aryagonnakill#2 Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 23 hours ago, Shuvuuia said: ah, if that, then no need for magic at all - I see it as he is just very good (after training so many FM), maybe somewhat supernaturally good, at reading people, when they lie, when they tell the truth. That's part of Arya's training - to lie very good and take new identity. (i don't really see how reading minds is more plausible than glass candles or other magical device, even if i suggested it myself) he doesn't have to dislike them, but he doesn't need to work for them. I see it as a simple case of a protagonist gets lucky (similar to how Brienne gets to meet Gendry, for example, when he could've been away that day or how Jon has a conveniant spare baby to switch, Jorah stumbles upon Tyrion). Besides, I don't see any knowledgeable Braavosi risking to cross FM - we know Arya doesn't know anything, but for them - what if it's a FM playing a role of a little girl? And they seem to be bound by some custom to provide FM with their service when shown a coin, a tradition. I'm not sure if Jaquen is rogue or faithfully works for the HoBaW, but him communicating with them in some twitter-like manner (i know i proposed glass candles, but no evidence for that, and it was because i thought I missed him knowing Arya's name beforehand ) to provide them with one too young apprentance seems meh from the storytelling point (same as Bloodraven wargs everything). Jaquen as sort-of mentor who stirs Arya in one direction and she gets there by herself, through her character journey, is much more interesting. Exactly, that's why Arya's growth as a FM is so evident. First at the end of her blind chapters she is able to confuse and strike the kindly man with her warging while remaining physically capable, then she is able to lie to the kindly man by the end of Dance, after she kills the insurer, he asks who did it, and she says no one. When it sounds like the truth he sends her to Izembaro, where we learned she still very much thinks of herself as Arya Stark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light a wight tonight Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 IMO we don't see the FM sometimes known as Jaqen acting as a paid assassin at all. It's more like he's engaged in espionage, killing where it advances his plans, as with Pate or obligation as with Arya's wishes. It's not necessary that he was in King's Landing to kill someone, could have been part of his spying mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Man, y'all don't wanna believe Petyr hired a Faceless Man to kill the Ned, and I know y'all don't like my theory that Arya, not Sansa is the maid that will slay Petyr the savage giant, but when y'all read in Winds how Arya learns, there at the House of Black and White, all the nasty stuff the Lord of the Little Finger did to her family, including hiring a Faceless Man to kill her dad, y'all are gonna say, "Jiminy Cricket! That Lost Melnibonean dude wasn't as cracked as we thought." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalerionTheCat Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 2 hours ago, Shuvuuia said: I could possibly see it as FM somehow finding about her warging potential - at any point before or during her training, maybe even only in the next book - and wanting to utilize it for themself, Stark part isn't important in itself, warging abilities in their blood are. But I still think it's not what happened. Also, the Faceless Men are former Valyrian slaves. And they know a deal about dragons. The Kindly man is telling Arya of old tales (wyrms and the Fourteen Flames) from before the dragons. According to Marwyn, the maesters are working to the elimination of dragons and magic. Possibly the Faceless Men have the same goal. Or are opposing the maesters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DasallmaechtigeJ Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 18 hours ago, Ser Tristan Flowers said: There are no traditional ways to know about him, that is true, but who´s to say that there is no magical way. Bloodraven is not the only one who can watch people or get information magically. If a major player finds out about him, what he is, that´s pretty much an automatic reason to have him killed for many people. The one reason why I think this is possible is the fact that he first went towards the wall, but then turned back to Oldtown. He was doing a lot of work to get access to a glass candle, and there are not too many important people that are impossible to find for a facelass man without one. Bloodraven is certainly one of them. The fact that he needs a glass candle to find his target makes me believe he´s not going after a big, political figure. It doesn´t have to be Bloodraven, though. However there seems to be a supernatural element to his his journey. What I wonder though is whether he can be found via a glass candle. The way I understand how they work, they can be used to communicate and to surveil. Yet, it appears to me that one has to know where the respective target is. Bloodraven is underground and in a magically sealed cave. I doubt that one can find him that "easily", considering he lives in a magically sealed place that is built to remain hidden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevets Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 Jaqen is most likely in Yoren's convoy for the sole purpose of advancing Arya's story. I doubt George had any more thought than that, and probably didn't anticipate that anyone would actually care. However, to answer the OP question, KL is a large capital city. There are undoubtedly a large number of people who would be potential targets for assassination, and whose death, if any, we would not know about. Given the fact he was in the black cells, he may have been caught before, or just after the killing. While the FM are good, I doubt they are perfect, and things can always go wrong. It is probably no more than that. As for Kindly Man knowing who Arya is, it is likely that Jaqen either returned to Braavos, or sent a message, and he could have mentioned his giving her a coin, along with a description, in case she showed up. Remember, when he gave her the coin, it was most likely that she would be joining her mother and brother at Riverrun, and not be going to Braavos. Either he saw her as a promising agent, or thought that having a Stark favorably disposed toward Braavos and the HOBAW would be a good idea. Remember, the only way she would go to Braavos would be if the rest of her family was gone, which is what happened, but was not expected when he gave her the coin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 Couldn't the Kindly Man have known that Hand's daughter was missing? And couldn't he have deduced the girl was her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beautiful Bloody Sword Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 4 hours ago, BalerionTheCat said: Also, the Faceless Men are former Valyrian slaves. And they know a deal about dragons. The Kindly man is telling Arya of old tales (wyrms and the Fourteen Flames) from before the dragons. According to Marwyn, the maesters are working to the elimination of dragons and magic. Possibly the Faceless Men have the same goal. Or are opposing the maesters. Wasn't the first servant of the many faced god a free man, most likely Valyrian themself, who gave the first gift to a slave in the mines they heard praying for an end to their suffering for a while? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalerionTheCat Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 11 hours ago, Beautiful Bloody Sword said: Wasn't the first servant of the many faced god a free man, most likely Valyrian themself, who gave the first gift to a slave in the mines they heard praying for an end to their suffering for a while? I don't remember if he was a slave, an escaped slave, or a free man helping slaves... The wiki says "a figure of unknown origins". My point was, he was helping slaves escaping the Valyrians dragon lords. So, the FM too are somewhat related to dragons. And may have their own agenda, sharing or opposing the maesters point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannim Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 Jaquen is a seeming contradiction to everything else we're shown about the Faceless Men. Take that contrast further, perhaps He wasn't sent to King's Landing to kill anyone at all. Personal Supposition, he was hired to ensure the Ned survived his trip the the Wall and took the black. Who else might know a FM contact in KL? Varys, the one along with Illyro whom don't want a war in the Seven Kingdoms yet. The North has risen, as the Riverlands had pledged to the North, but real war hadn't started yet. The Ned proclaims Joffry the rightful, true king of the realm, then taken the black, would have diffused much of the North/Riverlands casus belli against the Lannnisters and the Crown. Granted, Ned might tell others of the Stark what he knew, maybe, depending on his sense of honor and continued threat to his daughters. Regardless the Ned dying pushed the realms over the edge into war. Varys didn't want that, of anyone else in KL. He'd ensure Ned survived the journey to the Wall, take the black, maybe further. A Faceless Man as unseen protector, arranging accidents for any other killers from other parties, would do nicely. And how he became chained in the Black Cells.... he took Jaquen's face once Ned agreed to take the black. Then was stuck after the Ned lost his head, yet found a Stark daughter in disguise heading north too. Enough to interest any FM w/o a mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.