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rocksniffer

Jon Snow lives???!!??? SPOILER ARE SURE TO FOLLOW

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What if Jon is resurrected by the red power clearly possessed by the ruby? Maybe wearing the diadem could bring him life. Maybe Mel has chosen to resurrect Jon by giving him her source of eternal life.

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Oathbreaker could mean she resurrects him next episode but Kit on Jonathan Ross was adamant that he only plays a corpse in 6 so I think he might play dead for a few more episodes as the Wildlings come back and Jon's backstory is revealed. There is no point him coming back right now just as a Snow and then re-joining the NW, better that when he is reborn we all know he is a Targ or Stark and so has a new future, altho just returning to where you were before like Dany has precedent but it is poor storytelling.

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i look forward to seeing if she is really using a glamour spell...and who she really is...could she be one of the characters from before the rebellion...

and i also tend to think that since ghost is there, Jon warged even if it was unintentional. we know he understands the concept.

 

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jonny is dead. the wildlings come, then sansa arrives and then its time for the boltons in castle black when suddenly the white walkers shatter the wall and the action kicks in. too bad there was no time to burn good ol jonny...

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Whatever happens to Jon, it's going to happen soon after Thorne and the Night's Watch enter the room.  Wildling help or not, they're not just going to let Jon's body hang out for no reason.  Since we've seen from the trailers Davos will talk to people outside of the Wall, we know that they're not going to die there.  So I too expect Jon to be brought back in either episode 2 or 3.  

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5 hours ago, JonSnowed said:

Pretty sure it's now set-up for Jon to come back to life in episode 2, anyone else agree?

Too soon, I feel.  I'm thinking Episode 3 or 4.

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I think its obvious that Jon Snow is Targaryen by now.

I'm not talking about the dragon-shaped blood, but about the fact that they just left his body on the ground.

Why didn't they burn it ? After all the Nights Watch has mentioned a million times how important it is to burn the bodies, so they don't turn into white walkers. Or do they want him to draw rats ? Or diseases ?

I think its simply because the directors of the show noticed: "Oh, we can't do that. Because... Targaryens don't burn. So we can't put him on a pyre."

This will probably be the next plot device.

I call that they will give Jon a burial by fire, he doesn't burn and Mel will see it and attempt to revive him,

because he gets spared by the flames of the lord of light...

 

What do you think ?

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I think its obvious that Jon Snow is Targaryen by now.

I'm not talking about the dragon-shaped blood, but about the fact that they just left his body on the ground.

Why didn't they burn it ? After all the Nights Watch has mentioned a million times how important it is to burn the bodies, so they don't turn into white walkers. Or do they want him to draw rats ? Or diseases ?

I think its simply because the directors of the show noticed: "Oh, we can't do that. Because... Targaryens don't burn. So we can't put him on a pyre."

This will probably be the next plot device.

I call that they will give Jon a burial by fire, he doesn't burn and Mel will see it and attempt to revive him,

because he gets spared by the flames of the lord of light...

 

What do you think ?

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I expect Jon to be revived at the end of episode 2. Ep 1 sorta felt to me that Melisandre can bring him back to life, at the cost of her own. Which leads me to think that Jon is AA. Since the original AA had to sacrifice his wife with blood (magic) by tempering his blade with his wife's blood. I think Mel sacrificing herself in order to restore Jon to life will go a long way helping the television audience that he is AA reborn. Ultimately I think Ep. 3 will be about the resurrected Jon (Snow,Stark,Targ,  whatever you want to call him) will turn his back on his knights watch vows since he honored them by dying. He will then begin to March on Winterfell with the wildings.   Just my 2 cents but this makes the most sense to me.

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Targs definitely burn.  GRRM has confirmed and said it was an anomaly of magic that Dany didn't in the drogo pyre.  Up until that point Taras hadn't resurrected stone dragon eggs, either.  That wasn't usual Targaryan stuff.

They didn't burn Jon so that the plot is still open to resurrection or him coming back as a wight.  

I am hoping we get some Ghost viewpoint to confirm whether Jon is alive in there.

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For what it is worth, I also thought that the scene with Mel left open the possibility of her giving up her life for Jon.  Either that or suicide since she just realized her life's work was all a big hoax.  

I think it was her usual glamour stuff, as well.  In the books she mentions that the best glamours require personal objects to make them more believable.  So the scene without her amulet doesn't really matter.  She can keep up the facade without it, it's just that for long term glamour such as what she was doing, it would just be easier to keep up the glamour with the use of the magical object.

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Mel is going to sacrifice herself, it is foreshadowed by the last scene where she seems disillusioned with being alive.

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5 hours ago, rocksniffer said:

i look forward to seeing if she is really using a glamour spell...and who she really is...could she be one of the characters from before the rebellion...

and i also tend to think that since ghost is there, Jon warged even if it was unintentional. we know he understands the concept.

 

How about this for a twisted scenario. Mel glamours into Jon and then Jon wargs out of Ghost into the glamored Mel/Jon. LOL.

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1 hour ago, The Little Sister said:

For what it is worth, I also thought that the scene with Mel left open the possibility of her giving up her life for Jon.  Either that or suicide since she just realized her life's work was all a big hoax.  

I think it was her usual glamour stuff, as well.  In the books she mentions that the best glamours require personal objects to make them more believable.  So the scene without her amulet doesn't really matter.  She can keep up the facade without it, it's just that for long term glamour such as what she was doing, it would just be easier to keep up the glamour with the use of the magical object.

I'd have to re-watch, but in the bathtub scene, doesn't she drink or do something with a potion before getting in the tub?

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I'm thinking episode 3 or 4. In ep. 2, when Thorne and company go to break down the door, Edd and the wildlings will show up and take care of business (hence the shot in the trailer of Wun Wun smashing the gates).  Gives some time for Jon's body to remain as is. I also feel like they'll want to show the tower of joy flashback before as well, to establish who Jon REALLY is. 

Knowing Jon's true identity will open up the different possibilities for him to come back. IF they do go the route of burning him on a pyre and he doesn't burn/comes back they can play the Targaryen card like they did w Dany season 1. (I know GRRM already said that was a 1 time thing and not a Targ trait but the show is different). I think a Mel self sacrifice is also on the table. In that last scene age just looks so worn out and in despair. Similar to how show Thoros was before he started popping Beric back. 

Figure episode 2 will have a decent amount of Sam and Bran as they appear for the first time this season, with Bran possibly flashing back to tower of joy. Tyrion and Arya figure to have more screen time as well. I'd say end of episode 3, episode 4 is when he comes back. 

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Melisandre saying "I saw him fighting at Winterfell in the flames" basically confirms she will resurrect him and we will see Bastard Bowl at WF.

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2 hours ago, johndance said:

Knowing Jon's true identity will open up the different possibilities for him to come back. IF they do go the route of burning him on a pyre and he doesn't burn/comes back they can play the Targaryen card like they did w Dany season 1. (I know GRRM already said that was a 1 time thing and not a Targ trait but the show is different). I think a Mel self sacrifice is also on the table. In that last scene age just looks so worn out and in despair. Similar to how show Thoros was before he started popping Beric back. 

I have the notion that, after the Wildlings storm the Wall and join Team Davos, TNW will set up a pyre (which the Wildlings will insist on) to burn Jon. Mel will see the pyre from her room, will go down and walk across the yard for the last time, re-double-glamoured with ruby necklace AND (kings-blood infused Chateau Shireen) potion, throw her ideologically defeated self into the flames to join her Lord of Light. Jon resurrects out of the fire, Mel dies. Davos indicates he is slightly impressed that Mel had some power after all. Jon then does what he does best and broker’s peace between disparate peoples; being the Wildlings and TNW. The Wildlings stay on the Wall and help repopulate and fortify all the Wall castles – most importantly the Night Fort.

Or perhaps Mel will not throw herself on the fire, but recall Thoros’ actions and beseech TLoL with one last gasp of faith. Jon sits up and a gobsmacked Davos does a 180 in his opinion of Mel. Mel was Melody (Lot 7) but became Melisandre – her latter name is reminiscent of Cassandra, whose true prophecies were always disbelieved. 

I just can’t give up on the idea that Jon will survive. The above is also based on my belief that R+L=J. Not sure that I believe Jon is currently residing in ghost – but I also kind of hope so. I think that the full ‘powers’ or abilities of direwolves have yet to be revealed.

I would also like to see Alister Thorne, who fought for the Targaryens in Robert’s Rebellion, realise his grave mis-judgment and unfair mistreatment of Jon Snow, when he realises that R+L=J. Had he supported Jon, he would have been supporting Rhaegar’s son…

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