Liver and Onions Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 I haven't read any Mark Lawrence before this, but Red Sister is now on my to-read list for the setting and concept alone. (As for his other books, comparing one of his protagonists to Lelouch from Code Geass is definitely a NOT a way to get me interested. ) I, too, love the idea of a badass nun that can face down an entire army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 I haven't read the book yet, but the argument that having a female main character is pandering or SJW is fucking baffling to me. Sure, some books can and do go overboard in making a thematic point but the basis of the argument here appears to be that (1) one can or should only relate to a character of their own gender and (2) only boys deserve fantasy books to relate to. Neither of which argument is in any way sensible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iskaral Pust Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 @C.T. Phipps That review was very helpful, much more so than the preceding "controversy" discussion. I think I'll put it on my list, although I haven't yet finished the Jalen series after getting a bit fatigued with Mark's brand of grimdark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.T. Phipps Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 7 hours ago, Liver and Onions said: I haven't read any Mark Lawrence before this, but Red Sister is now on my to-read list for the setting and concept alone. (As for his other books, comparing one of his protagonists to Lelouch from Code Geass is definitely a NOT a way to get me interested. ) I, too, love the idea of a badass nun that can face down an entire army. Broken Empire opens up with the 14 year old genius protagonist slaughtering a village of innocent people and letting his men engage in war crimes. He's not what you might call...likable. Even if you later find out what warped the poor kid into the psychopath he is and whether he can come out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.T. Phipps Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Iskaral Pust said: @C.T. Phipps That review was very helpful, much more so than the preceding "controversy" discussion. I think I'll put it on my list, although I haven't yet finished the Jalen series after getting a bit fatigued with Mark's brand of grimdark. Thanks, glad I could help. I enjoyed the book but not quite as much as Red Queen's War or Broken Empire. Broken Empire's Magnificent Bastardy and Jalan's lovable cowardice really appealed to me. Nona is a fine character but isn't quite as overthetop as her predecessors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 I haven't seen peep about this "controversy" anywhere else. I;ve seen some people on Goodreads not like the novel as much as previous ones but nothing along the lines of OMG GIRL CHARACTER LIBERAL COOTIES. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 6 hours ago, polishgenius said: I haven't read the book yet, but the argument that having a female main character is pandering or SJW is fucking baffling to me. Sure, some books can and do go overboard in making a thematic point but the basis of the argument here appears to be that (1) one can or should only relate to a character of their own gender and (2) only boys deserve fantasy books to relate to. Neither of which argument is in any way sensible. Right? It's like the fucking twilight zone here lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 On 4/4/2017 at 10:29 AM, SkynJay said: Meh. The Empire's Blades had one too and I disliked it just as much. Torture as training is already over played. I think it was already overplayed when The Emperors Blades came out, but I agree. That book went kind of overboard with it. (OF course I bought the second anyway, but have yet to get with it). I feel like the torture as training thing has been around forever though, just GrimDark sells so you see it more. Which makes no sense when I type it out. Phooey. Brain no make words work. ANYWAY starting Red Sister riiiight...now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.T. Phipps Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 32 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said: Right? It's like the fucking twilight zone here lately. One of my all time favorite characters is Honor Harrington and calling David Weber a SJW is....a curious claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 Heh, I actually don't know much about Weber's actual views, but he does write for Baen, so I just assume he's crazy. Also, There are no Honor Harrington books after, oh, lets say book 7. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.T. Phipps Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Darth Richard II said: Heh, I actually don't know much about Weber's actual views, but he does write for Baen, so I just assume he's crazy. Also, There are no Honor Harrington books after, oh, lets say book 7. :/ War of Honor was a great finale to the series. David actually got less crazy as time went on, oddly enough. Originally, the People's Republic of Haven became a communist dystopia bent on galactic conquest because of the evils of universal wellfare. Things then got a little more nuanced after he became friends with Eric Flint, the communist. That's the definition of a TV tropes Odd Friendship there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 Yeah I gave up when large sections of story were copy pasted into multiple books. I think like there were 200ish pages repeated in like three different novels? It made the latter WoT novels seem fast paced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.T. Phipps Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 Weirdly, it was when it became about people other than Honor. Yes, she may be Batman in Space in terms of everything she can do but I was there for her character over Nameless Bureaucrat 71# Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liver and Onions Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 22 hours ago, C.T. Phipps said: Broken Empire opens up with the 14 year old genius protagonist slaughtering a village of innocent people and letting his men engage in war crimes. He's not what you might call...likable. Even if you later find out what warped the poor kid into the psychopath he is and whether he can come out of it. Hah hah, that sounds like Lelouch alright. I haven't gotten my hands on the book yet, but in your review, you mention that the teen protagonists feel oddly sexless. Do you think this is an effort on the part of the author to avoid a kind of "Catholic school girls," "creepy old man" fetish type of feel for the setting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.T. Phipps Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 56 minutes ago, Liver and Onions said: Hah hah, that sounds like Lelouch alright. I haven't gotten my hands on the book yet, but in your review, you mention that the teen protagonists feel oddly sexless. Do you think this is an effort on the part of the author to avoid a kind of "Catholic school girls," "creepy old man" fetish type of feel for the setting? Well, it could simply be an issue of being unsure how to handle the issue. There's a reference to crushes the girls get on each other. But if I'm inclined to guess, I'd say it's to avoid making the book in any way "tainted" by the typical romance or feelings which fill so many YA female-led novels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Well I'm only about 50 pages in but I LOVE the narrative voice/prose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unJon Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 On 4/10/2017 at 4:16 AM, C.T. Phipps said: Well, it could simply be an issue of being unsure how to handle the issue. There's a reference to crushes the girls get on each other. But if I'm inclined to guess, I'd say it's to avoid making the book in any way "tainted" by the typical romance or feelings which fill so many YA female-led novels. Just finished the book. Really enjoyed it. Great tone and style. Good twists though mostly easy to see coming. Pissed to have to wait a year as I can see this series being awesome with the potential the world building has. Humans as invading alien species, the natives off screen but hinted at, buried ark ships and nuclear-type power generators that also cause magic, some sort of spaceship coming at the planet with the "Home" star. Some cool potential Re above sexless comments, there is at least one girl couple that shares a bed in grey class, so he does deal with relationship/crushes. Also it's pretty explicit that two of the female teachers are in a spousal relationship. Agree that there isn't a high word count about it. That said, I think Nona's age range in the main storyline is pre-pubesenct the whole time, so I didn't think there was anything out of place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Are they a year apart? I know all three boks are written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeagl Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 1 hour ago, Darth Richard II said: Are they a year apart? I know all three boks are written. Yup indeed they are. Also this isn't the first time for Lawrence since Wheel of Oshiem was finished before Liar's Key was out. However, Mark have a Broken Empire short story collection coming out this summer in the UK. Edit:link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 Ah yes, I remember that. Man is a writing MACHINE. So, 1/2 way through Red Sister, loving the fuck out of it. Maybe I;ve been reading too much grimdark lately but the torture as training thing seems really mild to me. Update: Whoever wrote that grimdark review must have read a different book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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