(Spoilers) Once Upon a Time (the Third)

[Theda Baratheon]

Finally caught up and so glad I did. This show is INSANE and I am ashamed it took me so long but I am now completely on board the Swan Queen ship. Regina and Emma so obviously love and care for each other it's not even funny anymore and I used to love Robin and Hook but I realized...they're just so...LAME.

[Elba the Intoner]

Ok, I am caught up; surprised none of the regulars have commented yet, what with a 2 hour season finale.

I'll keep it brief:

I was disappointed in the alternate reality. When Isaac said that villains get to win and heroes lose, I expected to see the likes of Rumple winning as villains. Instead it was just a reversal of roles. And Rumple's armor was stupid.

However, I did like the end of the finale, especially the scene with Rumple and Belle. And I guess I should have seen it coming that Emma would turn into Venom The Dark One.

I laughed at the reveal that The Sorcerer = Merlin.

This makes it pretty clear that Lily's dad is King Arthur; his last name is Pendragon, hello! Too bad Lancelot is dead, I think. He would have been the connection to that realm.

Does this mean Disney is prepping for an Arthurian movie?

I'm kinda confused on how much influence Isaac really had on the whole real story. Since he only became the author in 1966, but centuries passed in the EF for some of the characters, how much did he affect? I guess he affected Maleficent's life and the Charmings. Oh well, it's one of those things.

I am glad Henry got to do important stuff, and he put to use some of the stuff he learned from the adults: sword fighting (sort of), sailing (sort of), etc. And he did go Harry Potter there and destroyed the most powerful quill in existence.

And last, but not least, lol at the Star Wars reference. That was well done. Disney, never shying away from Easter eggs. I expect "I have a bad feeling about this" next season.

It took me a while to get caught up too as I didn't get to watch the finale until two days ago. Anyway, I loved the finale! I liked how they brought back a few cast members, if only briefly, like August and Blackbeard (would have liked to have seen even more of them), and I thought the role reversals of the heroes and villains was very fitting. Once Isaac said he could no longer be the author I had a feeling that Henry would become the next one. That was believable too.

Interesting idea about Arthur being Lilly's likely father. I was trying to think of another dragon fairytale where they could delve into for a father for Lilly and couldn't come up with anything.

Regarding this question about "how much influence Isaac really had on the whole real story. Since he only became the author in 1966, but centuries passed in the EF for some of the characters, how much did he affect? I guess he affected Maleficent's life and the Charmings." My take on it is that he was the last in a long line of authors before him who started the stories and but then he abused his power and changed things to make the heroes do questionable things rather than continuing the stories properly.

I can't believe I missed the Star Wars reference! Nice one! I am a big fan too and I just completely forgot that Kashyyyk is the name of the Wookie home planet. Well, they are getting ready for the new Star Wars film in the Fall so might as well start throwing in references wherever they can. I'll have to pay attention to other ABC shows to see if they do something similar. And I would love to hear one of the OUAT characters utter "I have a bad feeling about this", or as an alternative, "Never tell me the odds." :-)

[Tijgy]

Because my post "disappeared" and to bump the thread: 

I did not really liked last night episode. So this will be a lot of ranting (and a little raving on Rumple and a little on Zelena. 

First of all, the timeline makes really no sense anymore. 1000 years ago Merlin got his magic from the holy grail. 200 years ago the first Dark One was created but … is our sweet Rumple not 200/300 years old? So the 200 years should be a typo.

I think then someone mentions Merlin exists for 500 years, when he met Nimue. So (1000-500) then should the “Dark One” exists for 500 years: 200-300 years with Rumple as it’s best friend and 200-300 as the other Dark One hosts’ BFF, f.e. Zoso. So this actually means Rumple was his longest best friend and the other ones were replaced each 10 or 20 years (looking at the DO group in DS’s dungeon.

Congrats, Rumple, my dearie, you win the price for most longest friend of the black ink substance. Your self preservation keeps surprising me. (And you are still my favorite. First One, you are my second).

And really, the hero group is useless. Last week (in the future), you trust shady Arthur. Luckily for you, Arthur did fail his magic mushroon 101 (they are not destroyed by fire). But now you are trusting Zelena (played by the amazing Rebecca Madler   - sorry that I keep repeating my love for her)? Oh look, the wicked witch betrayed you by using Snow’s insecurities about pregnancy and babies against her. And she is consorting with Arthur? Shit, now you cannot even rely on the fact that Arthur should have payed more attention during his magic classes. Zelena can help with that. She was actually Rumple’s most talented student who could have really go far if she did not loved her master and turned green. (However, Arthur actually did surprise with his talent in potion making. Scary!) However I think Zelena should actually not be able to tether Merlin …

But if this was GOT, those heroes should have been death. Regina, you should be smarter than that. They should really need someone who has a master in manipulation/scheming/… (looking at Rumple dearest). Or sometimes I think at least Henry has a knack for it. Maybe they should have involved him? Or is this a way to say: they are useless without Emma to help them. (I must say however it is actually just the presence of Emma who ensures the good happy ending because IMO more than 50% Emma is not the main person who saved them. However she is always credited with it?)

(Okay, I must be honest. There is something wrong with me. I am actually more cheering for Arthur and Zelena than the heroes’ gang. I don’t know why. Maybe I love to hate Zelena? I feel sorry for Arthur because he was lied to by a tree? Or I just love the villains more. No idea)

This whole origin of the Dark One & Emma as DO is making me really confused.

I loved how they used the Holy Grail as the origin of Merlin’s and the DO’s powers. But still it raises the question: is the price you pay for the magic of the HG not really cheap? You become the most powerful sorcerer in the worlds. The price Merlin payed was the typical price for immortality. But you actually pay that even if you do not have that much powers and you are just immortal. Or maybe it was just the fact he has to be goody shoes for eternity? What did he actually do during those 500(? or who know how many) years? Was he obliged to stay at the same place for eternity so it would stay green? But what reason did he have to stay there? Why would you be interested in fertilizing that spot for the world? It is not like that in the beginning there was a group of people hungry/thirsty. They probably came after Merlin fertilized that place?

And Merlin can see the future. But Rumple’s seer powers came from killing the seer (Rumples, you are a psychopath. Okay, this murder was more an euthanization/hulp with suicide but still Rumple… why do you keep doing this? O wait…). So you get only the ability to see the future if you are not the Dark One? Nice to know.

I liked Nimue. I am little conflicted about how she became the Dark One. I do like how she was interested in immortality. But why did she went from revenge with flowers to killing in one minute? Was it the power rush? What is the difference between Merlin getting his powers and Nimue getting her? Was it become Merlin drunk from the grail because he was thirsty and she wanted to get the power? Why did friend of Merlin turn into dust and Nimue did not? To be honest, I think using excalibur/holy grail is just playing some sort of Russian Roulette. But this does not really make any sense? Or is holy grail/excalibur superficial and looks how hot the person his user is? (Okay, Kay is not that ugly so that actually falsifies my theory)

Like you see, I have huge problems with Merlin and his powers. He is just too perfect? You would think his powers made him more conflicted, …? But that really did not happen. He does however manipulates young children and makes them confused about riddles. Is that not an evil act?

And why is Emma not sparkly/green? Nimue was already green, when she became the DO # 1. And her evil list consists of killing guy who is into mass murder and maybe manipulating Merlin, the favorite of the gods (to be honest, my theory is now that the gods just have the hots for him)? Rumple’s dark acts before becoming DO consists of arceny (you know of the castle whose boss was stealing children) and killing Zoso - after he was manipulated by the Dark One.

And Emma’s? Okay, she maybe did not kill someone when she became the Dark One. However she did killed Cruella. Maybe this was mitigated because she believed Henry was in danger - partly because she was manipulated by the DO? (I never understood this idea) but was it because her heart was completely free from any darkness (neglecting of course the fact this was the result of her parents’ darkest act - hurting an innocent baby)? And apparently ripping a child heart out of a chest is not really bad and enslaving her is not so bad.

Maybe it is because she not gave truly into the darkness? Or maybe she does not become sparkly because the gods also have the hots for her? I vote for the last  

And what are those Dark Ones now? Are they just hallucinations created by the corruption inside her? Or are they really a representation of the different dark ones in history? Is she having hallucinations/delusions or is she starting to have a multiple personality disorder?

Probably the last because that actually explains the fact Dark!Rumple gave her advice on being the Dark One in the first episodes. And I can hear Rumple say that he thinks it is important because it is a historical event. He always had a liking for the rare things.

But does that mean she knows everything that they know? Not really, because she did not know Nimue was the first Dark One? I actually hopes not. A Dark One does not know directly all magic? There were stuff Rumple did not know. So this means she has not the access to Rumples knowledge of magic?

Some people (on tumbler, etc.) are saying that she is here manipulating the DOs and is actually working against them? Can she really lie to them? They are inside their mind. Would they not hear her thinking: I am going to snuff the light?

And to end (this rant) I think Nimue does not really change her peptalk: “If you do not kill him now, you are going to be powerless. (…) It is power to protect yourself and your loved ones” and then she says something about being nothing. And, eum, Emma was not really into having power to protect herself and her family? She was more upset she had power/magic than she had none?

…

Is this the peptalk you used to say to poor Rumples? Because it actually more fits him than Emma. While Emma had some issues, they could not really compare to his selfhatred, his need for power to protect his himself and his family, … Rumples would believe you in one second but it does not really fit Emma. Nimue, you should change your peptalk.

What I am now interested of course is, did poor Rumbles hear those voices? Might it explain his evil acts in season four? Will they enlighten us about him this season?

And I missed of course Belle, Mr. Gold and Rumbelle, Really, all those flashbacks in flashbacks are getting irritating

[Warg Arry]

Life has been a bit crazy. But I'm still watching and reading the thread when I get a chance.

So ep 8

It's got to be some kind of ploy right? I'm not a huge fan of the CaptainSwan ship. It's grown on me enough that I no longer feel annoyed by it. Sometime they even have some sweet moments.

But

The whole time (at least back at Storybrooke.) Killian has been a dark one. And he has been on the - "I love Emma! I must save her from the darkness.  Cause I feel like I'm the only one that actually cares.. And Our future will be awesomsauce together. Look I'll jump off a building to find you Emma." - War path.

Switch to. Get memories. Find out Emma kept him from dying by making him a dark one because "My future is with you!" And he is like "Oh, I was trying to stop you from doing dark deeds. But, I've been a dark one like, this whole time? And, like I told you I'm a weak ass bad guy who struggles with temptation. Fuck you Emma, I'll turn on you now."

Yeah it doesn't work for me. I guess there was the cut away, after that roofy kiss. So it's plausible that they are involved in a larger game plan. And could work out neatly. Still its a... Twisty tale of holes and logic leaps. Maybe that's a bit harsh.

*shrugs*

 

Ep 9
It was a bit like Feast for Crows. The story was interesting/enjoyable enough. But It didn't really follow the story and people I'm actually interested in and need closure on.

But other than it being a bit rapid and jumpy. And was only sort of connected to the main plot.
It wasn't bad. Reintroduces characters we have missed for a bit. An item that may come into play.
And places one of them back into the current story arc. In a yet to be revealed how. Type way. So I see why it exists and how it works in the bigger picture. It just wasn't what I wanted the episode to be.
Am I the only one?

[Corvinus85]

Life has been a bit crazy. But I'm still watching and reading the thread when I get a chance.

So ep 8

It's got to be some kind of ploy right? I'm not a huge fan of the CaptainSwan ship. It's grown on me enough that I no longer feel annoyed by it. Sometime they even have some sweet moments.

But

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Ep 9
It was a bit like Feast for Crows. The story was interesting/enjoyable enough. But It didn't really follow the story and people I'm actually interested in and need closure on.

But other than it being a bit rapid and jumpy. And was only sort of connected to the main plot.
It wasn't bad. Reintroduces characters we have missed for a bit. An item that may come into play.
And places one of them back into the current story arc. In a yet to be revealed how. Type way. So I see why it exists and how it works in the bigger picture. It just wasn't what I wanted the episode to be.
Am I the only one?

I just watched them and came here to post much of the same thing.

I liked Ep 8 for the intensity and the twist, but I agree with you on what Hook did at the end.

 And I'm not sure what happened to Merlin. He was un-tethered from Excalibur, but did that result in his destruction, or what?

I also thought Ep 9 was good, in particular for the return of two beloved characters. I hope we get to see more of them again. And I liked it because Merida needed her due episode. But yes, it didn't really advance the plot at all. And the one "big" reveal about it was something that I'm pretty sure everyone here knew.

 Arthur was the one who killed Merida's father. I don't mind for Arthur being the villain, but so far he just comes across as a giant douche. They haven't done a good enough job to flesh out the character.

Also kudos to ABC for managing to squeeze this episode in with ep. 8, because they're skipping next week. For anyone watching The Walking Dead, you all know how these kinds of episodes can kill momentum.

[Tijgy]

Spoilers of episode 10:  

I am really sad about last episode. While I understand Belle's decision to end finally(?) their relationship, I still feel sorry for Rumple. 

Dark Hook is amazing as Dark One (In ten episodes Dark Swan did not win me over). What is the plan of those dark ones? What are they going to do? 

The most amazing moments: 

• When Rumple mentioned they should look at Dark One Chronicles, I loved the reference to the scholarmanship (Look how much Rumple and Belle are alike? They both appreciate books )
• Zelena's "little greenbean" (why the hell do I actually like here? Rebecca is amazing)
• Rumple won from Hook and he refused to fight with magic
• Emma's face when Rumple said he was going to fight with honor. He probably never watched Game of Thrones . But it is important for him he did chose magic to fight him. 
• Emma and Henry were also nice together
• I finally liked Emma's and Killian's scene together. They were finally interesting

RIP Merlin by the way

I still makes no sense how Killian was the DO without knowing. Really weird!

[Corvinus85]

OK, the winter finale had the feels, but in true Disney magical fashion, it decided to make some U-turns, and the sequence of events was kinda off.

• So Hook died a "hero" but you know, lets bring him back. Can't have a character stay dead. At least this seems to lead to an interesting second part of the season with the gang going to the Underworld Storybrooke to rescue him. I would like to think that this is will be done with a mind towards Greek mythology, the tale of Orpheus in particular, but considering Disney's other property and Hook's profession, it might be closer to the bring-Jack-Sparrow-back plot. Shudders
• Rumple, Rumple, Rumple! He's back!!! And that's awesome, but the way he got back was very weird.  For all you Star Wars experts, he basically pulled a Darth Bane. (It's really hard for me to stop bringing Star Wars references into this)
• Back to Rumple - I'm confused as to how he got a new dagger, I'm guessing it's simply a prerequisite of DOs to be tied to something, a dagger, because that's how Nimue did it. And I'm not sure why he had to join the gang in their underworld adventure.
• Speaking of Nimue, what happened to Merlin's message that Nimue is the key to defeating the darkness. Will that come into play still or has that been forgotten in the writers' purgatory?
• The way Regina got rid off Zelena was weak; I suppose the writers decided to put the Zelena-baby plot on hold until they get Hook back.

Regarding Arthur - I said it before, but I'll repeat - I thought he was a weak character. Didn't mind his bad side, but there was not enough development (yet). Lancelot and Guinevere, as well, were just thrown around in there for convenience. I need to see the Knights of the Round Table in their full might and glory. On the other hand, I liked Merida. I hope to see her return; same for Mulan and Ruby; and there's Maleficent and her daughter - there's still plenty of stuff to explore there, like who's the father. Nor Arthur, as I originally thought, but maybe Uther? 

 

[Tijgy]

OK, the winter finale had the feels, but in true Disney magical fashion, it decided to make some U-turns, and the sequence of events was kinda off.

 

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Okay, my feelings of the episode of tonight. I actually complain a lot. The most important is actually I do not understand how and when Rumple did what he did? 

I actually do no understand how Rumple became the DO? When did he do it? Before he knew Belle would return? I am completely in shock. I am actually dislike Rumple for the moment (and this while I absolutely love him). And he deceived Belle again and had sex with her. And why is he doing it? Only for the power? So all his stuff about world domination was true in season four? I really do not get it! I am actually upset

I really do not understand how he did it or the chronology of this. At which moment did he became DO again?

Okay, I do understand why they wanted Rumple the DO. I mean Mr. Gold had to have his sneaky attitude. It is kind of amazing how he managed again to let fall everything into his favour. 

But still, what was the point of this story line? To get Dark Swan for a few episodes who actually do not have this affliction any more in the finale? And a Killian obsessed with revenge which we already had in season two? 

Even before the moment (which I am so upset with), the finale felt disjoined. Colin's and JMO's acting felt really off. I never really liked JMO acting as the Dark Swan but I liked Colin as the DO. However whole this finale I really disliked them except Colin in the scene with Hook and Gold. Robert Carlyle's scenes were amazing (or maybe I am just biased) like always. He was in real tears when he said goodbye to her! That was not played so when did he decided to become a DO?  The rest of the cast was good especially Lana! The only scenes I liked were Regina's scenes, the two scenes with Rumple and Belle before I knew Rumple DOnd himself again (and now he cannot say he did not know the consequences!) and the scene in which Rumple talked about hell was well acted by the one and only Robert Carlyle.

Still, I do not know why they included this arc. They did not dare to turn Dark Swan so dark you would conflicted about to hate her. Hook acted suddenly for few days weird but then you have Rumple as DO again? Zelena baby was born and Zelena got banished. Henry got a girlfriend for few moments. Did anything else happen except for the few speeches of Rumple who did undo them in this episode? 

O yes, what those kiss scenes with Hook and Emma and a lot of romantic blabla between them.

Sorry for the ranting! I just miss Rumple from the earlier episodes. The lizard wizard who he is complex but still do thing because he loves his son and Belle even if those things are completely wrong. Now he really do things for power itself even when he is not cursed for no other reason he wants to have power? Really, I can actually not even understand his actions. 

I mean they undid all his character development of Rumple. He chose to fight without magic, he thought about Merida's heart, ...  I just think they do not know how to write an OUAT without a dark Rumple. 

[Tijgy]

I rewatched the scene and

he did it when Emma asked the sword. So he would actually take advantage of Emma's death? Bad, bad Rumple (or why did you not succeed? Still she is your grandson's mother. I am already less angry at him. Still weird storytelling. 

O no, next part of the season it will be "Let save Hook  and some more Emma and Hook romance. 

[HexMachina]

Oh, it's mid-season end already? Shame. We get that episode on Wednesday. 

Caught up otherwise, and I have to say this show lends itself much better to binge watching that week-to-week viewing. Less time to dwell on the silliness, inconsistency, WTF character moments etc. 

Land where the hell is Lily. We were promised Lily. I WANT Lily! 

Other than that, not really a lot to add. Merida has been great, probably the highlight of the season for me. What the show really needs to do though is start dropping some of the characters, whether by killing them off or just writing them out somehow. They have way too many characters ongoing, and they have them spring up every so often and it makes me think; wait who are you again? Why do I care?

i always liked Swan and Hook together btw, so I didn't mind that bit. What I did find a bit funny was how little Henry appeared. Nothing to go off here but a gut feeling, but I suspect as he's grown older, the actor has decided he wants out of the role if he can.

[HexMachina]

So, watched the final, which was probably my least favourite episode of the show to date, just completely underwhelming in everyway. Though in true OUAT fashion, they had everyone revert to the position they were in before this season started, eliminatinall character growth  To which I say, brilliant, because it means Rumple as the Dark One again...although I did enjoy Hook as the Dark one, I have to say.

Dont know why they even bothered with Arthur, or Nimue. So pointless. 

Looked up to see when 5B starts and caught a few spoilers for next season

We get the return of characters like Cora, Cruella, etc. Presumably this happens in the underworld, and is temporary. (Fingers crossed)

We get Hercules and Meg (Yay, one of my favourite Disney films!)

We get an LGBT relationship.

5B will include the 100th episode

[Tijgy]

About Rumple as the Dark One, I was actually sad we might not see him anymore at the beginning of the season. Because he is just ... interesting. I had amazing fun with the Rumple as the Dark One Voice. He was actually the best character of the last episodes. This scene is my favorite scene with Emma and Killian because there is crocodile being a third wheel.

So in one way I am happy to see him as the Dark One except of course it looks like his entire growth of the last episodes did disappear. I could finally root for my favorite character because he was making some good choices. I cannot really root for him when he is planning to murder someone or deceiving Belle.  

(I am almost over it) but I am really upset they made it look like Rumple just wanted to have power. In the interviews they say Rumple actually took it because he was very sad Belle left him and because he was afraid to go to the underworld which is not a nice place. (Just bad writing). 

About 5B spoilers: 

I am not that excited about Meg/Herc but more about Hades. He was an amazing "villain". 

We are even getting Pan and Milah back. 

[Tijgy]

I just heard some exciting news/spoilers about season 5B: 

Spoiler

Neal is coming back or at least for one of more(?) episodes . Exciting. I am especially excited for what will happen between him and Rumple

 

[Theda Baratheon]

15 hours ago, Tijgy said:

I just heard some exciting news/spoilers about season 5B: 

  Reveal hidden contents

Neal is coming back or at least for one of more(?) episodes . Exciting. I am especially excited for what will happen between him and Rumple

 

I hope it's a flash back because if not then....what the hell. I'll just be annoyed and even more exasperated with this show. 

[HexMachina]

23 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said:

I hope it's a flash back because if not then....what the hell. I'll just be annoyed and even more exasperated with this show. 

Hm? Did you catch up on the latest season? I only ask because it's fairly obvious where he will crop up after the final episode!

they are going into the underworld after Hook, so expect many previously dead characters to return, at least for brief appearances...like, Cora, for example...

[Tijgy]

Spoiler

Why I would understand they would not be able to get the actor return for an episode/some episodes, I actually would be very mad if they would let the blind witch return and not Neal ... whose existence is actually the reason why everything happened. 

If Neal did not exist, there would no reason for Rumple's actions and we all know 90% of everything in the show happened because Rumple wanted it to happen. 

Neal is very important character. 

 

I am really happy 

[Theda Baratheon]

4 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Hm? Did you catch up on the latest season? I only ask because it's fairly obvious where he will crop up after the final episode!

 

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Oh, D'oh! O course....

[HexMachina]

1 hour ago, Theda Baratheon said:

Oh, D'oh! O course....

 i wasnt sure if you had watched since the Ursula/Maleficent/Cruella storyline or not. 

 

[Theda Baratheon]

48 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

 i wasnt sure if you had watched since the Ursula/Maleficent/Cruella storyline or not. 

 

Yeah I watched it lol just forgot

[Tijgy]

And the new arc started. I think it was a very good start. 

My thoughts on last night's episodes. 

Spoiler

. I am really happy the entire focus was on characters we know and love. The only new important character was Hades and he only turned up in the last scene. Jeey!! And I am totally on Rumple’s team which of course consists only of one malevolent imp. 

I loved the fact it was Regina-centric. She (and Lana Parilla) certainly deserves it to be the center of this arc (and I hope she will). 

I am happy the focus was more on family than romantic relationships (Regina, her parents, Henry and a little Snow, Pan and Rumple, ...) Regina’s and Henrys’ scene was very lovely and it was also kind of more Henry Sr. redemption because we saw him finally standing up against Cora. Go Henry.

Henry looking for his father was also very nice. Also nice to see Neal again but I am actually wanted to have him a scene with Rumple or Henry. And Emma lied or at least sort of. She asked Rumple not change the future so he could save him. And now Emma saved Hook once already with very bad results and now she is doing it again. So Emma, you sort of lied to Neal (and maybe also to yourself?). She is kind of a dick not to tell Henry she saw Neal and that Neal asked about Henry. (I can understand she is angry at Rumple and that is the reason why she doesnt tell him his son is happy) But yeah, then she must probably admit Neal warned her not to do this shit.   

And I did not like Morrison’s acting. Does she really intend to be as stiff as she was when she was Dark Swan. Does she do that to show Emma is darker? Or is it just bad acting?  

Poor Hook

And did Jiminy really had to be in Snow’s cleavage? What? 

The Rumbelle scene could have been longer but the “Come back to me” “I always do” was for me the top moment of the episode. 

LOL, Pan really told the truth when he said the heroes are not Rumple’s friends. I am proud of Rumple he said no to Pan. Go Rumple! Pan was actually very honest here I think. I want to built a life together but I want to get out of here. A little caring for Rumple but he is still selfish. And here is a little gift of your father. Oh, how nice. And the most funny thing is that Rumple and Pan are actually the only ones who contributed to the mission Get Hook Back. Haha. It is amazing to have Robbie Kay back on the show. I hope he will be in a lot of episodes. 

And Rumple was just amazing. Your questions are pointless! Let do this quickly and get out of here! I am out of this team. I am more efficient when I play alone. Here I found something to get your pirate back. Na, you can do that alone. Oh, the deal only consisted of getting your pirate back and nothing more. I’m out. LOL. Yeah, blackmailing people is not really the good way to get people on your side Emma. It is also kind of dark how you are using Belle. I can understand you want to use Rumple but … why do you need to involve Belle? Sigh.