts in winterfell Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 You mean for Catelyn hate being so far above everyone else or people only hating on female characters cuz they're sexist? I was speaking mostly about the Cat hate, but both are true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Well the woman did start a war, lol I don't think so. Arresting Tyrion was one of the *wtf wut?* moments but to be fair I believe that it was Ned not Cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sansa_Stark Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 I agree why do some fans always play the sexism card? Because a lot of times it actually is legitimate. But if people give valid reasoning I don't think it is. Its like people who hate on Dany for her Daario relationship and call her a slut. That's a case where it is effective and the sexism accusations work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 The comments make for a hilarious read though, a shame I wasn't following that site back then, I would have had so much fun destroying ridiculous arguments. Like this one "her treatment of Jon is essentially a form of racism - she hates bastards". Who knew that bastards were a separate race... She's also 28 on the Most Loved list, although she attracts some very scathing comments on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 But for the people complaining about sexism...most of the most hated characters are male on that list. It's inevitable, nearly all outright villains of any importance in the series are male. On the female side we have Cersei, Lysa (both of whom place pretty high on the list) and nobody else except really minor characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 She's also 28 on the Most Loved list, although she attracts some very scathing comments on that one. Well even Stannis is 26th and they both are behind Arthur Dayne, i mean what did he ever do in the series, he appeared on 2 pages and these two Stannis and Catelyn have presence in 4 books, surely the voting or something is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Better still, Cersei ranks four places higher than Catelyn on the Most Loved! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 The comments make for a hilarious read though, a shame I wasn't following that site back then, I would have had so much fun destroying ridiculous arguments. Like this one "her treatment of Jon is essentially a form of racism - she hates bastards". Who knew that bastards were a separate race... There's an old thread on this site, in which someone lays into Catelyn (what a monster!) for not converting to Ned's religion when she married him, and putting him to the trouble and expense of building a Sept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sansa_Stark Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 There's an old thread on this site, in which someone lays into Catelyn (what a monster!) for not converting to Ned's religion when she married him, and putting him to the trouble and expense of building a Sept. god that makes me angry just thinking abiut. Why the fuck didnt she take up the old gods??!! Gonna brood now and smoke some cigarettes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 There's an old thread on this site, in which someone lays into Catelyn (what a monster!) for not converting to Ned's religion when she married him, and putting him to the trouble and expense of building a Sept. Ok I might hate Cat but what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 There's an old thread on this site, in which someone lays into Catelyn (what a monster!) for not converting to Ned's religion when she married him, and putting him to the trouble and expense of building a Sept. What an Evil person! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sifth Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 I don't think so. Arresting Tyrion was one of the *wtf wut?* moments but to be fair I believe that it was Ned not Cat. well then she's an idiot for believing anything Little Finger or Varys told her. From the very first chapter the reader can all but tell they're up to no good. People usually like to pull "But Little Finger was her friend growing up card", but fail to take into account he was a friend who left her on bad terms and in disgrace; not even taking into account that the guy is clearly spying on her and worse she knows it, lol Of cores the Cat fans will also say that Jamie and Cercie started the war, by hurting Bran. Though truth be told, neither one did it in public with plenty of witnesses to see their action. So yea Cat arresting Tyrion in public and making a big scene of herself is what started the war, IMO would Varys or Little Finger have started something regardless; probably yes. But when it comes to the war we're given in the story Cat's actions are the match the lights the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 snip I agree that she shouldn't believed LF, Varyr and Lysa and since she did believed Lysa she shouldn't allow to Sansa and Arya go to KL and she shouldn't abandon Bran and Rickon to play Stratego Westeros, but I think that Ned was the one who started the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 well then she's an idiot for believing anything Little Finger or Varys told her. From the very first chapter the reader can all but tell they're up to no good. People usually like to pull "But Little Finger was her friend growing up card", but fail to take into account he was a friend who left her on bad terms and in disgrace; not even taking into account that the guy is clearly spying on her and worse she knows it, lol Hindsight's a brilliant judge. If I was brought into a meeting with the Chancellor of the Exchequer and the Head of MI5, and they gave me some confidential information, I'd be inclined to believe them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghosts in winterfell Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 well then she's an idiot for believing anything Little Finger or Varys told her. From the very first chapter the reader can all but tell they're up to no good. People usually like to pull "But Little Finger was her friend growing up card", but fail to take into account he was a friend who left her on bad terms and in disgrace; not even taking into account that the guy is clearly spying on her and worse she knows it, lol Of cores the Cat fans will also say that Jamie and Cercie started the war, by hurting Bran. Though truth be told, neither one did it in public with plenty of witnesses to see their action. So yea Cat arresting Tyrion in public and making a big scene of herself is what started the war, IMO would Varys or Little Finger have started something regardless; probably yes. But when it comes to the war we're given in the story Cat's actions are the match the lights the fire. Again, TWot5K was the result of a series of events that were carefully orchestrated by Littlefinger and Varys -- not Jaime and Cersei, and certainly not Cat. They were merely pawns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sansa_Stark Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Again, TWot5K was the result of a series of events that were carefully orchestrated by Littlefinger and Varys -- not Jaime and Cersei, and certainly not Cat. They were merely pawns.opinions. I consider Jaime and Cersei the most responsibke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sifth Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 I agree that she shouldn't believed LF, Varyr and Lysa and since she did believed Lysa she shouldn't allow to Sansa and Arya go to KL and she shouldn't abandon Bran and Rickon to play Stratego Westeros, but I think that Ned was the one who started the war. you got to admit though, Cat's stunt put Ned in a pretty dangerous situation. Her husband was already surrounded by Lannister's who didn't really like him to begin with. If she was going to kidnap Tyrion she should have at least been clever about it and done it in a way that left few if any witnesses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light a wight tonight Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 opinions. I consider Jaime and Cersei the most responsibke. That's like blaming Smith and Wesson when somebody gets shot. Varys and Illyrio had an invasion plan well underway, with a new King to place on the Iron Throne, a possible string of Targ loyalists ready to revolt, and a negotiations open for a sellsword army. Baelish was plotting the downfall of everyone who ever slighted him. The twincest and Cersei's three golden-haired kids were just handy excuses for the action to commence. There would have been a war, no matter what. It just would have been a different war, not involving 5 kings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sifth Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 That's like blaming Smith and Wesson when somebody gets shot. Varys and Illyrio had an invasion plan well underway, with a new King to place on the Iron Throne, a possible string of Targ loyalists ready to revolt, and a negotiations open for a sellsword army. Baelish was plotting the downfall of everyone who ever slighted him. The twincest and Cersei's three golden-haired kids were just handy excuses for the action to commence. There would have been a war, no matter what. It just would have been a different war, not involving 5 kings. yea, pretty much this, though I'm pretty sure no one was predicting Balon would revolt again, but............well it's hard to predict the mind set of someone who's insane, lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghosts in winterfell Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 opinions. I consider Jaime and Cersei the most responsibke. No, it's not an opinion. A war between the Starks and the Lannisters was already a part of Varys' plan to destabilize the realm. Littlefinger accelerated it, driving a wedge between them by framing the Lannisters for Jon Arryn's murder. He may not have anticipated what happened to Bran, but he exploited it for all it was worth by framing Tyrion for the sloppy assassination attempt. It's also highly likely that he was the one who convinced Joffrey to kill Ned rather than let him take the Black. It all goes back to Littlefinger and Varys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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