Ragnarok: this theory puts all other theories to shame

[Luddagain]

Black Rider

Yes I know the roman equivalence is a bit off but it is still useful sort of.

There were 13 male Norse gods for whom equivalence seems to be

1.Thor= Robert (with some elements of his brothers)

2. Tyr = a sort of tywin, Tyrion Jaime mix

3.Odin = Blood raven

4.Hodr=Hodor

5.Balder = Walder= Hodor= Bran (not quite sure how this works but i think it is key to the story

6 and 7.Two sons of Thor = Gendry and Edrik

Now it gets harder

7. Njord - My best guess is Ned who like Njord was sort of captive of Asgard

8. Freyr - which just means Lord could be Robb (son of Njord) or it could be a Tyrell or horror - a Frey

9,10 Two sons of Odin Could be anyone

11. Bragi - seems pretty minor

And then the final very complex two. Loki and Heimdall who are two key figure in Ragnar

Loki is the trickster god who turns bad. His story parallels Theon in many ways, especially if you consider the whole family each with aspects of Loki. is

Other candidates include Little finger with his mocking bird sigil and possibly Roose Bolton.

Finally the complex character of Heimdall the watcher on the wall. He is the "white God" and some associate him with Janus the Roman God of doors but a god who clearly is underestimated in literature because he was one of Rome' principal gods, with FAR more prominence than a god of doors. it is likely that like Heimdall he guarded the link between life and death. There are two candidates for Heimdall - Sam wh has the Horn and Jon who like Heimdall is snowy white. On balance I go with Jon

[Luddagain]

Jett

It is also hard because some gods have many names or are worshiped in may different guises. . This of course gives GRRM plenty ow wriggle room in his story

It terms of the Ragnarok story, most of the key destructive forces seem in play

Of the the three terrible children of Loki we have

1. Hel: probably the Night Queen leading the White walkers and wights. These are the Frost Giants of the myth

2. Joramur the giant serpent is basically an earthquake and I see the Horn of Jorumen as basically causing the earth to shake, thus bringing down the wall

3. Fenrir the terrifying wolf is probably Rickon although I hope not

Other forces of detruction include Giants (Yep got some) and evil dwarf (yep Tyrion),

e

Sutre with flaming destructive sword is probably Dany

[The Emberheart]

I don't think GRRM is the kind of author who would base the story on an existing story or myth. But would he be inspired to borrow elements? Yes. But it won't parallel Ragnarok.

[Dornish Whine]

(i.e. those who worship the Seven -- which is an allusion to Norse numerology -- although it should be noted, the Norse held the numbers three and nine holy, rather than seven. But it's a subtle difference).

A fun read, no doubt. However, I think the quote above sums up the kind of faulty reasoning and leaps of logic that the blogger makes trying to sell us on his theory. As others have said; There are parallels between ASOIAF and the RAG myth, but GRRM isn't simply re-telling Norse mythology. I have faith that GRRM has taken inspiration from many mythological, historical, and fictional sources and blended them into something new.

[Daendrew]

I don't think GRRM is the kind of author who would base the story on an existing story or myth. But would he be inspired to borrow elements? Yes. But it won't parallel Ragnarok.

I don't think you understand what mythology truly is. All religions, fairy tales, mythologies, folk tales, comic books. They are all one story told in myriad different fashions. Watch The Power of Myth with Joseph Campbell, research the monomyth and the heroes journey.

All those myths and stories have past mythologies at their root.

All the essential stories of mankind have been told over and over. Including the core of this. Mixed and matched of course.

Being able to tell the Ragnarok story in a fresh and new way that deeply connects with its readers is not plagiarism, but high art.

Does not mean it will be a cut and paste adaptation of it though.

What is masterful about this series is that like life, there is generally no clear cut absolute hero or villain.

[LordStoneheart]

I don't think you understand what mythology truly is. All religions, fairy tales, mythologies, folk tales, comic books. They are all one story told in myriad different fashions. Watch The Power of Myth with Joseph Campbell, research the monomyth and the heroes journey.

But we know that's not GRRM's style. There is no monomyth in this series, not even close. Maybe Eddard's or Robb's story was one, but that was stamped out and very intentionally. I don't hold GRRM to god-like powers of subverting tropes like some do, but he's made it clear he's not a fan of "retelling" the same story over and over. This is the biggest crux in this theory.

[Daendrew]

But we know that's not GRRM's style. There is no monomyth in this series, not even close. Maybe Eddard's or Robb's story was one, but that was stamped out and very intentionally. I don't hold GRRM to god-like powers of subverting tropes like some do, but he's made it clear he's not a fan of "retelling" the same story over and over. This is the biggest crux in this theory.

There will be, the ultimate conflict/enemy is not even clear to us.

I would argue that Ned and Robb were not the heroes but tragic figures that had to die to set the stage for the hero(s).

[Fool of a Book]

Of the the three terrible children of Loki we have

1. Hel: probably the Night Queen leading the White walkers and wights. These are the Frost Giants of the myth

2. Joramur the giant serpent is basically an earthquake and I see the Horn of Jorumen as basically causing the earth to shake, thus bringing down the wall

3. Fenrir the terrifying wolf is probably Rickon although I hope not

Other forces of detruction include Giants (Yep got some) and evil dwarf (yep Tyrion),

e

Sutre with flaming destructive sword is probably Dany

yup indeed, lots of parallels. However I think Hel will turn out to be Val. (I believe the linked theory in the OP says it's Mel). Hel (the goddess) is akin to a Valkyrie figure and Hel (the place) is akin to Valhalla. Val and Dalla - coincidence? I tend to think not.

[LordStoneheart]

I would argue that Ned and Robb were not the heroes but tragic figures that had to die to set the stage for the hero(s).

The author would disagree.

[Daendrew]

The author would disagree.

He knew he was going to kill them from the beginning because "everyone" thought he was the hero. Everyone but him. And thought is the key word. This is an interview on how he likes to keep things unpredictable and wants readers thinking otherwise until he makes a move to reveal.

Heroes can die and bring their boon to society though.

ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY: How early in the process of writing the book series did you know you were gonna kill off Robb and Catelyn?

GEORGE R.R. MARTIN: I knew it almost from the beginning. Not the first day, but very soon. I’ve said in many interviews that I like my fiction to be unpredictable. I like there to be considerable suspense. I killed Ned in the first book and it shocked a lot of people. I killed Ned because everybody thinks he’s the hero and that, sure, he’s going to get into trouble,

[LordStoneheart]

That's exactly the point though. He wrote them to be The Hero but did not write them to be successful. Forcing the monomyth on this series just doesn't work post-aSoS

[Daendrew]

He fronted them as the hero, said everyone thought they were. But knew all along he will kill them and they weren't. But their deaths set things into motion.

[LordStoneheart]

And the only other character who could fit the monomyth without forcing the comparison is Jon, who is called a giant in Ragnarock theory and very un-heroic.

[The Mother of The Others]

We don't know BR well enough to know the game he is playing. But looks quite suspicious.

What if we don't know much about him because.... there's no twist coming! He is the heroic figure of Odin he appears to be. So when we get the big reveal about his true intent.... there won't be much to tell, because his intent is very straightforward...... which is why George has to hold back those few details from us, in order to keep us in any kind of suspense about this guy.

Nanna was a Norse God

Who Nanna? (in Song)

Jaime being the Tyr figure does kind a fit... If Bran is the Fenris (which im not sure about), it would fit because Jaime used that hand to push him. Jaime's loss of his hand doesnt quite mirror Tyr's though. Tyr lost his hand in a bout of great courage in order to bargain with Fenris

Push a kid, lose the pushing hand. Whatever god of fate exacted this divine justice, that's a god Stannis would be proud of.

Yes I know the roman equivalence is a bit off but it is still useful sort of.

There were 13 male Norse gods for whom equivalence seems to be

8. Freyr - which just means Lord could be Robb (son of Njord) or it could be a Tyrell or horror - a Frey

And then the final very complex two. Loki and Heimdall who are two key figure in Ragnar

Thanks for the god equivalents table. If a Frey is to survive and make an impact on things at this point, perhaps 8. Black Walder for Freyr?

Loki seems to be split by George into regional coverage, so every time zone of Westeros gets its own Loki. Or, you could take the "relationship" that exists between Varys & Littlefinger to imply they are the two heads of Janus when it comes to Loki-hood.

For Heimdall, the Night's Watch? And the Wall the bifrost?

yup indeed, lots of parallels. However I think Hel will turn out to be Val. (I believe the linked theory in the OP says it's Mel). Hel (the goddess) is akin to a Valkyrie figure and Hel (the place) is akin to Valhalla. Val and Dalla - coincidence? I tend to think not.

So she rides as a valkyrie at the vanguard of a vengeful Wildling horde when she sees what the kneeler crows have done to Jon?

[Daendrew]

This is a song, a song has multiple melodies brought together. there is the seven kingdoms political melody, there is the magic melody, there is the undead melody and more all woven into one song. There is no one hero and one villain for them all. But there are of one tapestry.

[Daendrew]

Ragnarok:

In the beginning was Muspell, the realm of fire. It is a place of dreadful light and heat. Only its natives, the Fire Giants, can tolerate its flames. Surt, a Fire Giant, guards Muspell's border, armed with a flaming sword. At the end of the era, at Ragnarok, Surt and his companions will destroy all the Gods and and their world with fire. Outside of Muspell lies the void called Ginnungagap, and north of Ginnungagap is Niflheim, the world of awesome dark and cold. In this world are eleven rivers flowing from a great well. The rivers are frozen and occupy Ginnungagap. When the wind, rain, ice, and cold meet the heat and fire of Muspell in the center of Ginnungagap, a place of light, air, and warmth is born. Where fire and ice first met, thawing drops appeared. Beneath the melting ice lay a Frost Giant named Ymir. Ymir slept, falling into a sweat. Under his left arm there grew a couple, male and female Giants. One of his legs begot a son with the other. sunnyway.com/runes/mythology.html

[birch]

You guys must read Foucault's Pendulum by Umberto Eco. The bottom line of that book is that you can find proof for anything you want to believe.

One of the best books I've ever read, by the way.

[The Mother of The Others]

And by believing Umberto's book, you proved him right! :drunk: hi.

[Daendrew]

You guys must read Foucault's Pendulum by Umberto Eco. The bottom line of that book is that you can find proof for anything you want to believe.

Benghazi!

[LordStoneheart]

You guys must read Foucault's Pendulum by Umberto Eco. The bottom line of that book is that you can find proof for anything you want to believe.

One of the best books I've ever read, by the way.

Basically.

Benghazi!

:lmao: