Rhaegar and Elia relationship

[Blazfemur]

SEriously what is Darkstar's purpose?

to reveal and unveil that aegon is a sham, obviously.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

how awesome would it be, imagine:

Rhaegar + Elia, IS Aegon, HOWEVER, it's later revealed, that Elia due to her dornish horniness CHEATED on Rhaegar with someone ELSE, and Aegon is actually half Martell and half whomever.

It would be SO awesome, that it actually IS the kid from way back when, switched, and STILL is a fake.

That my friends, is how you write a proper (f)Aegon twist.

No, no, no. You have this all wrong. It's Rhaenys who isn't Rhaegar's. She has the Dornish coloring so no one knew, but Elia had a wild fling with that stud Bobby Baratheon. THAT is why Rhaegar took up with Lyanna. Pure revenge and teaching that hound dog a lesson.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

SEriously what is Darkstar's purpose?

Ser "of the night?" My bet is Night's King 2.0 with Val as his queen.

[Blazfemur]

No, no, no. You have this all wrong. It's Rhaenys who isn't Rhaegar's. She has the Dornish coloring so no one knew, but Elia had a wild fling with that stud Bobby Baratheon. THAT is why Rhaegar took up with Lyanna. Pure revenge and teaching that hound dog a lesson.

lmao. SOMEBODY GIVE DARKSTAR A PURPOSE OR A REASON TO EVEN TAKE UP PAGE SPACE

Ser "of the night?" My bet is Night's King 2.0 with Val as his queen.

oh..

[Cat of the Rivers]

to reveal and unveil that aegon is a sham, obviously.

So basically he's Howland Reed?

No, no, no. You have this all wrong. It's Rhaenys who isn't Rhaegar's. She has the Dornish coloring so no one knew, but Elia had a wild fling with that stud Bobby Baratheon. THAT is why Rhaegar took up with Lyanna. Pure revenge and teaching that hound dog a lesson.

Thank you for opening my eyes! I've been so blind!

Ser "of the night?" My bet is Night's King 2.0 with Val as his queen.

Or maybe he's the reincarnated form of Brandon the Builder. Warning those about the Long Night to happen since the Age of Heroes.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

To put this thread back on track...

...I suppose that after the Tourney of Harrenhall, once Rhaegar spent all of his money there, Elia told him to leave Dragonstone, and that's why he had to go to the infamous Tower of Joy.

[Wmarshal]

To put this thread back on track...

...I suppose that after the Tourney of Harrenhall, once Rhaegar spent all of his money there, Elia told him to leave Dragonstone, and that's why he had to go to the infamous Tower of Joy.

Please don't flag me for fanfic, i couldn't resist.

Elia: "Didn't i tell you we needed the money for the baby food?"

Rhaegar: "Hey. Chill, can't we just feed him porridge?"

Elia: "The maester said he had a sensitive stomach, go ask your dad for it."

Rhaegar: " You know we are not talking."

Elia: " Oh sorry, i couldn't notice by how much you stared at the teenager's ass."

Rhaegar: " One: that was months ago. Two: This practically medieval times, did we invent the word teenager?"

Elia: "Don't back talk me, how about you and Arthur just go touring again and sing your emo songs to pre teens, gods, how did I fall for it."

Rhaegar: " Know what find! I will do just that! Don't try to call, I am leaving my maester here."

[Cat of the Rivers]

Please don't flag me for fanfic, i couldn't resist.

Elia: "Didn't i tell you we needed the money for the baby food?"

Rhaegar: "Hey. Chill, can't we just feed him porridge?"

Elia: "The maester said he had a sensitive stomach, go ask your dad for it."

Rhaegar: " You know we are not talking."

Elia: " Oh sorry, i could tell by how much you stared at the teenager's ass."

Rhaegar: " One: that was months ago. Two: This i practically medieval times, did we invent the word teenager?"

Elia: "Don't backtalk me, how about you and Arthur just go touring again and sing your emo songs to pre teens, gods, how did I fall for it."

Rhaegar: " Know what find! I will do just that! Don't try to call, I am leaving my maester here."

:lmao:

[Lady Blizzardborn]

Per new information:

According to TWOIAF Rhaegar did not leave his wife and kids with his crazy father. They were living on Dragonstone. Aerys summoned them to court later. So Rhae Rhae had every reason to believe they were safe when he took off.

[Ser Eric]

Per new information:

According to TWOIAF Rhaegar did not leave his wife and kids with his crazy father. They were living on Dragonstone. Aerys summoned them to court later. So Rhae Rhae had every reason to believe they were safe when he took off.

Safe with a madman who raped his mother? I think not.

[The Red Widow of Coldmoat]

Safe with a madman who raped his mother? I think not.

Did you even read what you quoted?

Rhaegar left Elia and the kids on Dragonstone when he went off with Lyanna. Aerys wasn't exactly known for leaving the Red Keep - at all - in that time frame. It was a big deal when he left the Red Keep to go to Harrenhal and there's no reference to him leaving at all afterwards

As to the thread topic, maybe Elia was just disappointed that she and Rhaegar and Lyanna never got to complete the three-headed dragon, so to speak

[Ser Eric]

Did you even read what you quoted?

Rhaegar left Elia and the kids on Dragonstone when he went off with Lyanna. Aerys wasn't exactly known for leaving the Red Keep - at all - in that time frame. It was a big deal when he left the Red Keep to go to Harrenhal and there's no reference to him leaving at all afterwards

As to the thread topic, maybe Elia was just disappointed that she and Rhaegar and Lyanna never got to complete the three-headed dragon, so to speak

My bad. I misread it.

That said, he could have still done something about the situation when he returned to the red keep.

[Anath]

My bad. I misread it.

That said, he could have still done something about the situation when he returned to the red keep.

No, you weren't quite wrong. He left them at Dragonstone where they were so safe that Aerys clearly didn't have any trouble taking them to KL.

Not too hard to think of, actually: Dragonstone is only safe as the royal fleet guards it. And guess what? The Master of Ships was Aerys' man.

Still, he didn't leave them directly with Aerys. Just within Aerys' reach and under Aerys' dislike since Aerys had already proclaimed distaste for Rhaenys in Rhaegar's presence, Dornishmen at court were considered Rhaegar's people, and Elia was said to be an equal participant in Rhaegar's decision to live at Dragonstone which in turn furthered the rumours that he was trying to depose Aerys.

And yes, he could have done something when he returned to the Red Keep. As Jaime remembers, Rhaegar chose not to take away him, his father's crutch. At the time, Aerys did everything Rhaegar told him to. But taking Elia and the children out of Aerys' reach was probably inferior to leaving Aerys with more crutches. Plus, it gave them Dorne's spears. Somehow, Rhaegar couldn't convince Dorne that he was still the Martells' best buddy, even with Elia still being his wife.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

Elia and the kids were far safer IN the Red Keep than out of it. For one thing if there had been time, Varys could have gotten them out (and might have gotten Aegon out as it is).

For another Aerys did NOTHING to them while they were there. He may not have liked Elia or Rhaenys, but Aegon was supposed to be his heir, and while Aerys was certifiably nuts he only seems to have personally harmed adults and Elia isn't on the list of those he tortured/killed. They were probably in their own wing, with their own guards.

Third, who on earth could have foreseen The Mountain and Amory Lorch scaling the RK to get in and kill them? If anyone had thought that far, they would have been moved, with or without Aerys permission.

[Mal Malenkirk]

No, you weren't quite wrong. He left them at Dragonstone where they were so safe that Aerys clearly didn't have any trouble taking them to KL.

Not too hard to think of, actually: Dragonstone is only safe as the royal fleet guards it. And guess what? The Master of Ships was Aerys' man.

Beaten by minutes.

It does change things a bit that Rhaegar left his wife and kids at Dragonstone rather than King's Landing when he was planning to disappear with Lyanna.

It decreases the likelyhood of him being a complete moron unable to consider causal effects but it instead increases how politically naive he was if he in anyway thought that was sufficient protection for his family.

If he had been smarter AND cared for his family's safety, he would have arranged a visit to Dorne for them instead. You can be sure Doran and Oberyn don't send back their little sister to the mad king if things get tense! I have proposed this argument in the past and the counter was that Elia was likely too frail to travel but we now know it was not the case.

[Mal Malenkirk]

Elia and the kids were far safer IN the Red Keep than out of it. For one thing if there had been time, Varys could have gotten them out (and might have gotten Aegon out as it is).

Not as safe as in Dorne.

[Anath]

Beaten by minutes.

It does change things a bit that Rhaegar left his wife and kids at Dragonstone rather than King's Landing when he was planning to disappear with Lyanna.

It decreases the likelyhood of him being a complete moron unable to consider causal effects but it instead increases how politically naive he was if he in anyway thought that was sufficient protection for his family.

If he had been smarter AND cared for his family's safety, he would have arranged a visit to Dorne for them instead. You can be sure Doran and Oberyn don't send back their little sister to the mad king if things get tense! I have proposed this argument in the past and the counter was that elia was likely too frail to travel but we now know it was not the case.

Given the fact that Arianne remember holding Rhaenys, it's clear that Rhaenys (and Elia) have been at Dorne before Aegon's birth.

My guess is that there were problems between Rhaegar and Elia after Harrenhall and he realized that her visit with Rhaenys to Dorne could be taken as a mark that they were splitting up. In fact, it might have been that. But Elia was either already pregnant, aka shackled to Rhaegar, or got pregnant soon after because Rhaegar wouldn't want to lose his alliance with Dorne, especially with Lyanna still betrothed to Robert which meant that he coudn't even replace it with such an alliance with the North. So he could not send Elia and the children to Dorne before disappearing. That might cost him Dorne - it almost did without him sending them there. So he took the risk to their safety instead of the risk of losing Dorne's spears for sure.

This possibility also gives a likely explanation why he got Elia pregnant immediately after she rose from bed after Rhaenys' birth. I think we all know just how recovered and ready for another pregnancy a woman who had just risen from her sickbed after childbirth is. But it might have been a declaration to the Martells - yes, I know I humiliated Elia and stuff but hey, I am planning my future and heirs with her and not the Stark chit. See?

As to Varys being able to smuggle them out of the Red Keep and that somehow being a point in Rhaegar's incredibly unmindful of their safety decision to leave them there instead of sending them away... right, Varys and Rhaegar were best buddies and Rhaegar had no reason to think that should something happen to him, his father would prefer Viserys to Aegon. Oh wait...

[JonCon's Red Beard]

No, you weren't quite wrong. He left them at Dragonstone where they were so safe that Aerys clearly didn't have any trouble taking them to KL.

That has nothing to do with safety. If the Kings commands, people do.

There is no evidence Aerys could have hurt Elia and the kids. Keeping them hostages doesn't necessarily means "If you don't do as I say, I'll kill them". It also means, "If you don't protect me, I might die. And also the Princess, who is with me".

Besides, that's not how the chronology probably works here:

Rhaegar returned to KL and Aerys agreed on calling Tywin (Jaime says) and gave Rhaegar an army. Despite the text saying he didn't trust his son, he's doing two things that doesn't fit. Either he agreed on listening to his son this time, or his paranoia wasn't as bad as they thought. The thing is that nothing indicates that Elia was in KL at this moment, and she probably wasn't, because it's quite the smart thing to do: keep the King in one place, and the heir in another.

It's after Rhaegar died that he probably kept Elia as a hostage, believing Lewyn and the Dornish had betrayed them and he was making sure the Dornish wouldn't attack KL if Elia and the babes where with him.

[RainGhost]

Elia and the children were always going to be in trouble wherever Rhaegar left them once he was dead. Even if they'd been on Dragonstone, do you think Robert would have let them live happily in the free cities? Viserys and Dany are one thing but Rhaegar's own children are quite another - Robert would have had all of them killed. He might have spared Elia though for what it's worth.

Having said that, he could have left more KG spare. 3 KG guarding Lyanna, 3 KG guarding Rhaegar and only Jaime Lannister guarding the king, Elia and the kids. Obviously Jaime was going to fail. How can he guard 4 people at once? Even one KG guarding Elia and the kids would see off Gregor Clegane and Amory Lorch. Once Ned gets there the children are safe. At least until Robert gets there.

They may have been safe in Dorne but that would have meant Dorne being invaded when Doran refuses to give them up. Oberyn could have fled with them but there's still the problem of Robert sending hired knives after them. Also, in this scenario, Rhaegar probably doesn't get help from the Dornish on the Trident - they hate Rhaegar at this point and would probably think Elia and the kids are safer if they keep all their spears close to home.

[DarkSister1001]

Sounds like Planetos is in desperate need of Maury Povich. A few DNA tests and he'd get this baby-daddy mess straightened.

Seriously though, if Rhaeger told Elia about the prophecy, she may have consented to his affair. She would have known he needed another baby and she knew her health was too fragile to birth another.