Comics X: The Great Ten

[red snow]

And Undercover has just kept that train running. Everyone acts like an idiot in these books because that's the only way the plot can work.

This is just going to be one of those things that's going to leave me eternally baffled.

I read it all in one go so maybe I didn't have that long to dwell on the plot making zero sense? I really liked the art as well. It could also be me being a sucker for Battle Royale scenarios as well.

So Superior Spider-Man is coming back, but for only a couple issues? I was glad to see the adds for it as I just dropped ASM from my pull list, but it sounds like a "lost" story involving time travel.

This week was pretty decent, everything I got was good. Lazarus, East of West, Thief of Thieves, Moon Knight, and Magneto. Lazarus # 9 I thought was especially good. Really loving this title so far.

Hopefully it's marvel testing the water to see if Superior can still sell? I bet they are wondering if they can pull another Octo-spidey out of that event they have coming up if the market can sustain 3 spider-men.

I agree with Lazarus. Another great issue. LArk's expressions are great - the look on Eve and her trainer when told to fight with real swords. I also liked the bit of world-building with how the church fits in. It's probably my favourite Image book after Saga. Shame it's only every 5 weeks but that's better than those 2 month gaps the other Image books like to have every 6 issues.

[Jon AS]

Gaiman's 1602 is only any good if you want to see your marvel heroes in a period drama. I can't even remember what actually happened in it. I certainly didn't bother with any of the spin-offs that followed the series up.

Okay, having read it I see what you're saying. Beyond the gimmicky premise there's just not a lot there. Rather disappointing, I generally like Gaiman's writing, and this is by far the weakest story of his I've read.

Well, I only paid a couple of bucks for it, so there's no real cause for complaint, I guess. Which reminds me: comics are fucking expensive, how do kids afford this hobby these days? Or is it like with videogames, and the average comic readers/collectors are in their thirties?

Squadron Supreme... well, I have to give it points for the premise, particularly since it came out in the 80s, even before Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns. The basic idea here is that the Squadron Supreme (Marvel's copyright friendly rip-off/homage to DC's Justice League) come together after the world has been plunged into crisis when an alien conqueror mind controlled the president of the United States (who also happened to be Batman Nighthawk) and most of the team to cause havok on a planetary scale. The majority of our heroes decide to essentially put themselves in charge and fix the world. Nighthawk thinks that's a terrible idea and even goes so far as to almost shoot Hyperion with his version of kryptonite (just like Batman, he seems to keep some around just in case; though given the age of this story, the imitation might actually have inspired the original here for all I know). That's the first issue in a 12 part miniseries and things go downhill from there, with the Squadron essentially becoming totalitarian dictators who brook no dissent (and their Green Arrow analogue behaves in a manner that would make pre-island Oliver on Arrow feel ashamed; seriously, this guy should be in jail) and Nighthawk teaming up with various supervillains to oppose them.

So far, so awesome. Sadly the execution isn't all there. Part of it is the style, which seems to harken back to the silver age a bit too much for such a serious plot, and despite the fact that it's clearly a twelve part story, there's a kind of pretense that you could pick up any issue and read it without being familiar with the preceding ones. This of course requires lots of recapping, and contrary to today it's not kept in a cute, out-of-story, one page summary but takes up lots of space of every issue with many flashbacks and "as you know"s.

The characters are also sadly underdeveloped. Some of them have civilian lifes we get to see (Hyperion, interestingly, isn't among them: this story seems firmly in the "Clark Kent is just a disguise for Superman" camp, and he abandons his life as a reporter and his reporter girlfriend right at the beginning, going only by Hyperion from then on), but I never got the impression they were particularly close friends or even knew each all that well despite clearly having been working together for years. So all those divisions that crop up between them don't have that much of an impact.

Still, interesting read, certainly much more enjoyable than 1602.

[Sci-2]

Yeah, I'm really enjoying Gillen as a writer. I think once I'm off my current Marvel and DC trip I should check out some of his original work. Until then, I've got a few evenings without World Cup football to kill and still have some stuff I picked up in sales, like Gaiman's 1602, Nextwave (admittedly I mostly picked that up because of this cover), and Squadron Supreme (since I was in the mood for some superhero deconstruction and I'm now a bit more familiar with the DC heroes this is based on).

I'm liking Wicked and Divine, though it had to be pointed out to me who the gods were - Rihanna, Kanye...can't recall the others...

[Lady Octarina]

Which reminds me: comics are fucking expensive, how do kids afford this hobby these days? Or is it like with videogames, and the average comic readers/collectors are in their thirties?

I'm in my 20s, but I don't drink, so the money I would otherwise spend socializing on bars all goes to comics :cheers:

But, yeah, from what I see, most collectors are on their 30s. Other than that, it's always a good idea to keep an eye open for reduced prices; that's what I do for trades and such. The single issues I have to read the day they're published, I have a neighbor who has the same addiction, so I read some of his and he reads some of mine.

[red snow]

Okay, having read it I see what you're saying. Beyond the gimmicky premise there's just not a lot there. Rather disappointing, I generally like Gaiman's writing, and this is by far the weakest story of his I've read.

Well, I only paid a couple of bucks for it, so there's no real cause for complaint, I guess. Which reminds me: comics are fucking expensive, how do kids afford this hobby these days? Or is it like with videogames, and the average comic readers/collectors are in their thirties?

Gaiman had a go at Eternals which was a little better but still felt a bit like him trying to force his Sandman/american gods trick onto Marvel characters. He just isn't that great a fit with Marvel to be honest but I can see why they tried. In fairness the Batman story he penned a few years back was underwhelming too. He can't be doing them for the money though so I guess he does them as much for himself as anyone else. His creator owned work -especially the prose is still good though. Although I'll probably wait the 3 years it takes to get the Endless trade...

I very much doubt we have many teenage comic readers. If we do they are probably stealing them off the internet or being sensible and reading them through things like Marvel online (where they get loads of comics for not much cash). They have the films, games and cartoons of most the superheroes to entertain them and to be honest a comic is the worst value (a video game, while expensive has many hours of gameplay)

Buying of trades from Amazon etc is a far cheaper way of reading comics if you don't want to go the digital route. you can usually get a 6 issue trade for the price of 2 marvel comics!

[Jon AS]

Gaiman had a go at Eternals which was a little better but still felt a bit like him trying to force his Sandman/american gods trick onto Marvel characters. He just isn't that great a fit with Marvel to be honest but I can see why they tried. In fairness the Batman story he penned a few years back was underwhelming too. He can't be doing them for the money though so I guess he does them as much for himself as anyone else. His creator owned work -especially the prose is still good though. Although I'll probably wait the 3 years it takes to get the Endless trade...

The blurb for the Eternals story at least sounds a lot more Gaimanesque, but I'm not sure if the idea of "ordinary people discover they are in fact extraordinary (and/or part of a world that's much stranger than the general public thinks)" works all that well in the Marvel universe, of all places.

I very much doubt we have many teenage comic readers. If we do they are probably stealing them off the internet or being sensible and reading them through things like Marvel online (where they get loads of comics for not much cash). They have the films, games and cartoons of most the superheroes to entertain them and to be honest a comic is the worst value (a video game, while expensive has many hours of gameplay)

Are there good superhero games besides the Arkham series? I thought most of those were lazy cash-ins? I picked up the Lego Marvel game in the Steam sale, but that was mostly on the strength of other Lego games.

Anyway, Nextwave! It's certainly different. For starters, it has a

. I'm not strictly sure that's the official one, as the URL from the comic doesn't work anymore, but at least those are the lyrics that were printed in the first issue.

It is also pretty damn funny, though not in a particularly cerebral kind of way. I'm not even sure what to classify this as. Affectionate parody, maybe? We have a bunch of people you wouldn't want to hang out with, but they're still heroic and saving the day, the villains are insane and bizarre (if Marvel ever adapts this, they obviously need to cast David Hasselhoff as Dirk Anger, director of H.A.T.E.) and use things like Godzilla-sized dragons and killer dropbears (is that a tautology?) to fight our heroes. The reveal of the ultimate master mind behind the Beyond Corporation© was a laugh out loud moment. Despite all the insanity that preceded it, it managed to up the crazy one more time.

Well, lots of fun, but probably not in continuity with the mainstream Marvel universe, even though the world would be a better place if it was.

[red snow]

Are there good superhero games besides the Arkham series? I thought most of those were lazy cash-ins? I picked up the Lego Marvel game in the Steam sale, but that was mostly on the strength of other Lego games.

I think they are usually passable - it's a long time since I've played a tie in but I thought the game engines for SPidey and the Hulk were decent. The Darkness was apparently realy good The Walking dead games are excellent and I think are possibly the best format of the franchise.

It's probably more the case that there are non-comic superheroes in video games, Most games feature people with super powers or abilities, Also, while it sounds like an old man whining a video game is better value entertainment than a comic book. Out of all my hobbies there's only "going to the cinema" that may be as expensive as "reading a single comic". Even then it loses as it can take 4-6 months to get one story - at least you get the film in 1 go (although the films are sadly becoming more like comics in this respect). A book is far better value as is TV (I can have netflix for a month for the price of 2 comic books.

It simply doesn't add up that the most expensive form of entertainment should be for children who have the least cash.

I buy them because I love the format but it is an expensive hobby to pursue and whenever I have to make cuts it's the past-time that suffers the most.

[Jon AS]

Hm, the Humble Book Bundle features a bunch of comicbooks this week. Most of them look rather terrible, but Green Hornet by Kevin Smith seems like something that could be fun. Has anybody read it?

[red snow]

Hm, the Humble Book Bundle features a bunch of comicbooks this week. Most of them look rather terrible, but Green Hornet by Kevin Smith seems like something that could be fun. Has anybody read it?

Can't really say anything about the quality of any of those books. HAven't really heard anything about them either which could just be because they aren't marvel/DC/Image which is all most of the big sites bother with. I think Bleeding cool may be owned by dynamite so they may get a mention there. Although i think it's avatar press who sponsor bleeding cool as they are always promoting "crossed"

[john]

Haven't read Smith's Green Hornet but the Dynamite pulp strand is generally quite good. Garth Ennis did a run on the Shadow that was decent and remained good after he left.

Well, I only paid a couple of bucks for it, so there's no real cause for complaint, I guess. Which reminds me: comics are fucking expensive, how do kids afford this hobby these days? Or is it like with videogames, and the average comic readers/collectors are in their thirties?

The only real knowledge I have of comic collectors is from the letters pages of various issues and most of the kids that are doing it seem to have parents, usually dads who are into comics and they go to the shop together, with the dad footing the bill.

If kids did want to go the digital route though, as well as it being cheaper generally there's a lot of free issues you can download. Comixology has literally hundreds of free issues available at any one time

[red snow]

Marvel lets you have a lot of stuff for free too. They also let you have access to everything (over 6 months old) for $70 a year which is a bargain to be honest. It probably costs that much to buy a month of Marvel comics.

[Jon AS]

Thanks for the input. I think I'll pass, my pile of unread books is too big already anyway.

[Sci-2]

Avengers #32: There's no story that can't be fucked up by a bunch of extraneous time travel nonsense. Still hoping something interesting happens but seems like Hickman has taken the wind out of his own Incursion threat with all this traveling to the future.

[Nictarion]

Has anyone been reading Deadly Class? The first trade comes out this week and I was considering picking it up but I haven't heard much about it.

[red snow]

"The spread" #1 had gorgeous artwork that reminded me a bit of the work that goes on in "prophet" (the artist may have even worked on that title tbh). The story so far is very generic and is a stockpile of "the thing" "Samurai and cub", "the Road" and even "saga". In fact it directly steals a plot device from "saga" that causes a major eye-roll. So I'm torn, on the one hand the story is not great but on the other the art is amazing. I'll maybe give it a few more issues to see whether the story finds its own voice.

[Lady Octarina]

Avengers #32: There's no story that can't be fucked up by a bunch of extraneous time travel nonsense. Still hoping something interesting happens but seems like Hickman has taken the wind out of his own Incursion threat with all this traveling to the future.

We always disagree on that. I think the only stories that not even time travel can save are those written by Bendis (All-New X-Men after Battle of the Atom. One time too many time travels), everything else, that's always a win. I've enjoyed these Original Sin tie-ins to Hickmanvengers much more than the 28 issues that came before them, which is a first.

Has anyone been reading Deadly Class? The first trade comes out this week and I was considering picking it up but I haven't heard much about it.

It's amazing. It's violent and unbelievable at times, as you'd expect, but this is my favorite of Remender's original stuff so far (compared to Sorrow, The End League, Sea of Red, and Black Science, at least).

[john]

So Thor's getting relaunched as a woman. I don't think I've enjoyed anything of that character solo other than issues from the 60s. Might be intriguing.

[red snow]

So Thor's getting relaunched as a woman. I don't think I've enjoyed anything of that character solo other than issues from the 60s. Might be intriguing.

It'll last 8 months tops. There's no way he'll be a woman by the time Avengers 2 comes out next April. Hardly seems worth bothering for that amount of time - then again it's probably 16 issues given Marvel's publication schedule.

I suspect it's a way to increase the profile of Angela as Marvel is probably realising that no-one besides Todd MacFarlane and Neil Gaiman give a shit about her. She's just been tied into Asgard and there were rumours of a solo-series for her. I suspect this is it.

Although it would be fun if this is the Thorwe know as a woman (he's been a Frog before so this isn't a stretch). He should definitely meet up with Hyperion as the sexual tension between them in the Avengers book was palpable. Then again Hyperion may not be as interested in female Thor. In fact it's best they dodge that bullet entirely - as it will piss a lot of folk.

[john]

Pretty sure the article I read said that he couldn't use the hammer anymore so somebody else takes it up. Angela is the character Gaiman and Macfarlane had a legal battle over? Don't know much about her.

[red snow]

Pretty sure the article I read said that he couldn't use the hammer anymore so somebody else takes it up. Angela is the character Gaiman and Macfarlane had a legal battle over? Don't know much about her.

Just read the guardian article on it and it isn't Thor. It's a new wielder of Mjolnir like you said. I don't get this quote at all "This is not She-Thor. This is not Lady Thor. This is not Thorita. This is THOR. This is the THOR of the Marvel universe. But it's unlike any Thor we've ever seen before." as that to me suggests it is the same person currently called Thor. Or is Thor now just a title like "king" or "duke"? At least when Loki changed he was still Loki but by this logic some other asgardian trickster could claim the title too.

It's almost certainly Angela and the character is more interesting off the page eg legal battles and general spitefulness than anything the character has actually done.