Wow, I never noticed that. Vol. 19

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

1 hour ago, Sandy Clegg said:

gafr is Welsh I think. But how did you get goat from 'Otho'?

Yes, gafr is Welsh, and gabhar is Gaelic.  The word gwth  / cuth / cwth / hwrdd  in Welsh means "to push, to shove, to butt", and comes from the Greek word otho / otheo,  which formed the basis for many of Lovecraft's characters, Cthulhu, Yuggoth, and I think the name of the Others and Hardhome comes from this as well.  (boc  means "goat" and that's were Bakrug comes from)

Otho  in Greek looks like   ωθώ

George's stories Tuf Voyaging and In the House of the Worm both take place on Yuggoth, the Black Goat, and the Theta, which signifies "death" in Greek is central to the stories.   I think the Theta in the middle looks like a goat's eye, and the two omegas look like the cloven hooves of a goat.  And omega signifies "the end".  Which is probably how goats got associated with death and the devil.

 

 

In the Oxford English Dictionary one of the usages of sabbath  is a "a midnight meeting of demons, sorcerers, and witches, presided over by the Devil" also called a witches sabbath, or the black sabbath. 

And I just learned that sabaoth means "army, host" so if you combine those two you get something like a necromantic army at midnight, led by the Devil.

 

[Craving Peaches]

59 minutes ago, Fun Guy from Yuggoth said:

I think the Theta in the middle looks like a goat's eye, and the two omegas look like the cloven hooves of a goat

I think Theta is also a symbol of death (and rebirth?).

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

On 6/22/2023 at 7:24 PM, Corvo the Crow said:

Night's Watch brothers probably aren't crows just because of their black clothing.

The Nights Watch is a Blackguard, and the word "Blackguard" means "dregs of the community" and "vagabonds and criminals" and "the lowest menials of a noble house", "camp followers"  and "black villains" In the Oxford English Dictionary.  (and weall means "vagabond" in Old English)

 

I just realized that they are an Army wearing Black, and sabaoth means "army, host"

The Nights Watch is a Black Sabaoth, for the Black Sabbath

 

aex  means "goat" in Latin, so there might be some wordplay with the words "crows" and "cross" with the cross signifying the X or Aex/goat.  The Black Crows ~ the Black Goats.  which is a wordplay that I think George has used previously in Sandkings, and The Stone City.  The Stone City takes place on the Crossworld, that is, the planet Aex (X), also called Empty, and ysgog means "empty" in Welsh, which is right below ysgoed which means "shadow"

 

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

9 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said:

I think Theta is also a symbol of death (and rebirth?).

The Black Theta (theta nigrum) or theta infelix ("unlucky theta") is the symbol representing death, as it was an abbreviation of Thanatos, the god of death.  (I haven't found anything that it indicates rebirth, although George and Lovecraft did use it that way and those who are associated with it are genetic engineers)

The Theta was used next to someone's name to indicate that they had died.  ꝋ crossed horizontally,  – obiit

The Theta looks exactly like a goat's eye  Θ 

In Welsh, gafr gem means "goat's eye" and in the Tree on the Hill, there is a magic amber gem that controls the Black Goat, and you look through it to see the true form of the Black Goat tree.  And during the year of the Black Goat, the Black Goat Yuggoth causes an endless night on Earth.  And seeing the Black Goat makes you go insane and/or die from fright. 

Tuf's Black ship the Ark is Yuggoth, (arcra  means "eclipse, death") the Ark's sigil is the Theta.  So, I think George thinks the way Yuggoth causes the Endless Night, is by eclipsing the sun.

 

 

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

Here is something funny, in Pughe's Welsh Dictionary:

huawdr  means "eloquent, well-spoken, effable"

huadwr  means "deceiver" "phantom" "delusive vision"

hwrdd  means "goat" and "ram" and "to push" 

hudd means "shadow"

hwda  means "to take" and "to take away"

hwdwg  means "bugbear"

hwdwl means "stark mad"

 

And Hoedus  means "goat, kid" in Latin, so adding this all up, Hodor saw the black goat, and it fried his brain, and he has been trying to tell us what he saw. 

Edited July 2, 2023 by Fun Guy from Yuggoth

[Sandy Clegg]

53 minutes ago, Fun Guy from Yuggoth said:

aex  means "goat" in Latin

can you give the reference? My dictionary gives this a 'craggy rock'

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

3 minutes ago, Sandy Clegg said:

can you give the reference? My dictionary gives this a 'craggy rock'

https://archive.org/details/harperslatindict02lewi/page/64/mode/2up?q=goat

Harper's Latin Dictionary, pg 65. 

[Sandy Clegg]

5 minutes ago, Fun Guy from Yuggoth said:

https://archive.org/details/harperslatindict02lewi/page/64/mode/2up?q=goat

Harper's Latin Dictionary, pg 65. 

Cool. Now, The Axe is also the name of the headland in north Essos where the Andals were said to originate. Near Qohor where they worship the Black Goat, and Norvos where they use axe iconography in their rituals.

Check out the shape of The Axe peninsula here, in blue:

https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Axe

Now check out the pic of this goat, in profile:

https://www.masterfile.com/image/en/600-06713962/portrait-of-domestic-goat-capra-aegagrus-hircus

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

Since I mentioned alien trees, I recently learned that in Greek the word for willow tree  is eetia,  which sounds like E.T. extraterrestrial.  (probably were Yi-Ti comes from)

And in Blackwood's The Willows, the willow tree in an extraterrestrial sentient tree that feeds on humans.

And in Clark Ashton Smith's Genius Loci, there are sentient willow trees that appear to have faces on them that feed on humans.

And in Lovecraft's The Color out of Space, a sentient meteor (goat means "fiery meteor") infects tree roots with a spreading blight very much like greyscale, that sucks everything living dry and scaly, until it crumbles.

 

And saileac  means "willow" in Gaelic which is where I think the name Selyse comes from.  So Stannis is a Nights King figure, and he has two wives who are both related to trees.  Mel is red and white with red eyes and a heart-shaped face, and a blood ruby, she is a metaphor for a weirwood and with the Night King she gives birth to shadow baby White Walkers, and Selyse gives birth to a child infected with greyscale. 

grioscail  means "the act of burning, frying, grilling"  which confirms Shireen being burned at the stake.  As the way to kill the stone men is to burn them.

saille  means "fat, grease" and greis means "fat, grease" and greisceal  is right below that, which means "red raw greasy mass" which is were the Greishka from A Song for Lya comes from.  And isn't a treatment for Greyscale to smear butter on it?  and greiska means "malice" in Norse.

grios  means "rosy" "red rash" "blotches on the skin"

 

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

15 hours ago, Sandy Clegg said:

Cool. Now, The Axe is also the name of the headland in north Essos where the Andals were said to originate. Near Qohor where they worship the Black Goat, and Norvos where they use axe iconography in their rituals.

Check out the shape of The Axe peninsula here, in blue:

https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Axe

Now check out the pic of this goat, in profile:

https://www.masterfile.com/image/en/600-06713962/portrait-of-domestic-goat-capra-aegagrus-hircus

 

That's awesome about the Axe peninsula, I am bummed that you caught that before I did.  And the axe/aex wordplay is great, and it probably goes deep.  First thing I thought of is that Areo Hotah carries a huge axe, and aries  means "ram" and hoed means "goat" and aex means "goat"  arieto  means "to ram, to butt"

 

I think the names and religions of the Free Cities of Essos are black goat / weirwood / Illuminati related. 

Pentos = pentagram

Lys = lleas  means "death, slaughter" in Welsh, they worship Saagael in Lys, seaghail  means "goat" and sgail means "shadow" and Saagael is a faceless god, that wants blood sacrifice.

Myr -- sounds like "mirror" and in Gaelic sgail/sgath  mean "mirror" and "shadow" and "astral body"  and "Ghost"  Also mire  means "nightmare" and "swamp"   and sgath ~ Shuggoth and Yuggoth, with gwth  meaning "goat"

 

Lorath, a rath  is a ringfort, or fairy hill.  Jaqen says they worship Boash in Lorath, Jachin and Boaz are the black and white pillars of Freemasonry.  The All-seeing Eye of Providence is the God's Eye.  The mazes leading to the underworld are a metaphor for weirwood caves.  (Highgarden has a maze with weirwoods at the center, bull / bole at the center of the labyrinth is Minotaur/Moloch symbolism.)

 

Tyrosh --tiarach means "butt" in Gaelic ["goat/ gwth is synonymous with "to butt"]   tyreaux  means "tyrants" in French, tyrus  means "Tyrian purple" in Latin and tyrannus means "sovereign, king, tyrant" and torus  means "ring" and "bulging hill"  tjossi  means "goat" in Norse  and tjoru-skinn  means "tarred skin" or "black skin"  and in French tuer means "to kill, to slaughter, death" and terreux  means "dirty, unhealthy, ashen" and terreur  means "terror" terrer means "to burrow"

 

Norvos is sovron / sauron  backwards.  sabran  is the Gaelic spelling of "sovereign" and is right below the word for sabbath, sabaoth. [bren  means "sovereign, king"] Also Saur  means "free" in Gaelic.  [I just learned the swr iawn  which sounds like "Sauron" means "very-irritable" in Welsh]

The bearded priests of Norvos wear hair-shirts, they are shaggy/bearded priests, skegg  means "shaggy, bearded" and skuggi/skyggi  means "shadow" (Skagos is where the Shaggy Black Goats are found)  They are wedded to their axe/aex/goat. And they are branded with an axe/aex.  The sigil of Norvos depicts the All-seeing Eye of Providence, and Three Bells.  In French timbre  means "bell"~ weirwood, cadaire means "bell" and cadar  means "hermaphrodite" (Baphomet reference)

 

Qohor, a few different possibilities here which all work:  (Corlos is George's planet name that means "hell")

coeur  means "heart" in French

cawr  means "devil" in Welsh

coire  means "cauldron" in Gaelic

kuhar  means "cavity, hole, chasm" in Hindi (and kohee  means "nook, recess" in Greek)

qahr means "grave, tomb" in Hindi

Vargo Hoat is from there and he worships the Black Goat, varg means "wolf" and hoedus  means "goat"  ~ Bran + Hodor

 

Braavos their sigil is very similar to the Masonic Square and Compass emblem of Freemasonry.  The House of Black and White is a death cult that worships Baphomet, with a lot of Freemason/Illuminati symbolism.  Shape-shifting assassins, and bankers controlling world events in a grand conspiracy.   

In Greek myth, a giant bronze automaton named Talus guarded the Island where the Minotaur's labyrinth was. 

And the city Antwerp got its name from a legend about a giant called Antigoon who lived near the Scheldt river. He exacted a toll from passing boatmen, and for those who refused, he severed one of their hands and threw it into the river. He was slain by a young soldier named Brabo

Bravo  means "hired assassin"

The purple dye that they use for their sails comes from a snail called Murex Brandaris.  That dye is called Tyrion purple.

 

Volantis means "flying, flying fish" in Latin.  That's all I have for that. 

 

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

Ha, just figured out where the name "Ser Pounce" comes from.

In French tom-pounce  means "dwarf" and Pounce is a tomcat owned by Tommen.  And George loves to use words that mean "dwarf"

[Sandy Clegg]

20 minutes ago, Fun Guy from Yuggoth said:

Ha, just figured out where the name "Ser Pounce" comes from.

In French tom-pounce  means "dwarf" and Pounce is a tomcat owned by Tommen.  And George loves to use words that mean "dwarf"

Well, Tom Pouce is the French translation of Tom Thumb, so ... maybe this is where you're getting that? Although pouce and puss kind of sound alike. I dunno. 

Check my post here for more on Qohor, Lorath and Norvos god connections

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by Sandy Clegg

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

11 hours ago, Sandy Clegg said:

Tom Pouce is the French translation of Tom Thumb, so ... maybe this is where you're getting that?

In Cassell's French dictionary gives tom-pounce as "dwarf, Tom Thumb"

I just flipped that dictionary open and saw gouffre means "abyss, gulf, pit" and in Latin barathrum means "abyss"

gafr means goat in Welsh, and Joffrey is a metaphor for the sun, and he gets strangled and his face turns black.  Black sun ~ abyss, goat.  Strangler ~ Stranger.  He briefly wears the Nights King crown of eclipse before dying.

---

Edit to Add: I just remembered that ghota / ghotu / ghotna means "to strangle, to choke" in Hindi, the Goat is the strangler.

---

on the same page goulot means "neck" and goule means "ghoul, swallow, neck, gulp" and gourme means "strangles"  and Lovecraft used a bunch of words that mean "swallow" to mean "eclipse"  and juguler  means "to strangle, to torment"

 

in that same page, gouin means "bad-lot" and Jon got a bad lot in life. 

and goujon means "bait" and avaler le goujon means "to swallow the bait, to fall for it"  And the Isle of Faces is Avalon, and Jojen's dad went there, and Jojen takes Bran to the Otherworld/Avalon Beyond the Wall.  And the Reeds are a stand-in for the CoTF who live in the Otherworld. (jejune means "skinny, starving" and the Reeds are small and skinny)

I just realized that weall  means "death" in Anglo-Saxon, so Beyond the Weall  means in the Otherworld.

Edited July 4, 2023 by Fun Guy from Yuggoth

[Seams]

10 hours ago, Fun Guy from Yuggoth said:

Ha, just figured out where the name "Ser Pounce" comes from.

In French tom-pounce  means "dwarf" and Pounce is a tomcat owned by Tommen.  And George loves to use words that mean "dwarf"

We know that the author frequently manages to convey more than one layer of meaning, so you may be right. My own interpretation is that "Ser Pounce" is a slant rhyme with "serpents." Tommen has a dragon kitty.

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

brunierenstein  means "bloodstone, burnishing stone" in German (brun  means "shining" and "burnished" in Anglo Saxon)

and I just saw that ghota  means "burnishing stone" and "strangle" in Hindi  

ysgoth  means "to scour, to purge" in Welsh and sgur  means "to burnish, to purge" in Gaelic

The Black Goat Yuggoth is the Bloodstone.  And a fragment of The Bloodstone controls the Black Goat

 

The Bloodstone is the Shining Trapezohedron from The Haunter of the Dark, it is a black and red stone that is worshiped at the Church of Starry Wisdom, and it summons the Black Goat, Nyarlathotep ("black stone" in Greek).  The first priest of the Church of Starry Wisdom was Nephren-Ka (nwyfreant means "a sphere in heaven" in Welsh, "nephritic" is synonymous with "lunacy" and "moon" in Gaelic), who was a Black Pharaoh who was a lunatic that did unspeakable deeds and worshiped the Black Stone and his name was stricken from all records.  This is the basis of 13th Lord Commander, who I think was the Nights King.

 

I think I finally figured out where the phrase "Shining Trapezohedron" came from

sath  means "satan" and seith  means "seven" in Welsh --and everything in the Church of Starry Wisdom is based on the number 7.  And they worship the Stranger who is a wanderer from far places. 

sathwr*  means "treader" and to trapes means "to tread" [synonyms of "wanderer"] and trap stone is a kind of basalt black stone, trapps  means "tread" and the tower where he finds the Trapezohedron has a trap door.

yslepan means "to trap" and yslipan means "to burnish. polish" and "to burnish" means "to shine" = Shining Black Stone, which was fashioned on Yuggoth, out of a piece of Yuggoth, which is itself made of Black Stone (fused black stone, oily black stone)  And the Bloodstone is a "burnishing stone"

The "hedron" part of Trapezohedron might come from hoedus "goat" and hwrdd "to push, to butt"

 

*Tsathoggua is from sath/sathwr  + gwyar  = "treader on gore"

 

 

I just listened to George's short story the Skin Trade  for the first time, and the werewolves' headquarters is called Black Stone.  And I don't think he ever mentioned it, but the story clearly takes place in Dubuque, Iowa from the descriptions he gives.  Portraits of his Children is also set in Dubuque, and parts of Fevre Dream take place there also.

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

Quote

[Arya] could hear the acolytes of the Cult of Starry Wisdom atop their scrying tower, singing to the evening stars.

One of the usages of "scrying" is gazing into a crystal orb.  And the Church of Starry Wisdom was devoted to gazing into the Shining Trapezohedron crystal, which was a piece of Yuggoth.  And the acolytes of the Cult of Starry Wisdom are gazing into a black orb among the stars in the night sky.  And the Bloodstone Emperor founded the Cult of Starry Wisdom and lost his mind from gazing into the Bloodstone, that is, Yuggoth the Black Goat. 

 

I just realized the word play on "Empyreal" and "Emperor", with the Black Pharaoh's name Nephren-Ka, and the Bloodstone Emperor.  Nwyfreant  means "empyreal sphere" or "heavenly sphere" 

Bloodstone Emperor ~ Bloodstone Emypyreal ~ Bloodstone in the night sky

[Sandy Clegg]

5 hours ago, Seams said:

We know that the author frequently manages to convey more than one layer of meaning, so you may be right. My own interpretation is that "Ser Pounce" is a slant rhyme with "serpents." Tommen has a dragon kitty.

Just because I was curious:

Quote

pounce /powns/ 

noun

1. Sandarach, cuttle-bone, or other fine powder formerly used for preparing a writing surface or absorbing ink
2. Coloured powder shaken through perforations to mark a patternon a surface beneath

Quote

sandarach or sandarac /sanˈdə-rak/ 

noun

1. Arsenic monosulphide, realgar
2. The resin (in full gum sandarach or sandarac resin) of the Moroccan sandarach tree (Collitris quadrivalvis) powdered to form pounce and used in making varnish

 

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

6 hours ago, Sandy Clegg said:

Just because I was curious:

[pounce]

In the OED there are several interesting uses of "pounce" one is "the paw of a lion, claw" and it is also a blacksmithing term.

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

Just realized that if the Empyreal Bloodstone is the second moon, the act of usurping his sister is the second moon eclipsing the sun and moon during the Long Night. And that the story about Emperors in Asshai might just be a mythologized retelling of the events of the Long Night, like with Oberyn vs the Mountain; Bran's coma dream about the Mountain eclipsing the sun; Selwyn of the Mirror Shield; Galladon of Morn; the Last Hero; Azor Ahai; the hero with the monkey tail; Euron's nightmare vision, etc.

And the Lion of Night is the Ruler of Night, the Night King, when the Second Moon is dominating the night sky. (bran- means "lion" and "cauldron" and "black" and "to hover over" and bren  means "king" and brun- means "bloodstone"  and of course celtic Bran was a giant floating head that had a cauldron that brings the dead back to life, and Bran is Fenrir the Winged Wolf that swallows the sun at Ragnarok)

Dany has amethyst eyes, and she is constantly compared to the silver moon.  And her brother got the Nights King crown of eclipse when Drogo poured molten gold over his head from a cauldron.

 

In the OED hell-kettle  means "a deep black gulf, or abyss; a bottomless pool" and the Stark's have a hell-kettle/ bottomless pool in front of their weirwood.

Edited July 4, 2023 by Fun Guy from Yuggoth

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

In gnostistism, the demi-urge that created the material world is a malevolent lion-headed serpent god named Yaldabaoth.  And that the material world is a prison he built to torment humans.  "Yaldabaoth (Yahweh) is regarded as the malevolent Demiurge and false god of the Old Testament who generated the material universe and keeps the souls trapped in physical bodies, imprisoned in the world full of pain and suffering that he created"  They call the material world the "Kingdom of Darkness"

Yaldabaoth is commonly depicted with his lion-head eclipsing the sun.  (Yaldabaoth / Yuggoth)

And the etymologies that they give for Yaldabaoth include "the King of Chaos" and "darkness" and "child of darkness" and "begetter of armies" [sabaoth] 

Which all sound like the Lion of Night eclipsing the sun and the Undead Army coming forth to punish mankind on the Black Sabbath.  When Yaldabaoth comes forth, he creates a Kingdom of Darkness, full of pain and suffering, to torment humans. 

 

 

Also, the Chimera is a monster that has the lion's head, body of a goat, and serpents tail.  And Chimera also means when two eggs are fertilized by two different fathers in one gestational cycle and merge into one fetus in utero.   And Tyrion is a Chimera as he has the genetic stock from Tywin and Aerys.  [Twyin means "twin" in Welsh and all of his children were sets of fraternal twins, but Tyrion absorbed his twin in the womb,  aerr means "madness" in Norse" and aer means "aerial" and aeriagh means "volatile, haunted, flighty" in Gaelic]  And Tyrion was said to have been a hermaphrodite, and born with a tail--both Chimera traits.