divica Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 11 minutes ago, Mystical said: Khal Drogo in Season 1: "I will kill the men in their iron suits and tear down their stone houses. I will rape their women, take their children as slaves..." Dany has an orgasm right there. Dany Season 6 to the Dothraki: "Will you kill my enemies in their iron suits and tear down their stone houses?" Dany Season 8: She does exactly that and then some. Audience Season 8: Now this is rather abrupt. I don't understand where this is all coming from suddenly. Killing innocent children and women that surrended is hardly killing her enemies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacala Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 "Burn them all" foreshadowed from book 1. Totally G.R.R.Martin style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystical Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, Lady Rhodes said: As in, we have rooted for Dany all the other times that she did some questionable things but now we aren’t so sure. I've never rooted for Dany, except at the very beginning when she was an abused girl being sold for her brother's gain. I've said this elsewhere in another threat. People always celebrated Dany's actions because while in Essos, Dany's enemies were slavers, slave traders and barbarians. So of course many people shouted 'yaaaasss queen' when she did something to them. Now that she is in Westeros with characters the audience cares about, with a completely different type of 'enemy', her actions looks different to a lot of people. Like someone woke them out of a coma. The speed in which this is unfolding is of course bananas. But it really shouldn't surprise anyone that Dany went this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystical Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, divica said: Killing innocent children and women that surrended is hardly killing her enemies... Neither is killing the men in their iron suits who are largely conscripted small folk. They aren't her enemies either, they are fucked due to being low born and therefor given no choice but to fight for high borns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divica Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 10 minutes ago, Mystical said: Neither is killing the men in their iron suits who are largely conscripted small folk. They aren't her enemies either, they are fucked due to being low born and therefor given no choice but to fight for high borns. But they are soldiers. It is different. And the question here isn t if Danny will become more violent. It is if Danny will become madder than aerys and kill everybody in KL after they surrender to her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 I think people forget that a 1 hour episode could take place over days/weeks... I have no problem with Dany going full meltdown... if you can believe people can travel across seas and arrive at destinations in the space of one episode or even less I don't see how believing she had a meltdown is impossible. She lost her children, her closest friends, felt completely alone, was paranoid about her current advisors and rightly so, found out her only meaning in life was no longer true and someone else was the rightful heir, been shown hostility and contempt by the people she wanted to rule and help again rightly so they fear her name because of her fathers actions, been raped, been pimped out, been plotted against since birth to be killed.... the list is endless. We should be asking why she didn't turn sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Loras The Gay Posted May 13, 2019 Author Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 hour ago, StoneColdJorahMormont said: We should be asking why she didn't turn sooner. The problem is with the execution. Even for a mad person that is full of hatred in the heart killing a bunch of innocents instead of rushing to Cersei and burn the red Keep to the ground is insane. The problem is the lack of conversations with other people, so we can have a better understanding of how dany is coping with everything. D&D can't handle dialogue. She should've talked with everyone that is still sane. The last conversation we have with dany on screen she's not nearly as mad as she is in the scene with Drogon. She agrees with Tyrion and gives no indication that she is going to say fuck it to his reasoning. Other thing is, they fucking surrendered. She should've killed Cersei in a trial and could even make the dragon eat her. No one would care, she could've proved herself as a good leader but she choose the fear path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 17 minutes ago, Ser Loras The Gay said: The problem is with the execution. Even for a mad person that is full of hatred in the heart killing a bunch of innocents instead of rushing to Cersei and burn the red Keep to the ground is insane. The problem is the lack of conversations with other people, so we can have a better understanding of how dany is coping with everything. D&D can't handle dialogue. She should've talked with everyone that is still sane. The last conversation we have with dany on screen she's not nearly as mad as she is in the scene with Drogon. She agrees with Tyrion and gives no indication that she is going to say fuck it to his reasoning. Other thing is, they fucking surrendered. She should've killed Cersei in a trial and could even make the dragon eat her. No one would care, she could've proved herself as a good leader but she choose the fear path. I agree there is obviously a lot left to be pieced together by what we don't see. As for the agreeing with tyrion I might be remembering it wrongly but I'm sure she never gave an answer and left it open by just commanding greyworm to get ready. I really don't think she cares about the people of king's landing I feel she has deep seeded hatred for all that live there due to her family and father's treatment which is silly but I guess these things can get twisted. I don't have any issue piecing together her gradual decline it just went from 50 to 100 at the chime of the bells and again I can get why it went south so fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Loras The Gay Posted May 13, 2019 Author Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 minute ago, StoneColdJorahMormont said: As for the agreeing with tyrion I might be remembering it wrongly but I'm sure she never gave an answer and left it open by just commanding greyworm to get ready. She nods after he talks to her. And we got a close-up seeing her eyes being like "yeah... he's right". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Loras The Gay Posted May 13, 2019 Author Share Posted May 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, StoneColdJorahMormont said: I really don't think she cares about the people of king's landing I feel she has deep seeded hatred for all that live there due to her family and father's treatment which is silly but I guess these things can get twisted. Lol. Wtf. Why she cared about people in meeren who didn't have any attachment to her. She was supposed to be the liberator, the MISSA. Breaker of chains. She loved the free folk and small folk. She was doing for THEM. She thought she was the saviour. Like wtf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 minute ago, Ser Loras The Gay said: She nods after he talks to her. And we got a close-up seeing her eyes being like "yeah... he's right". I'm currently reswatching it so will get a better look again I must have missed it and saw only her looks at greyworm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Just now, Ser Loras The Gay said: Lol. Wtf. Why she cared about people in meeren who didn't have any attachment to her. She was supposed to be the liberator, the MISSA. Breaker of chains. She loved the free folk and small folk. She was doing for THEM. She thought she was the saviour. Like wtf. I agree with everything you pointed out here however the people of king's landing lived there of their own free will, and as I pointed out she has s reason to hate kingslanding at its people Think about the last time she heard that bell chime.. she would have been a young child.. being smuggled out of her home hearing the people cheer as the mad king's rule comes to an end and he is killed. That kinda thing would stick with you.. the moment it chimed this time round she sought revenge on all in kk for that day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Yes, Khal Drogo talked of doing terrible things. And it would not be out of character for Daenerys to do unspeakable things to every last inhabitant of the Red Keep. The problem is that Daenerys' entire self-image is the "breaker of chains". Of freeing people from tyranny. That is decidedly inconsistent with cheerfully incinerating hapless people in Flea Bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Rootbreaker Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 7 hours ago, tallTale said: Just like all the hints that she is capable of showing great compassion and intelligence. Killing for no reason ? I call busllshit. She knew they won, yet she burned innocent civilians anyways? That’s just pure evil, even Cersei wouldn’t do that. Exactly, this did not fit her character, even with hints of "Mad Queen." Maybe GRRM has this ending too, but when a characters action doesn't connect with their buildup, it's on the writers (D&D). I agree, Cersei would not have done the same thing and she is the most selfish character. 5 minutes ago, The Marquis de Leech said: Yes, Khal Drogo talked of doing terrible things. And it would not be out of character for Daenerys to do unspeakable things to every last inhabitant of the Red Keep. The problem is that Daenerys' entire self-image is the "breaker of chains". Of freeing people from tyranny. That is decidedly inconsistent with cheerfully incinerating hapless people in Flea Bottom. Ironically, she referred to herself (by herself I mean the script writers) as "Breaker of Chains" when she executed Varys. So she's still claiming that title but slaughters the innocent?? Nope, sorry. The blame needs to fall where it belongs, on the writers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Knight Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 13 minutes ago, The Marquis de Leech said: Yes, Khal Drogo talked of doing terrible things. And it would not be out of character for Daenerys to do unspeakable things to every last inhabitant of the Red Keep. The problem is that Daenerys' entire self-image is the "breaker of chains". Of freeing people from tyranny. That is decidedly inconsistent with cheerfully incinerating hapless people in Flea Bottom. And how many politicians expound endlessly during speeches about caring for the people and looking out for their interests when in reality it’s all about securing more power. A persons self image doesn’t necessarily equate to what’s inside. Even when they believe they are acting in the interest of the people. Ever hear of a guy named Hitler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Quote I guess I'm seeing it differently then. Going to a land she has no affiliation with and saving the innocent people there And reclaiming another one where the people either had a part in her father's death or stood by while their king good or bad was overthrown and his family torn from their home. Might have different feelings and levels of compassion. This may not be what germ had in mind but it sures helps me make sense of her actions and torching everyone not just cersei and her men. Everyone was guilty that day those that stood against him and those that didn't do anything or cheered when he was overthrown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Just now, Green Knight said: And how many politicians expound endlessly during speeches about caring for the people and looking out for their interests when in reality it’s all about securing more power. A persons self image doesn’t necessarily equate to what’s inside. Daenerys is a sincere fanatic. Which actually makes for a far scarier villain than a corrupt politician - were it not for the terrible, terrible execution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Knight Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 minute ago, The Marquis de Leech said: Daenerys is a sincere fanatic. Which actually makes for a far scarier villain than a corrupt politician - were it not for the terrible, terrible execution. Again, so was Hitler. That was my point. Nothing worse than a “principled” mad person with power to accomplish their goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneColdJorahMormont Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Just now, The Marquis de Leech said: Daenerys is a sincere fanatic. Which actually makes for a far scarier villain than a corrupt politician - were it not for the terrible, terrible execution. She was chaotic good that gradually turned to chaotic neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 minute ago, StoneColdJorahMormont said: I guess I'm seeing it differently then. Going to a land she has no affiliation with and saving the innocent people there And reclaiming another one where the people either had a part in her father's death or stood by while their king good or bad was overthrown and his family torn from their home. Might have different feelings and levels of compassion. This may not be what germ had in mind but it sures helps me make sense of her actions and torching everyone not just cersei and her men. Everyone was guilty that day those that stood against him and those that didn't do anything or cheered when he was overthrown. If it was simply vengeance, she'd have murdered Jaime and Tyrion without batting an eyelid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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