Pink Letter - if Stannis suspects Great Northern Conspiracy, he wrote it

[Lord Damian]

Stannis is outnumbered at Winterfell even if he wins the battle. He is not stupid. He also knows that the Northerners that have sided with him, have only done so for "Ned's little girl". After the sample Theon chapter and perhaps, not a stretch, he might have figured out that this girl is not Ned's. It matters not, I think he wins the battle only to find himself surrounded by Northerners who are not loyal to him, yet not exactly hostile to him, yet. He needs a Stark that owes him fealty to lead them. Rickon may not be there with Davos and Glover which is possbile. He knows Jon has rejected previous offers so he needs to craft a different story to get him to come to Winterfell, the Pink letter. He can tell from Jon's character that he would do such a thing to protect the wall such as venture from it rather than wait for the threat to come to his rear flank as there are no defences to the fortifications from the South. Just a thought.

[sarah.jenice]

Almost anything seems possible in this series at this point. I can't remember though if Stannis knew about Mance going to Winterfell with the fishwives. I thought Mance asked for them without Stannis knowledge but it's been a while since I've read the book.

I still think it was from Ramsay after he was tricked into thinking Stannis is dead after the upcoming Battle of Ice.

[Daemon The Black Dragon]

Let's say you're right and Stannis wrote the letter. What's his plan for Jon when he arrives at WF? Try and force Jon to accept his offer again?

[James Steller]

Let's say you're right and Stannis wrote the letter. What's his plan for Jon when he arrives at WF? Try and force Jon to accept his offer again?

Not to mention Jon will bring yet more soldiers, but worse than Northerners loyal to the Starks, these will be wildlings who are loyal only to Jon. And when Jon finds out that Stannis tricked him into giving up his NW vows and come to Winterfell, he won't be very happy. How will that benefit Stannis at all?

[Lharys]

Interesting idea. If he sends the Pink Letter, he gets Jon and his wildling army and could possibly convince him to become Jon Stark. I'm not sure if Stannis would think it "honorable" to lie like that though. I think it could be Mance who wrote it in order to start an uprising at the Wall. Maybe that way he could become King-Beyond-The-Wall again and march everyone further south.

[Red Wedding Cake]

Winds of Winter

If Stannis did send the pink letter to Jon, why did he also send Tycho Nestoris, Justin Massey, and Jeyne fArya Poole to the wall to bring Jon back his sister?

[dread pirate davos]

I don't think it's in stannis' character to trick a man into oath breaking, especially Jon who gained his respect.

[MyLittleFinger]

I don't think it's in stannis' character to trick a man into oath breaking, especially Jon who gained his respect.

I agree, Stannis isn't beyond subtle subterfuge, but this is the man who got pissed that a "ser" was missing for a person whom he despises and is outright accusing of the highest of abominations. It seems out of his field to me.

[unitron]

We have no way of knowing how much of the letter is true, regardless of who wrote it, but anyone other than Ramsay (and maybe even he as well) has to know that writing the letter is rolling the dice and opening Pandora's munitions dump and toxic waste depository, because they can't know for sure how Jon is going to react, much less anyone else who hears the contents.

[aryagonnakill#2]

Stannis does not seem like a logical candidate. I feel there are 3 people with reasons and knowledge to write the letter the way they did.

First is Ramsay, the letter can be entirely true or more likely he could think that Stannis is dead and defeated when really only the Freys were. Mance was in WF when Theon escaped so he is either hiding, glamored as someone else somehow, or in fact being flayed by Ramsay. In the case of the latter Ramsay has all the info in the letter.

Second is Mance, as has been pointed out by others in different threads a lot of what is requested by Mance has the potential to benefit him. If the wildlings find him alive they may very well follow his orders giving him an army, and he gets his family out of the hands of Mel and co.

Last is Asha, who would be acting out of a desperate desire to save her brother. The thinking here would be to get Jon who grew up with Theon to winterfell, and keep Theon alive to winterfell as well. When there Jon has his wildling army and potentially the loyalty of the northmen much more so than Stannis has, essentially making Jon in charge of Theons fate. Then she would be betting on Jon letting him take the black or allowing him to be used to seat Asha on the seastone chair, once Jon learns of Rickon and brans survival, which he will immediately believe because of his wolf dreams and encounter with Summer.

If Stannis won the battle at the lake he has no reason to call on Jon, presumably he would know that manderly and other northmen who are already inside Winterfell are ready to help from the inside, so bringing all those wildlings down is just asking for trouble. Also as others have said, Stannis aint no lier.

[Stannis's Lawyer]

Last is Asha, who would be acting out of a desperate desire to save her brother. The thinking here would be to get Jon who grew up with Theon to winterfell, and keep Theon alive to winterfell as well. When there Jon has his wildling army and potentially the loyalty of the northmen much more so than Stannis has, essentially making Jon in charge of Theons fate. Then she would be betting on Jon letting him take the black or allowing him to be used to seat Asha on the seastone chair, once Jon learns of Rickon and brans survival, which he will immediately believe because of his wolf dreams and encounter with Summer.

1. Asha doesn't know Jon's personality.

2. Asha doesn't know about Mance

[aryagonnakill#2]

^ Theon says he told Asha "everything", and Theon talked to "Abel" for a long time. The possibility is there, not saying its what happened just that its 1 of the possibilities.

[James Steller]

^ Theon says he told Asha "everything", and Theon talked to "Abel" for a long time. The possibility is there, not saying its what happened just that its 1 of the possibilities.

I hope it's not true that the pesky iron born are still making havoc in the North. It's literally the last thing the North needs right now.

[Winter'sFallen]

I'm starting to believe that if it wasn't Ramsey with significant embellishment, then the Pink Letter was written by Mel & somehow handed to Clydas, rather than by raven. That would explain his reaction & need to be sent to bed better than just reading a message. Mel has been desperate to get Jon to trust her completely & who else would/could know of all of the particulars of the whole letter. Earlier in the chapter she tells Jon to look to the skies & then come see her, but to our knowledge he makes his plans with Tormund, not Mel after he receives the letter. There has been much speculation about what she is doing on the Wall in the first place, but it seems clear to me that Jon has become integral to her plans, but he is refusing to "cooperate". Then when he plans to assault Ramsey at WF for his claims in the letter, she uses the NW that are unhappy with him to stage the coup, I expect that she will be a big part of his "survival" assuming he does, in order to gain his trust, even though she's likely part of his stabbing as well.

[Batbob45]

Asha doesn't know Stannis' family or Jon Snow

Mel could to create some chaos at the wall

Ramsey- If he wrote the letter, it was tame by his standards(he didn't even call Stannis family any evil names)

Mance could of wrote it

Stannis might of wrote it

Roose chance that he wrote the letter is bigger than theory that Stannis wrote it

[Lord Damian]

If Robb, who was a king could pardon and claim Jon to be something other than a Nights watch member, so could King Stannis. Get him away from the wall and his "duty" use the emotional bond with going "home" and let that play on him. Other Northern lords looking at Jon pleading with him to take it as they will only want to serve a Stark and not a Baratheon. Hey, Stannis is at the North's mercy from a certain point of view, he has to try something.

[Lord Damian]

Winds of Winter

If Stannis did send the pink letter to Jon, why did he also send Tycho Nestoris, Justin Massey, and Jeyne fArya Poole to the wall to bring Jon back his sister?

How do we know they made it to the wall? the battle was about to begin when he dispatched them. They might have been lost or killed.

[Hand to King Davos]

I don't think it's in stannis' character to trick a man into oath breaking, especially Jon who gained his respect.

:agree: :agree: :agree:

[MacReady]

I think Rickon is Stannis' ace in the hole, even if he doesn't know it yet. He thinks Davos is dead, but Davos is going to retrieve Rickon from Skagos and bring him back and I don't think Davos is foolish enough to deliver him directly to Manderly. Instead after the battle ends, with the North having reclaimed Winterfell, I think Davos will smuggle Rickon to Stannis and Stannis will make his terms there.

Plus, despite what some people think, I just can't imagine the North immediately abandoning Stannis after Winterfell is retaken. They are gonna wanna take out the Frey's too and yeah there is a portion of the Frey army at Winterfell, but the old man himself is still at the Twins. The North remembers and their revenge won't be completely until they go back to the Twins.

[Good Guy Garlan]

How do we know they made it to the wall? the battle was about to begin when he dispatched them. They might have been lost or killed.

He still sent them to the Wall, though, hoping they would make it there. As in, he willingly gave his biggest bargaining chip to Jon.

And If he wanted Jon to come to Winterfell why didn't he write "I have your damn sister and I'm going to torture her until you show up, bastard" instead of "I want my bride back", which suggests he doesn't have her in the first place