Israel - Hamas War V

[Ran]

4 minutes ago, Rippounet said:

Hamas does have a lot of Soviet-era anti-tank missiles, with a sprinkle of Iranian and North Korean stuff.

So, uncertain territory here, but an apparent Hamas video has been floating around showing an arsenal of NLAWs  and AT4s, Western and pretty modern weaponry, with a claim that it came from Ukrainians. That particular part has been questioned and it's believed the video may be Hamas doing misdirection in line with what Russia or Iran would like to see put about. But that there's at least a small stockpile of modern Western anti-tank equipment, sourced from god-knows-where (captured by Russian troops and filtered into the black market, maybe, seems to be what the Ukrainians and Western intelligence are saying), is probably true.

[Mudguard]

1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

Whose problem is it then? You can't say people in Gaza don't need to end Hamas and then also say Israel shouldn't be taking the measures they think they need to do so to end Hamas. The latter has to go if you want peace in the region and the former are the only two parties that are going to be able to do it. If you say neither Israelis nor Palestinians should do whatever it takes to destroy Hamas, that means you're okay with them still being in power.

israel will not achieve peace by removing hamas in the manner in which they are doing.  all this death and destruction will just create another similar organization that will be the same or even worse than hamas.  we see this time and time again.

Edited October 25, 2023 by Mudguard

[Rippounet]

And let me add that poiting out the asymmetry does not mean taking Hamas fighters lightly. Even Soviet-era weaponry and makeshift weapons will be efficient when wielded by fanatics willing to die for their cause - which they will be.

Going in will be playing right into Hamas's hands, giving them opportunities to inflict massive casualties through human sacrifices.

7 minutes ago, Ran said:

So, uncertain territory here, but an apparent Hamas video has been floating around showing an arsenal of NLAWs  and AT4s, Western and pretty modern weaponry, with a claim that it came from Ukrainians. That particular part has been questioned and it's believed the video may be Hamas doing misdirection in line with what Russia or Iran would like to see put about. But that there's at least a small stockpile of modern Western anti-tank equipment, sourced from god-knows-where (captured by Russian troops and filtered into the black market, maybe, seems to be what the Ukrainians and Western intelligence are saying), is probably true.

If true, that would be terrible, on several levels.
 

[Ran]

Via Foreign Affairs, some fresh polling data of Gazans, collected just days before October 7th. It's in line with the previous polling I showed, particularly a preference for a two-state solution.

[Zorral]

Even the relentlessly smooth even the rockiest, sharpest evils over in soothing tone -- even all the programs on NPR today are filled with voices criticizing Israel and Egypt, demanding relief and aid, power, and hundreds and hundreds of trucks per day into Gaza.  Some of these voices, particularly those who work with humanitarian and medical aid groups, are barely able to hold back their weeping of desperation.

 

[Rippounet]

6 minutes ago, Ran said:

Via Foreign Affairs, some fresh polling data of Gazans, collected just days before October 7th. It's in line with the previous polling I showed, particularly a preference for a two-state solution.

Good stuff, and interesting conclusions:

Quote

 

To break the cycle, the Israeli government must now exercise restraint. The Hamas-led government may be uninterested in peace, but it is empirically wrong for Israeli political leaders to accuse all Gazans of the same. In fact, most Gazans are open to a permanent, peaceful solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Yet the views of the people who live in Gaza are still often misrepresented in public discourse, even as surveys such as Arab Barometer consistently show how different these narratives are from reality.

In the immediate term, Israeli and especially U.S. leaders need to secure the safety of Gazan civilians, 1.4 million of whom have already been displaced. The United States should partner with the United Nations to create clear humanitarian corridors and protected zones, and Washington should contribute to the UN’s appeal for $300 million in aid to protect Palestinian civilians—a step dozens of U.S. senators have said they will support. Finally, Israel and the United States must recognize that the Palestinian people are essential partners in finding a lasting political settlement, not an obstacle in the way of that worthy goal. If the two countries seek only military solutions, they will likely drive Gazans into the arms of Hamas, guaranteeing renewed violence in the years ahead.

 

A bit of goodwill could potentially go a long way. It's not too late for a change in strategy. Let's hope the US can exert some influence on the Israeli government.
And though it's a thorny issue, some kind of ceasefire and negotiation (for the hostages) also allowing for humanitarian aid could save many thousands of lives, especially if an alternative to Hamas can be found to progressively take control of the Gaza strip. A man can dream.