Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: lemme ask you, what's the upper limit of innocent bystanders police could kill in the apprehension of a criminal that you would consider morally justified? Less than the death toll of the second Iraqi War, certainly. Once again, I don't find that war to be justifiable. I'm saying that reasonable justifications have been forwarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: True, they aren't entirely separate. Yeah, if you think say your typical Alt-Righter is a nazi, then you and I have a different definition of nazi. That doesn't make your definition more accurate than mine. so what's your definition of nazi then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Just now, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Less than the death toll of the second Iraqi War, certainly. Once again, I don't find that war to be justifiable. I'm saying that reasonable justifications have been forwarded. it's not justifiable, but it has been justified, reasonably. got it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 15 minutes ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: it's not justifiable, but it has been justified, reasonably. got it No you're right. Everything is either wholly good or wholly evil. There is no gray in your world I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 3 minutes ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: so what's your definition of nazi then? Not yours, clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 12 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Not yours, clearly. oh is it? you can't seem to produce a definition of your own, so please explain what mine is and how it differs from yours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 1 minute ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: oh is it? you can't seem to produce a definition of your own, so please explain what mine is and how it differs from yours Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure I've seen you post similar sentiment to the sort of comparisons that have been posted here equating the Alt-Right to Nazis. I think that's a fairly hyperbolic comparison in a general sense. Again, if I've misconstrued your position there, apologies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 all the alt right are fucking nazis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 3 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said: all the alt right are fucking nazis. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Anyway this thread went nuts and I've lost the narrative but did I see someone trying to claim Vox Day ISNT a Nazi? Cause he's pretty much a perfect example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 41 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure I've seen you post similar sentiment to the sort of comparisons that have been posted here equating the Alt-Right to Nazis. I think that's a fairly hyperbolic comparison in a general sense. Again, if I've misconstrued your position there, apologies. i am asking for your definition of nazi. nazism, as i understand it, is defined by a belief in racial essentialism, and that the world is made up of a constant struggle between races, and that the white (specifically aryan) race is the archetypical "master" race, and as such should dominate all others. nazis believe in o. rder to overcome social divisions and strife they must create a homogenous, racially "pure" ethnostate free of subordinate peoples, which usually entails forceful violent removal of said person from the "volksgemeinschaft". this usually requires the people's deference and loyalty to leaders and valuing the enforcement of a strong "will" over "thought", as their leaders are exemplars of the strength of their race (any of this sounding familiar?) eta: note that subscribing to such beliefs does not require one to display swastica or be formal member of a specific political party i.e. nsdap, anp, etc if we are simply inferring ones 'personal definition' from prior posts, as best i can tell your definition (in fairness, you only used the term facsist/-ism, but lacking any elaboration...) is simply anyone willing to use any sort of violence in furtherance of their goal to block an opposing agenda-- which to me seem so broad as to cover everyone from black blocing anti fascist activists to street gang members to the police to the u.s. military in its noble goal of helping establish an independent autonomous kurdish state in iraq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: i am asking for your definition of nazi. nazism, as i understand it, is defined by a belief in racial essentialism, and that the world is made up of a constant struggle between races, and that the white (specifically aryan) race is the archetypical "master" race, and as such should dominate all others. nazis believe in o. rder to overcome social divisions and strife they must create a homogenous, racially "pure" ethnostate free of subordinate peoples, which usually entails forceful violent removal of said person from the "volksgemeinschaft". this usually requires the people's deference and loyalty to leaders and valuing the enforcement of a strong "will" over "thought", as their leaders are exemplars of the strength of their race (any of this sounding familiar?) That works for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 glad you agree that the alt right, as a whole, exhibits most of these defining traits, even if they are somewhat less ideologically coherent than the nsdap of the 30s-40s-- enough that one can be reasonably comfortable calling them nazis as we have so defined it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 1 minute ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: glad you agree that the alt right, as a whole, exhibits most of these defining traits, even if they are somewhat less ideologically coherent than the nsdap of the 30s-40s-- enough that one can be reasonably comfortable calling them nazis as we have so defined it Yes and no. They do exhibit some of these defining traits but they lack both the authority and the popular support that made nazism possible.They are at worst wannabes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 12 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Yes and no. They do exhibit some of these defining traits but they lack both the authority and the popular support that made nazism possible.They are at worst wannabes. sorry, but "popular support" is not a bar that has to be cleared to be a nazi; and buddy, i've got some bad news about the leading authorities in this country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, r'hllor's redrum lobster said: sorry, but "popular support" is not a bar that has to be cleared to be a nazi; and buddy, i've got some bad news about the leading authorities in this country The leading authorities in this country are a lot of shitty things, granted, but they aren't nazis. They are willing to court the votes of these wannabes, which is bad enough, but that doesn't make them nazis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Week Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 22 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Yes and no. They do exhibit some of these defining traits but they lack both the authority and the popular support that made nazism possible.They are at worst wannabes. At worst? Come on man - that's the worst you can imagine? I keep posting this - there are clear and present global danger that has been cultivated online and continues to grow. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/19/opinion/alt-right-white-supremacy-undercover.html Commecting Charlottesville to people who want Europe to have Hitler on money to links in the Trump administration. Granted, the organization is not wholly in power or calling any shots - but not for a lack of trying. Gamergaters may, effectively, be wanna-be Nazis until they get pulled further into the alt-right/WS/Nazi web. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 4 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: The leading authorities in this country are a lot of shitty things, granted, but they aren't nazis. They are willing to court the votes of these wannabes, which is bad enough, but that doesn't make them nazis. no, but they, and by which i mean trump and associated shitheels, are both lionized by the alt right (cf loyalty to leader, will over thought) and pushing the nazi agenda (cf ICE/ "alien hotline", attempted travel bans, nationalistic rhetoric) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lokisnow Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 6 hours ago, Martell Spy said: I despise W. In fact he turned me from a moderate Democrat into someone who will never vote R. I don't get all the W love either. I got in an argument with a friend about it. However, you may want to consider that it may be terror driven. House Republicans Barely Pass a Budget. Now Comes the Hard Part. http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/10/26/house_republicans_passed_senate_s_budget_to_begin_tax_reform_process.html New Polls Suggest Trump and the GOP Won’t Get Away With This http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/10/new-polls-suggest-trump-and-the-gop-wont-get-away-with-this.html But if we bomb North Korea this weekend they will easily pass the tax cuts next week. Look shiny war! Yay merca I support everything. 94% of dem senators vote to support everything trump proposes huzzah! More bombs for everyone! Love ma country! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 11 hours ago, Tywin et al. said: This NPR podcast is the most amazing example of hypocrisy I’ve ever seen. There are three establishment Republicans pretending to be outsiders and they’re attacking the establishment for pretending to be something they’re not to protect their seats. It’s amazing. That boat sailed when the son of a former US President ran as the 'anti-establishment' candidate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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