Why does Danny want the Iron Throne?

[Nictarion]

Well Stannis will fight against The Others to protect the realm , if she goes against him she will be a villain that's for sure .

I highly doubt Stannis will play any kind of role against the Others.

[IMNHAAO]

I agree with all of that except the last sentence. I really believe she genuinely cares about "the weak and oppressed" and be it from a position of entitlement similar "the white man's burden".

You are right, it was phrased very badly. I think that Robert really did not care at all, didn't even spare a thought for his subjects, while at the contrary she comes from a genuine desire to free the oppressed, to rule wisely, the problem is that at the end seems to me that the results for the people are the same. A careless ruler and an ineffective one.

You said she would do "just about anything" to achieve her goals. That's the portion of your post I addressed. She has put aside her quest for the throne on several occassions so I dont know what you mean by that.

And still, if you want to discuss mindless destruction, she chained her dragons and did everything she could to avoid war in Meereen. She spared Yunkai and would have spared Meereen too had they given up their slaves as she demanded. She is not without mercy and she doesnt want to wage a endless, pointless war.

I did say that and I proceeded to explain what I meant. To conquer as she wants to do bringing fire and blood will not be painless. Who will pay the price? Will it be worth it? And after all the destruction will the winner be a trustworthy ruler?

Given the premises I have my doubts.

She did chain her dragons (which she was responsible for), it was, I believe, the bare minimum? if you unleash that kind of "weapon" on the world the minimum I would expect is that you know how to wield it and if you don't at least that you do everything in your power to prevent harm to the innocent.

Forgive me, but I also have a problem with the concept of a no one that comes to my city and in the name of "because I'm me" expects me to obey her bidding. I am quite the unreasonable, I know, I don't deal well with authority figures especially if their authority comes from "or my way or a nice roasting".

Again, I am in no way saying that she doesn't have any mercy, I am saying that with the best intentions she tries, my problem is that I cannot see good results out of all this trying.

Are Meereen or Yunkai so much better now than before? Are the changes she made to be long lasting? I have trouble believing in saviors that bring peace and democracy by force.

I do not pretend to be quite the expert on the books, I only read them twice and that some time ago, so please correct me if I am not remembering facts well I am in the process of re-reading, but not even close to the parts we are discussing.

[Roswell]

Your post doesnt make sense

I thought I made myself clear. Right now she believes it is hers, which is true. That right now is her motivation. But later on, she will take the throne because many in Westeros will ask her to take it. In other words, she will give Westeros a choice just as she did with The Unsullied on the show. To make that crystal clear, later on, she will take the throne not out of personal desire but because she will be asked to take the throne.

[Gogossos]

She spent all her formative years one step ahead of one assassin or another. Time for payback, it's a natural instinct.

[Barrick Eddon]

I highly doubt Stannis will play any kind of role against the Others.

Doubt all you want , he will fight them .

[Gibzit]

Doubt all you want , he will fight them .

He is marching the wrong way right now.

[Barrick Eddon]

I highly doubt Stannis will play any kind of role against the Others.

DP

[Roswell]

You are right, it was phrased very badly. I think that Robert really did not care at all, didn't even spare a thought for his subjects, while at the contrary she comes from a genuine desire to free the oppressed, to rule wisely, the problem is that at the end seems to me that the results for the people are the same. A careless ruler and an ineffective one.

I did say that and I proceeded to explain what I meant. To conquer as she wants to do bringing fire and blood will not be painless. Who will pay the price? Will it be worth it? And after all the destruction will the winner be a trustworthy ruler?

Given the premises I have my doubts.

She did chain her dragons (which she was responsible for), it was, I believe, the bare minimum? if you unleash that kind of "weapon" on the world the minimum I would expect is that you know how to wield it and if you don't at least that you do everything in your power to prevent harm to the innocent.

Forgive me, but I also have a problem with the concept of a no one that comes to my city and in the name of "because I'm me" expects me to obey her bidding. I am quite the unreasonable, I know, I don't deal well with authority figures especially if their authority comes from "or my way or a nice roasting".

Again, I am in no way saying that she doesn't have any mercy, I am saying that with the best intentions she tries, my problem is that I cannot see good results out of all this trying.

Are Meereen or Yunkai so much better now than before? Are the changes she made to be long lasting? I have trouble believing in saviors that bring peace and democracy by force.

I do not pretend to be quite the expert on the books, I only read them twice and that some time ago, so please correct me if I am not remembering facts well I am in the process of re-reading, but not even close to the parts we are discussing.

Meereen is much better. Hundreds of thousans of slaves are now free. The war with slavery isn't over yet. The harpy is still alive. Dany will end it, end the resistance, guarantee their freedom, and rebuild.

[Barrick Eddon]

He is marching the wrong way right now.

He is marching the right way , to Winterfell .

“Words. Words are wind. Why do you think I abandoned Dragonstone and sailed to the Wall,

Lord Snow?”

“I am no lord, sire. You came because we sent for you, I hope. Though I could not say why you

took so long about it,”

Surprisingly, Stannis smiled at that. “You’re bold enough to be a Stark. Yes, I should have

come sooner. If not for my Hand, I might not have come at all. Lord Seaworth is a man of

humble birth, but he reminded me of my duty, when all I could think of was my rights. I had the

cart before the horse, Davos said. I was trying to win the throne to save the kingdom, when I

should have been trying to save the kingdom to win the throne.” Stannis pointed north. “There is

where I’ll find the foe that I was born to fight.”

“His name may not be spoken,” Melisandre added softly. “He is the God of Night and Terror,

Jon Snow, and these shapes in the snow are his creatures.”

“They tell me that you slew one of these walking corpses to save Lord Mormont’s life,” Stannis

said. “it may be that this is your war as well, Lord Snow. If you will give me your help.”

“My sword is pledged to the Night’s Watch, Your Grace,” Jon Snow answered carefully.

That did not please the king. Stannis ground his teeth and said, “I need more than a sword from

you.”

Jon was lost. “My lord?”

“I need the north.”

The north. “I... my brother Robb was King in the North...”

“Your brother was the rightful Lord of Winterfell. If he had stayed home and done his duty,

instead of crowning himself and riding off to conquer the riverlands, he might be alive today. Be

that as it may. You are not Robb, no more than I am Robert.”

The harsh words had blown away whatever sympathy Jon might have had for Stannis. “I loved

my brother,” he said.

“And I mine. Yet they were what they were, and so are we. I am the only true king in Westeros,

north or south. And you are Ned Stark’s bastard.” Stannis studied him with those dark blue eyes.

“Tywin Lannister has named Roose Bolton his Warden of the North, to reward him for betraying

your brother. The ironmen are fighting amongst themselves since Balon Greyjoy’s death, yet

they still hold Moat Cailin, Deepwood Motte, Torrhen’s Square, and most of the Stony Shore.

Your father’s lands are bleeding, and I have neither the strength nor the time to stanch the

wounds. What is needed is a Lord of Winterfell. A loyal Lord of Winterfell.”

He is looking at me, Jon thought, stunned. “Winterfell is no more. Theon Greyjoy put it to the

torch.”

“Granite does not burn easily,” Stannis said. “The castle can be rebuilt, in time. It’s not the

walls that make a lord, it’s the man, Your northmen do not know me, have no reason to love me,

yet I will need their strength in the battles yet to come. I need a son of Eddard Stark to win them

to my banner.”

He would make me Lord of Winterfell. The wind was gusting, and Jon felt so light-headed he

was half afraid it would blow him off the Wall. “Your Grace,” he said, “you forget. I am a Snow,

not a Stark.”

“It’s you who are forgetting,” King Stannis replied.

Melisandre put a warm hand on Jon’s arm. “A king can remove the taint of bastardy with a

stroke, Lord Snow.”

Lord Snow. Ser Alliser Thorne had named him that, to mock his bastard birth. Many of his

brothers had taken to using it as well, some with affection, others to wound. But suddenly it had

a different sound to it in Jon’s ears. It sounded... real. “Yes,” he said, hesitantly, “kings have

King Stannis gazed off north again, his gold cloak streaming from his shoulders. “It may be that

I am mistaken in you, Jon Snow. We both know the things that are said of bastards. You may

lack your father’s honor, or your brother’s skill in arms. But you are the weapon the Lord has

given me. I have found you here, as you found the cache of dragonglass beneath the Fist, and I

mean to make use of you. Even Azor Ahai did not win his war alone. I killed a thousand

wildlings, took another thousand captive, and scattered the rest, but we both know they will

return. Melisandre has seen that in her fires. This Tormund Thunderfist is likely re-forming them

even now, and planning some new assault. And the more we bleed each other, the weaker we

shall all be when the real enemy falls upon us.”

Jon had come to that same realization. “As you say, Your Grace.” He wondered where this king

was going.

“Whilst your brothers have been struggling to decide who shall lead them, I have been speaking

with this Mance Rayder.” He ground his teeth. “A stubborn man, that one, and prideful. He will

leave me no choice but to give him to the flames. But we took other captives as well, other

leaders. The one who calls himself the Lord of Bones, some of their clan chiefs, the new Magnar

of Therm. Your brothers will not like it, no more than your father’s lords, but I mean to allow the

wildlings through the Wall... those who will swear me their fealty, pledge to keep the king’s

peace and the king’s laws, and take the Lord of Light as their god. Even the giants, if those great

knees of theirs can bend. I will settle them on the Gift, once I have wrested it away from your

new Lord Commander. When the cold winds rise, we shall live or die together. It is time we

made alliance against our common foe.” He looked at Jon. “Would you agree?”

[Lord Ser Septon Maester]

She's been raised her entire life told it's hers and she has a duty to take it.

[A Ghost of Someone]

Because it has been Viserys and now her right in her mind. She is right to a certain degree. It is hard to let go of something you have wanted and dreamed of your whole life. Also, remember, Dany, before Drogo, thought that she would be wed and Queen to Viserys once they got the Iron Throne back so, yeah, it was hers too, all along.

[IMNHAAO]

Meereen is much better. Hundreds of thousans of slaves are now free. The war with slavery isn't over yet. The harpy is still alive. Dany will end it, end the resistance, guarantee their freedom, and rebuild.

What about the Astapori? Again, correct me if I am wrong, I am under the impression that Meereen is on the brink of war with Yunkai and that is the direct result of her actions?

How long do you think she plans to stay in Meereen then anyway? She has to fight this battle, to eradicate the harpy completely and to ensure long-lasting peace. That is not a matter resolved in days or months. It's a matter of years.

When the heck does she think she will go to conquer Westeros? Unless your proposition is that she gets the heck out of there as soon as the fighting is done which would mean to leave a bloody mess. :eek:

Because she believes that she is the last member of house Targaryen and therefore has a duty to reclaim the house's lands and continue it in westeros.

This sort of reasoning doesn't really work though. The Targaryens claimed it from someone. It seems like that what will come of it is the reinstatement of a vicious circle in which I claim land from you, you take it back and then my children will re-claim it and on and on it continues until no one is left. Not exactly a desirable future especially for the ones caught in the middle.

[Caspoi]

The Transporter@ 1. Mereeen is hardly better now that when she arrived ther, what with war, diseases and everything.

2. Saying that she "will think so" or that "it will happen" is a very poor argument, currently she wants the Iron Throne because she believe that it is hers, end of sentence.

[TheHammeredDog]

In a way she's very similar to Stannis pre Battle of Castle Black. She can't see past her 'rights'.

[Roswell]

What about the Astapori? Again, correct me if I am wrong, I am under the impression that Meereen is on the brink of war with Yunkai and that is the direct result of her actions?

How long do you think she plans to stay in Meereen then anyway? She has to fight this battle, to eradicate the harpy completely and to ensure long-lasting peace. That is not a matter resolved in days or months. It's a matter of years.

When the heck does she think she will go to conquer Westeros? Unless your proposition is that she gets the heck out of there as soon as the fighting is done which would mean to leave a bloody mess. :eek:

This sort of reasoning doesn't really work though. The Targaryens claimed it from someone. It seems like that what will come of it is the reinstatement of a vicious circle in which I claim land from you, you take it back and then my children will re-claim it and on and on it continues until no one is left. Not exactly a desirable future especially for the ones caught in the middle.

Was the situation in the South (USA) immediately better during the Civil War? Was the situation for the freed former slaves immediately better in the years following the war?

Ending slavery will not be easy, for anyone, not even for the slaves themselves. People don't want freedom because it is easy, people want freedom so that they will have the freedom to make choices. The benefit of liberation will happen over time. The war is far from over. Grazdan mo Eraz still lives and is asking support from Volantis. The Harpy is still strong and still fighting a guerilla warfare. When Dany puts them down for good, things will start to improve. Have all the problems created by slavery in America been solved? No, they have not. Dany will definitely have to return to Slaver's Bay after her business in Westeros. Dany will rule in King's Landing for a time, but I predict that Tyrion will stay behind and rule what is left of a frozen Westeros behind a puppet king/queen installed by Daenerys. Maybe she props up her nephew, Aegon VI and Tyrion stays behind to be his Hand of the King.

I hope you're not saying that those slaves that she freed would be better off still being slaves. Each individual circumstance is different, but the vast majority are glad that she freed them.

[Guess who's back]

Because she believes that she is the last member of house Targaryen and therefore has a duty to reclaim the house's lands and continue it in westeros.

She wouldn't even be the last member if she hadn't conspired to kill her brother.

[Nictarion]

In a way she's very similar to Stannis pre Battle of Castle Black. She can't see past her 'rights'.

Not true. She's already put her desire for the IT on hold once already to fight slavery. I expect her to do the same in Westeros once she learns of the Others.

[Mithras]

I highly doubt Stannis will play any kind of role against the Others.

That is Dany, not Stannis.

[Mithras]

I thought I made myself clear. Right now she believes it is hers, which is true. That right now is her motivation. But later on, she will take the throne because many in Westeros will ask her to take it. In other words, she will give Westeros a choice just as she did with The Unsullied on the show. To make that crystal clear, later on, she will take the throne not out of personal desire but because she will be asked to take the throne.

That is Jon, not Dany.

[Mithras]

She spent all her formative years one step ahead of one assassin or another. Time for payback, it's a natural instinct.

Has she or Viserys ever seen an assassin sent by Robert before the series started? Has Robert admitted sending these assassins ?