Shryke Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Comparing Hollywood and Russian state controlled media. No false equivalence there. Like I said, his facade is slipping. We've reached a point of making ridiculous comparisons to try and excuse Russian behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB. Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/07/boris-nemtsov-murder-russia-two-arrests Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guess who's back Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/07/boris-nemtsov-murder-russia-two-arrests What is the general opinion in here, do you guys think Putin played part in assassin of Nemtsov? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB. Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 http://sputniknews.com/analysis/20150305/1019099291.htmlI guess that depends on who you ask.Some think it was one of his jealous or bitter concubines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Like I said, his facade is slipping. We've reached a point of making ridiculous comparisons to try and excuse Russian behaviour.Again, I am not Fantomas. Your logic is the same as that of GWB: if you are not for us, you are against us. A middle ground seemingly doesnt exist for you. Shryke, the world is not black or white. I know for some users here the reality seems a little bit too complex. Btw major European NATO partners complained about the propaganda of the US nato commander in the current conflict because it rather escalates the situation than helping solving it. Did any of this reach US news media? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Comparing Hollywood and Russian state controlled media. No false equivalence there.Oh Jesus Christ...don't even try to develop a holistic view. All I am saying is: there is not much difference in the amount of dumb redneck chauvinism between US and Russia. At least this is the impression I got when I saw how someone like Chris Kyle gets hero-worshipped in the US, basically for being the best killer in US military history. Don't get me wrong: I can respect someone's deeds and he might have done a job which had to be done. But hero-worshipping? No thank you. This for example is the reason why I much more like the British approach. Show respect to the troops but not idolize this. Anyway sorry for OT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Comparing Hollywood and Russian state controlled media. No false equivalence there.Wow I forgot to mention that you are not half as smart as you think you are with your "false equivalence" statement. Maybe you are not aware that the US military is a MAJOR SPONSOR of glorifying war movies made by Hollywood. Even if robots and Aliens are involved hehehe. Whereas critical movies like Platoon get fuck all support. But buddy, no problem keep on going with your "false equivalence" stuff :). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted March 8, 2015 Author Share Posted March 8, 2015 What does American Sniper and the controversy surrounding that film have to do with Ukraine and the Russian conquest/annexation of Crimea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 What does American Sniper and the controversy surrounding that film have to do with Ukraine and the Russian annexation of Crimea?The broader picture is: chauvinism or propaganda, be it of Russian or any other country origin is never good :). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted March 8, 2015 Author Share Posted March 8, 2015 I'm not particularly fond of aggressive nationalism from the US. I haven't seen American Sniper but I have heard people argue that it isn't nearly the "rah rah... America!" film some claim it is. I will reserve judgment until I get a chance to watch it at the local second run theater. Now, again, what does that have to do with the Russian conquest/annexation of Crimea or with thw Civil War/invasion of the Donbass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 I'm not particularly fond of aggressive nationalism from the US. I haven't seen American Sniper but I have heard people argue that it isn't nearly the "rah rah... America!" film some claim it is. I will reserve judgment until I get a chance to watch it at the local second run theater. Now, again, what does that have to do with the Russian conquest/annexation of Crimea or with thw Civil War/invasion of the Donbass?I already apologized for OT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyBanana Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 My guess would be Russia's moderately successful exploitation of anti-american sentiment in Europe (and vice versa) in order to create a false equivalency to justify the war against Ukraine and keep NATO disunited on this issue. Negotiate with the europeans and mock them as being gay and weak appeasers while provoking the americans and painting them as simple-minded brutes. It generates amusingly petty debates like on this board but really only is concerning when the allied govs start to criticize each other openly in a similar manner as well. Which goes both ways, just to be clear, and makes me wonder whether deliberately misrepresenting the truth in public should have the same consequences for gov officials as infidelity or cheating in university. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 My guess would be Russia's moderately successful exploitation of anti-american sentiment in Europe (and vice versa) in order to create a false equivalency to justify the war against Ukraine and keep NATO disunited on this issue. Negotiate with the europeans and mock them as being gay and weak appeasers while provoking the americans and painting them as simple-minded brutes. It generates amusingly petty debates like on this board but really only is concerning when the allied govs start to criticize each other openly in a similar manner as well. Which goes both ways, just to be clear, and makes me wonder whether deliberately misrepresenting the truth in public should have the same consequences for gov officials as infidelity or cheating in university.I think you are somehow spot on. I agree that quite a lot of Russian politicans would love to have that "us vs. them" back. If Putin is one of them I am not sure. At least in the past he wanted to build up a close partnership with Germany for instance (he even gave well respected speach in the Bundestag in 2001 IIRC). I honestly think there are still too many cold warriors in the US and Russia. All in all I think that Obama and Kerry approached the conflict quite reasonable. Especially compared to jokes like McCain (Palin I guess is considered a joke even within the Republican community). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 BBE,So, the Circassians should be allowed to return to their homelands on the Northeast coast of the Black Sea and Russia should admit to its genocide?Sure. Haven't they been allowed to for at least a century? Recompensation may be a bit beyond that considering that nobody who lived at the time and was directly hurt has been alive for fifty years. What's your proof they aren't? Why is a majority enough? Do 50% -1 of Crimeans not get a say in having their land forcibly annexed?A democratic vote should prove that. Why are you opposed to holding one? Maybe make it a 70% majority decision? Those details can be determined if there is a fundamental acceptance that they got a choice at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Iceman of the North Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Arakan,So, Bavaria (or Munich) should be able, at will, to vote to leave Germany by mere majority?Scot, can you make even one argument why this should be a problem within a liberal, humanist, democratic society? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suttree Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 All I am saying is: there is not much difference in the amount of dumb redneck chauvinism between US and RussiaThat's not what you were originally saying at all, as past iterations of this thread have shown pretty clearly. Nice attempt at spin though. Additionally it has fuck all to do with this thread.how someone like Chris Kyle gets hero-worshipped in the US, basically for being the best killer in US military history.Chris Kyle has been torn to shreds in the U.S. media for being a liar and a bigot. I suspect you know this but it doesn't help your idiotic narrative. It kinda of hilarious, we've all seen you make up fabrications in these threads and then get increasingly shrill and peevish when called on it. This last run of posts is a beautiful example. #onetrickponyMaybe you are not aware that the US military is a MAJOR SPONSOR of glorifying war movies made by Hollywood.Ok leaving all else aside please provide a link for this being the case w/American Sniper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB. Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 More news from Moscowhttp://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/08/boris-nemstov-two-charged-over-killing-of-russian-opposition-politician Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey Filet Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Sure. Haven't they been allowed to for at least a century? Recompensation may be a bit beyond that considering that nobody who lived at the time and was directly hurt has been alive for fifty years. A democratic vote should prove that. Why are you opposed to holding one? Maybe make it a 70% majority decision? Those details can be determined if there is a fundamental acceptance that they got a choice at all. Furthering this logic, there should be democratic referendums in Chechnya, Dagestan, Ingushetia, Tatarstan et al who are clamoring for automony from the Motherland. But will Russia accede to this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey Filet Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 More news from Moscowhttp://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/08/boris-nemstov-two-charged-over-killing-of-russian-opposition-politicianPolitical assassinations in Russia are always pinned on disgruntled/extremist individuals from the Caucasus region..shocking revelation, that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Ok leaving all else aside please provide a link for this being the case w/American Sniper.Did I anywhere say that AS was funded by the US military? Besides the point that I do not wish to be OT again, it is a well known fact that the US military is heaviliy involved in (indirect) funding of movies they approve. Sorry bro but this doesnt even need to be discussed as it is as clear as night following day. Again, sorry for OT. Will not happen again in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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