Lady Blackfish Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 No! You're wrong! Lalalalala I can't hear you lalalalala. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 No! You're wrong! Lalalalala I can't hear you lalalalala. No need to deny it and close your ears. It's plausible she could be alive. The reasons for her suicide always seemed, while important, not important enough to commit suicide over for a woman with "laughing" eyes. And there is GRRM's saying her body was never found. What is needed for me to really get behind a theory on her being alive is an explanation of why she faked her death and/or an explanation of what she has been doing all these years or the years until she died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyrazer Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Well I don't see all the fascination floating around Ashara. To me, she was just some highborn lady who carked it. The only reasons I see people being so interested in her was the way she died and that she was the love interest of Ned, one of the most significant characters in the story. Other than that, what makes her so significant? She's not really important at all to the overall story IMO and her not dying and suddenly emerging to swing the story in some dramatic return after something like over 15 years is lame IMO. This is ASOIAF, tough, gritty and brutal...not melodramatic and corny "Days of our Lives" or whatever midday soap-opera crap. Her "coming back from the dead" brings no substance to the story IMO, so she should remain what she is now, a dead figure of the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blackfish Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 I really don't see her making a dramatic re-emergence, but she might have played some role in the preservation of the Targaryens, just one facet of it. Nobody's left to care much so why would one even anticipate asome big resurrection scene? But I have to agree with Jon Targaryen, she's made too much of in my opinion to not matter any more, even if she is dead *now* there might well be more to her disappearance. Thus far her mentions feel anomalous if they don't go anywhere, and I don't think she's Jon's mother so that rules out that for me. The fun is just anticipating mysteries, this is one of a number people like to attach on to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratonice Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Ned is definitly dead. Brienne's POV won't make much sense to me if she dies where she is now but I don't really see how she could get out of it either (unless some unexpected helper/-s show up or something). Sandor, I never for a second believed he actually was dead and I still don't. Davos probably won't survive the entire series but he'll kill Mel before he dies so he probably gets out of White Harbour alive one way or another. Loras is burned but probably not quite as badly as reported so I believe he'll live a while longer. Benjen could be either dead or alive at this point. There's something more to his story but I'm not sure whether we'll learn of it from him (meaning he's alive) or from someone else (meaning he's dead). Baby Aegon is most likely dead but it won't really surprise me if he turns out to be alive after all either. Ashara Dayne is similar to Benjen in the sense that there's more to the story regardless of whether she's still alive or not. The story of how she died don't add up to me but that doesn't necessarily mean she's still alive 15 years later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Spidey Posted December 14, 2007 Author Share Posted December 14, 2007 Baby Aegon could be alive, because if all three dragon heads need to be Targaryens, he would logically be one alongside with Dany and Jon. Even if Jon is not Targ (and I believe he is), Aegon could be the one ruling the Westeros when everything ends, since Dany can't have children. If alive, he could either be in the free cities or SPOILER: ADWDposing as young Griff It has already been mentioned why he can't be Quentyn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errant Bard Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 because if all three dragon heads need to be Targaryens,Good thing GRRM confirmed they don't need to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Spidey Posted December 14, 2007 Author Share Posted December 14, 2007 Good thing GRRM confirmed they don't need to be. Doesn't mean they can't be. Excuse me if I sometimes seem uninformed, but being 16 and croatian I haven't had a chance of attending fan meetings. I'm also quite new to the board, but am proud of my overall knowledge of the series and willing to learn more. So keep correcting me, and even teaching me, but don't make me look dumb. I don't think it is a thing you MUST know. Keep on the good work, didn't mean to insult anyone. :bow: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Excuse me if I sometimes seem uninformed, but being 16 and croatian I haven't had a chance of attending fan meetings. If you start attending BWB meetings, you'll find that talking about the books is usually the last thing anyone does. Use stuff like the Concordance at the Citadel and the Chapter Summary site if you want to bone up on knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Spidey Posted December 14, 2007 Author Share Posted December 14, 2007 If you start attending BWB meetings, you'll find that talking about the books is usually the last thing anyone does. Use stuff like the Concordance at the Citadel and the Chapter Summary site if you want to bone up on knowledge. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Spidey Posted December 14, 2007 Author Share Posted December 14, 2007 double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errant Bard Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Keep on the good work, didn't mean to insult anyone. :bow:You didn't insult anyone, and my answer was actually not snarky, it is good that GRRM said the third head didn't need to be a Targaryen, otherwise Aegon would not stay dead, worse than Syrio Forel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowbinding shoe Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Hey ser spider. I think you should look up the SSM on the Citadel. They're answers Martin gave on various questions on the story and quite interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elrick Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 How about Theon? Is he still a captive or maybe they killed him and posed him as a captive to Catelyn. I theorize that Theon may be alive and might have gotten away some how or he's still at the dreadfort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 How about Theon? Is he still a captive or maybe they killed him and posed him as a captive to Catelyn. I theorize that Theon may be alive and might have gotten away some how or he's still at the dreadfort. GRRM has said Theon is alive through the SSM. ETA: the last three words. I am not whiting it out because I feel anything in the SSM is not really a spoiler. PM if you feel different and I will consider whiting it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyrazer Posted December 15, 2007 Share Posted December 15, 2007 How about Theon? Is he still a captive or maybe they killed him and posed him as a captive to Catelyn. I theorize that Theon may be alive and might have gotten away some how or he's still at the dreadfort. He's going to be one of the POVs in ADWD, so.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwywen Posted December 15, 2007 Share Posted December 15, 2007 No one mentioned Marillion? I think he might not be dead. His skycell was empty, but that doesn't automatically mean he's dead or has jumped or fallen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mezeh Posted December 16, 2007 Share Posted December 16, 2007 Sandor – most probably alive and we have seen him as gravedigger. Gregor – undead. Syrio – never seen dead but I doubt he is still alive. Benjen – maybe still alive, dead or undead. We will eventually learn about his fate but I’m not sure that in ADWD. Loras – alive yet but may die from his wounds. Davos – IMO he will live for much longer. GRRM is not done with him. Aegon – great mystery here. He may be alive and well. It was discussed many times on boards but there was possibility to swap him during suck of KL. There is another possibility that he is dead but we will see some person posing as him. And there is a possibility that we will see fake and real Aegons both. Ashara Dayne – another mystery. We don’t have completely convincing motive for her suicide and her body never was recovered. If she is alive then she must have very good reason to stay “dead†for all these years. Tyrek – may appear eventually but his fate may remain unknown to the very end of the book. Gerion – most probably dead but he will yet be mentioned. Raynald Westerling – most probably alive otherwise there would be few reasons to mention him in AFFC at all. Ned – clearly dead. Arthur Dayne – dead and buried. There is no reason for him to be resurrected. Jon Connington – the most intriguing character for me. He is the only one who apparently willingly faked rumors about his death and who hided for a long time to make everyone believe in this rumor. He is also the only Rhaegar’s friend who remained alive and we know that he was not just a friend but “dear friendâ€. SPOILER: ADWD We learn in Tyrion’s spoiler chapter that Grif is old friend of Illirio and that he is apparently on equal rate with him. So whatever Varys and Illirio plotted for many years Grif was and is part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyrazer Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Anyway heres what i think: Sandor - Alive, probably gravedigger Gregor - Sorta deadish (Gregorstein) Syrio - DEAD! Benjen - Most likely alive (maybe coldhands) Loras - Alive, but sustained permanent injuries Davos - Alive Aegon - DEAD! I hate "Blast From The Past" scenarios. I like my shit believable and my dead characters DEAD! Ashara - DEAD! See previous posts and Aegon reason Ned - DEAD! Arthur - DEAD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mezeh Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 About Davos. GRRM gave good reasons to believe that he is dead both after the second and the third book. Now after the fourth book we again have reasons to believe that Davos is dead. This becomes tradition. I’m wondering what will be when we will finally finish to read ADWD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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