Northernmonkey Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 A quick question - does anyone think that these two still have a role to play? I liked them both and it would be nice to see them play an important role in the battle of Meereen. Will they return to Westeros? They're the only people who can confirm that Quentyn's death wasn't Dany's fault, so if they don't make it back it could have a big impact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Yes, they will. Barristan sends them with an offer to the Tattered Prince: That Dany will conquer Pentos for him. Which is three kinds of trouble.Furthermore, they will return Quentyn's bones to Dorne.A quick question - does anyone think that these two still have a role to play? I liked them both and it would be nice to see them play an important role in the battle of Meereen. Will they return to Westeros? They're the only people who can confirm that Quentyn's death wasn't Dany's fault, so if they don't make it back it could have a big impact. And here I disagree. Drinkwater's story is known: The bitch queen threw his heart in his face and her dragons killed him. 100% Dany's fault. Very loud and very outspoken.Yronwood isn't as outspoken, but he seems to share the same sentiment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harlaw's Book the Sequel Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Yes, they will. Barristan sends them with an offer to the Tattered Prince: That Dany will conquer Pentos for him. Which is three kinds of trouble. Furthermore, they will return Quentyn's bones to Dorne. And here I disagree. Drinkwater's story is known: The bitch queen threw his heart in his face and her dragons killed him. 100% Dany's fault. Very loud and very outspoken. Yronwood isn't as outspoken, but he seems to share the same sentiment. I agree. Furthermore, I think Barristan misjudged Yronwood. First, I see similarities between Yronwood and Robert (big guys, hammer is their weapon of choice, and both were thought of as "true steel" by Barristan and Noye respectively), and we know how Robert's relationship with the Targs turned out. Secondly, Yronwood agreeing to work with Barristan after Quentyn's death reminds me of the lords that changed from Renly to Stannis' side after Renly died. Remember Davos thought that the lords who changed sides were untrustworthy and that Penrose, who stayed on Renly's side, was the better man. I trust Davos' judgment more than Barristan's, so I think the Dornishmen are going to pull a fast one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slender Aimry Hill Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Gerris screams do not trust (and hence is really cool) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Eater Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 A quick question - does anyone think that these two still have a role to play? I liked them both and it would be nice to see them play an important role in the battle of Meereen. Will they return to Westeros? They're the only people who can confirm that Quentyn's death wasn't Dany's fault, so if they don't make it back it could have a big impact. If they stay out of Victarion's way they will make it back to Westeros. If Tyrion is smart, he will send them as the envoys to the Martells with Quentyn's bones as they were his friends and companions who saw how he died as you stated. Although, I wonder if Arianne would be bold enough to have them killed, thinking that they betrayed Quentyn? I agree. Furthermore, I think Barristan misjudged Yronwood. First, I see similarities between Yronwood and Robert (big guys, hammer is their weapon of choice, and both were thought of as "true steel" by Barristan and Noye respectively), and we know how Robert's relationship with the Targs turned out. Secondly, Yronwood agreeing to work with Barristan after Quentyn's death reminds me of the lords that changed from Renly to Stannis' side after Renly died. Remember Davos thought that the lords who changed sides were untrustworthy and that Penrose, who stayed on Renly's side, was the better man. I trust Davos' judgment more than Barristan's, so I think the Dornishmen are going to pull a fast one. I completely agree with the Robert parallels for Archibald, and when Arianne's parallels to Cersei are thrown into the mix, I think she may have Archibald killed like Cersei did Robert. Possibly in a similar method such as a hunting "accident?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brave_Companion Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I always thought the true steel reference was a hint that Yronwood is a Dunk descendant.That along with him being a large, seemingly slow man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Yronwood isn't as outspoken, but he seems to share the same sentiment. “He came too late.” “He offered her his heart,” Ser Gerris said again. “She needed swords, not hearts.” “He would have given her the spears of Dorne as well.” “Would that he had.” No one had wanted Daenerys to look with favor on the Dornish prince more than Barristan Selmy. “He came too late, though, and this folly … buying sellswords, loosing two dragons on the city … that was madness and worse than madness. That was treason.” “What he did he did for love of Queen Daenerys,” Gerris Drinkwater insisted. “To prove himself worthy of her hand.” The old knight had heard enough. “What Prince Quentyn did he did for Dorne. Do you take me for some doting grandfather? I have spent my life around kings and queens and princes. Sunspear means to take up arms against the Iron Throne. No, do not trouble to deny it. Doran Martell is not a man to call his spears without hope of victory. Duty brought Prince Quentyn here. Duty, honor, thirst for glory … never love. Quentyn was here for dragons, not Daenerys.” “You did not know him, ser. He—” "He’s dead, Drink.” Yronwood rose to his feet. “Words won’t fetch him back. Cletus and Will are dead too. So shut your bloody mouth before I stick my fist in it.” “Be quiet, Drink. He knows.” To Ser Barristan the big knight said, “No need to come and talk if you meant to hang us. So it’s not that, is it?” “No.” This one may not be as slow-witted as he seems. “I have more use for you alive than dead. Serve me, and afterward I will arrange a ship to take you back to Dorne and give you Prince Quentyn’s bones to return to his lord father.” I think Arch is more like to tell the truth though Arianne and Sandsnakes will like the story of Gerris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I think Arch is more like to tell the truth though Arianne and Sandsnakes will like the story of Gerris. Nothing in that passage indicates that he will say anything different from Gerris - he just won't shout it into Barristan's face while the latter is still deciding whether to hang him and Gerris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tini Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Archibald Yronwood and Gerris Drinkwater don't know what is happening in Dorne, just as Dorne have no idea what is happening in Meereen. Yet. Things have been shifting both in Meereen and Dorne. Dany turned down Quentyn's offer because she was already betrothed - and because Quentyn was not her type. Gerris Drinkwater was more her type, wasn't he? Now Quentyn is dead. And Dany's stay at Meereen as well as her marriage to Hizdahr seem to be at an end... So a marriage alliance with Dorne is possible again. Quentyn is dead but Quentyn's name was not even mentioned in the documents he presented to Daenerys. he was a replacement for Arianne, and he could be replaced as well - if Dany and Doran wished it. Doran probably doesn't wish it anymore but Quentyn's companions don't know that. What would they do if they saw an opportunity to salvage something from their Meereen disaster? They can go home now, and blame Dany for turning down the alliance offer / Quentyn's marriage proposal, and Quentyn's death. Doran will still blame them for Quentyn's death, though, in addition to blaming Dany: it was his own stupid plan that sent Quentyn to Meereen, but he wasn't there to keep Quentyn safe. Yronwood and Drinkwater were. Yronwoods and Martells were long-time enemies - and Quentyn's death makes it likely that this enmity is going to resurface again. For all Yronwood and Drinkwater know, their return might go much more smoothly if they brought back news of success as well as Quentyn's bones. An alliance with Dany, Dany herself, maybe even a dragon for Dorne. I think they will stay with Dany at least until they find out that Dorne has allied with Aegon. They might even stay with her after they find out: they might consider that alliance a betrayal of Quentyn. Whatever they will do, I think Dorne will not stand united behind Aegon or Daenerys, will not fully support Arianne. Dorne's loyalties will be split, and Doran will see it descend into civil war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Nothing in that passage indicates that he will say anything different from Gerris - he just won't shout it into Barristan's face while the latter is still deciding whether to hang him and Gerris. Barristan called him true steel. He was the one who put out the fires on Quentyn and took him back. His hands were burned severely. I get the impression that the Yronwoods genuinely loved Quentyn. Dany treated him very well. He has no reason to tell BS into Arianne's ears. Arianne does not like the Yronwoods after all. And the Yronwoods must hate Oberyn and Sandsnakes. Arianne is heavily influenced by the Sandsnakes. After Doran's death, the Yrownwoods will lose their only reason to get along with the Martells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Barristan called him true steel. He was the one who put out the fires on Quentyn and took him back. His hands were burned severely. I get the impression that the Yronwoods genuinely loved Quentyn. Dany treated him very well. He has no reason to tell BS into Arianne's ears. Arianne does not like the Yronwoods after all. And the Yronwoods must hate Oberyn and Sandsnakes. Arianne is heavily influenced by the Sandsnakes. After Doran's death, the Yrownwoods will lose their only reason to get along with the Martells. Is it BS? Dany did ridicule Quentyn's offer in front of the entire court - none of Dornish spoke Ghiscari and nobody translated the joke. Dany did marry Hizdahr above Quentyn, a totally unsuitable groom in Westerosi eyes. Dany did fuck Daario, who is even worse. Insult upon insult upon insult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikkel Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 In many ways, I dislike Dany - for various reasons that don't matter here. I've made no secret of this fact. But I don't think one can fault her in her dealings with Quentyn. That's not at all to say that the Martells will see it that way though, or if they eventually will, that it'll be easy to convince them of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 You can fault her. That joke about frogs in a language none of them understood? Diplomatic suicide. But you are right, most of it will be blown out of proportion. Doesn't change one whiff about Dorne's reaction though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elan Morin Tedronai Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Is it BS? Dany did ridicule Quentyn's offer in front of the entire court - none of Dornish spoke Ghiscari and nobody translated the joke. Dany did marry Hizdahr above Quentyn, a totally unsuitable groom in Westerosi eyes. Dany did fuck Daario, who is even worse. Insult upon insult upon insult. The ridicule wasn't cool that's true. But she is allowed to fuck and marry whoever she wants. She wasn't obliged to do anything. And Quentyn trying to tame a dragon was completely his own fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buried Treasure Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I think Arch is more like to tell the truth though Arianne and Sandsnakes will like the story of Gerris. Gerris would not be lying. His story is the truth as he see it. It won't be the truth but it is a truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeRhaegar Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 man i do think they have a big role to play i see them leaving mereen b4 dany gets back. When barry tells her the news it will not end well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARYa_Nym Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I hope so since Gerris is one of my favorite characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northernmonkey Posted February 13, 2014 Author Share Posted February 13, 2014 Yes, they will. Barristan sends them with an offer to the Tattered Prince: That Dany will conquer Pentos for him. Which is three kinds of trouble. Furthermore, they will return Quentyn's bones to Dorne. And here I disagree. Drinkwater's story is known: The bitch queen threw his heart in his face and her dragons killed him. 100% Dany's fault. Very loud and very outspoken. Yronwood isn't as outspoken, but he seems to share the same sentiment. You've missed out the vital part. Quentyn tried to steal the dragons, and they killed him. His death had nothing to do with Dany. If Gerris and Archibald tell the truth then Doran would probably accept that. The problem is that Arianne seems to already blame Dany for Viserys's death, so she will probably blame her for Quentyn's death as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Eater Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 You've missed out the vital part. Quentyn tried to steal the dragons, and they killed him. His death had nothing to do with Dany. If Gerris and Archibald tell the truth then Doran would probably accept that. The problem is that Arianne seems to already blame Dany for Viserys's death, so she will probably blame her for Quentyn's death as well. And Doran may be dead with Arianne as head of House Martell by the time they would arrive. The news of Quentyn's death would kill an already weakened Doran. Arianne may find another death to blame on Dany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 And Doran may be dead with Arianne as head of House Martell by the time they would arrive. The news of Quentyn's death would kill an already weakened Doran. Arianne may find another death to blame on Dany. And Arianne may be already wed to fAegon by that time. So no need for a mad bitch to mess things up, even if Arianne believes the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.