Hereward Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Thank you, Cristiano. As he walked up to take the penalty I said "£20 says he misses it". Two people took me up on it. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLU-RAY Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='Hereward' post='1365337' date='May 22 2008, 00.21']Thank you, Cristiano. As he walked up to take the penalty I said "£20 says he misses it". Two people took me up on it. :)[/quote] :cheers: That and Cech's saves earlier on were really the only bright spots; the finishing from Chelsea was either frustratingly inept, or unlucky (see: two off the woodwork). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='The Inquisitor' post='1364770' date='May 21 2008, 23.05']Not only it was badly taken, but it was clearly illegal.[/quote] No, it wasn't. [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penalty_kick_(football)"]Learn the laws of the game[/url] you follow, n00b :P And I am really sure that Ronaldo will be at United next season. [quote name='Maltaran' post='1364787' date='May 21 2008, 23.17']Jesus Christ, the first thing they teach you with penalties is not to try and mess with the keeper - just run up and hit it as hard as you can. Thank God Terry missed.[/quote] That is the way that Ronaldo has taken almost every (and, in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it was every) penalty this season and he's had a very good record. He messed it up a bit last night by stopping too far away from the ball. Also, Cech is a great keeper. He expected Ronaldo to stop and he didn't flinch (Ronaldo stopping early helped with that, though). Making the run-up direct would have been [i]more[/i] surprising. But finally, above all that, it was just a poor penalty kick. He's been successful as the PK taker because he's been good at hitting his penalties hard and low into the corner. Last night it was too high and close to Cech. I was as surprised as anyone to find myself feeling sad that Terry missed. He didn't deserve that. He had a great game and his header off the line to deny Giggs in extra time was simply brilliant. United disappeared for about 30mins in the second half. They didn't fall asleep, because their defending was superb, but like against Barcelona, there was an extended period of time when they couldn't retain possession or string passes together. I felt that United had all the best moves and combinations in the match. The little passing sequence between Scholes and Brown to set up Ronaldo's goal was superb, as was Rooney's long range pass over the Chelsea defence to Ronaldo to set up a Tevez chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='Hereward' post='1363731' date='May 21 2008, 14.05']Sorry, run that by me once again. Ashton and Ferdinand, our two best players, for whom? :stunned:[/quote] I was chatting to a mate of mine about this last night, and while he was surprised too, he made what I thought was a reasonable point, that West Ham are trying to reduce their wage bill. It'd still be pretty sucky though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inquisitor Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='Paddiano Ronaldo' post='1365353' date='May 22 2008, 10.49']No, it wasn't. [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penalty_kick_%28football%29"]Learn the laws of the game[/url] you follow, n00b :P And I am really sure that Ronaldo will be at United next season.[/quote] STFU, you turnip... :P Ah, the delicious irony... you want me to follow and stand corrected by a page that reads "After the referee blows his [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whistle"]whistle[/url], which is the signal for the kick to be taken, the kicker must kick the ball in a forward direction (not necessarily at the goal, however this is almost always the case)" ;) Now seriously, it was badly taken because a player can't dead stop in his run or feint he is going to shoot. A "paradinha" is a whole different thing because the player never fully stops. (don't know the term in English, though) Again, that page did not say a vital thing concerning the validity of a PK: once a player arms his leg he must execute the kick. That's why feinting you are going to shoot in a PK is not legal. Not that C-R did that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeric Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 I was chanting miss when Ronaldo went up to take the penalty. He did just seem to fall out of the game after the goal, maybe that was just because of chelsea or him just being typical Ronaldo on a big stage I don't know. But saying that Ballack wasn't much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 We are the Champions! I am happy that Man United won but i absolutely hate penelties, i find them very difficult to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inquisitor Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='SirRots' post='1365376' date='May 22 2008, 11.39']I was chanting miss when Ronaldo went up to take the penalty. He did just seem to fall out of the game after the goal, maybe that was just because of chelsea or him just being typical Ronaldo on a big stage I don't know. But saying that Ballack wasn't much better.[/quote] Don't be unfair... he scored a good goal in a sensational header, and he was the biggest Manure threat to Chelski's defense. He was their best player yesternight IMHO. And don't forget that Zico, Platini, Socrates, Baggio, Baresi and Maradona all missed crucial penaltys in WC PK shootouts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Inquisitor, I'm not sure what's wrong with the quote you give; it may be obvious, but it's just an expansion of what the laws of the game says. I think you are wrong about the stopping thing and the "arming of the leg" thing. [url="http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/federation/laws%5fof%5fthe%5fgame%5f0708%5f10565.pdf"]Here[/url] is the current official laws of the game, and they are pretty much the same as that page, though more terse. Check Law 14 - The Penalty kick. There is no mention of the player's run up or feinting or stopping a kick. And I cant see it mentioned anywhere else in the rules. Like I said, I've seen Ronaldo do it all season long and no referee has penalised him for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='SirRots' post='1365376' date='May 22 2008, 10.39']He did just seem to fall out of the game after the goal, maybe that was just because of chelsea or him just being typical Ronaldo on a big stage I don't know. But saying that Ballack wasn't much better.[/quote] I wouldn't have said that at all. He gave Essien a pretty rough time of it, sending him the wrong way several times and opened a load of space for himself to get a cross in (notably most of these times, Joe Cole hadn't been able to get back to help Essien in time). United disappeared out of the game in an attacking sense for most of the second half. I dont think Ronaldo was any worse than any other player in this regard. Thankfully, they snapped out of it at the end of the second half and in extra time. [quote name='SirRots' post='1365376' date='May 22 2008, 10.39']him just being typical Ronaldo on a big stage I don't know[/quote] I still dont get this sentiment. What does the guy have to do to lose this tag? He's scored in the champions league final, the FA Cup final, the League Cup final (albeit against weak teams), the semi-finals of the European Championships and he's the top scorer in the two biggest competitions he was in this year. Yes, undoubtedly, he performs better against weaker teams who are unable to cope with his best asset, his pace, but he's no slouch against good teams either. If the rationale is that he's just not as effective against good teams as he is against poor teams because he is able to completely blow them away, then I think that's pretty weak. It reads like people trying to find some overriding flaw with the guys abilities because they don't like him. Of course, I'm biased, but I'm fully willing to accept and admit that he's arrogant, petulant and can be a dick, and I still dont think that claim is warranted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Loved it. Man I was ecstatic last night. My feelings throughout the match were sort of rollercoastered like this: First half: Man U simply the better side. Great goal by Ronaldo, who shut up his naysayers who claim he doesn't score in important matches. Great header by Tevez, amazing save by Cech. Another chance for Tevez to tap the ball in but he just missed full contact. Man Man U is going to take this one by storm. Deflected ball by Essien, mud goal by Lampard. Typical Chelsea, this is what I loathe them so, they always get the results in ugly ways. Half-time. Second half: Hello Man U? Anyone there? Being overrun by Chelsea! Hit the post. Hit the bar. Aaargh. Extra time. Giggs does it!!! But no, Terry sticks his big head in. Penalties. Oh no, surely not Ronaldo to the penalty spot. He missed against Barca as well. Ah fuck!! Terry slips, Man U given a second chance. VD SAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Wizard Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 That was a good game. Chelsea hit the woodwork thrice including Terry's penalty. The final night of the SPL tonight, at last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Two things we can take from yesterday's match that had been brought up by one or two people on this forum earlier. 1) Ronaldo not scoring in big matches. I've heard this sentiment before and disagreed with it. Now he's silenced that argument completely with a great header, towering over Chelsea's defense and putting it cleanly away. You could see he was massively disappointed by the lucky Chelsea equalizer though, he thought his goal made the difference. I thought he held his own against Chelsea's superp defenders, it's not like playing a low-level EPL team where he can run past everything. 2) The idea that vd Sar is having anything less than yet another excellent season. The penalty save was great, Anelka's penalty was not that poorly shot, it's just vd Sar knew where it was going. He was very close to taking Cashley's penalty just before as well. Plus he had a great save in the first half when Ballack pushed Ferdinand down and his header from 3 yards was stopped by VD Sar. He was a rock. As for Man U on the whole, what a great year they have had. Apparantly Ferguson said at the start of the season that this was the best side he ever played with. Maybe that's a bit of an exaggeration. Maybe not. But they are very, very good. I can't say there's a singple player in the squad who performed poorly. VD Sar in goal was good. Ferdinand/Vidic a great block. Evra magnificent, only his passing needs improvement. Brown very solid. Hargreaves ha sreally grown up at Man U , I thought he was a wet blanket before. Park has performed well when he played as has Fletcher. Carrick a good season, Scholes fantastic really. Nani and Anderson proved sublime acquisitions. Ronaldo best player in the world. Tevez even when not scoring as much still a very hard worker and handy in keeping possesion. Rooney, well I suppose you could say that he has had a lesser season. Not a bad one, but he didn't score much at all. He did work hard for the team and gave plenty of assist, but as a pure striker I hope he can improve some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inquisitor Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='Paddiano Ronaldo' post='1365387' date='May 22 2008, 11.52']I think you are wrong about the stopping thing and the "arming of the leg" thing. [url="http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/federation/laws%5fof%5fthe%5fgame%5f0708%5f10565.pdf"]Here[/url] is the current official laws of the game, and they are pretty much the same as that page, though more terse. Check Law 14 - The Penalty kick. There is no mention of the player's run up or feinting or stopping a kick. And I cant see it mentioned anywhere else in the rules. Like I said, I've seen Ronaldo do it all season long and no referee has penalised him for it.[/quote] Well, it does mention player's feinting to take the Pk. Check out page 125, as it explains Law 14 to refs: [quote]Feinting to take a penalty kick to confuse opponents is permitted as part of football. However, if in the opinion of the referee the feinting is considered an act of unsporting behaviour, the player shall be cautioned.[/quote] It seem you are right, and according to the Laws of the Game it can be done. Funny, because I was taught as a child that you could not by my coaches. Moreover, I was hearing the radio as I went to sleep yesterday, and the journalists and former players in it said it was illegal. Anyway, I might be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inquisitor Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 By the way, the madness has begun... [url="http://www.flickr.com/photos/wkwong/2513288700/"]http://www.flickr.com/photos/wkwong/2513288700/[/url] :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='Calibandar' post='1365402' date='May 22 2008, 11.14']As for Man U on the whole, what a great year they have had. Apparantly Ferguson said at the start of the season that this was the best side he ever played with. Maybe that's a bit of an exaggeration. Maybe not. But they are very, very good. I can't say there's a singple player in the squad who performed poorly. VD Sar in goal was good. Ferdinand/Vidic a great block. Evra magnificent, only his passing needs improvement. Brown very solid. Hargreaves ha sreally grown up at Man U , I thought he was a wet blanket before. Park has performed well when he played as has Fletcher. Carrick a good season, Scholes fantastic really. Nani and Anderson proved sublime acquisitions. Ronaldo best player in the world. Tevez even when not scoring as much still a very hard worker and handy in keeping possesion. Rooney, well I suppose you could say that he has had a lesser season. Not a bad one, but he didn't score much at all. He did work hard for the team and gave plenty of assist, but as a pure striker I hope he can improve some.[/quote] A lot of people are of the opinion that Carrick isn't good enough for United. I don't agree and I'm glad to have him there, but I do think that the team's biggest weakness is that we don't have a committed leader of a midfielder any more. This team would undoubtedly be Fergie's best if we had a Roy Keane in there. I maintain the man was the best player in the world around 1999-2002, but players of that sort don't generally get recognised for Player of the year awards. The number of times he single-handedly drove United to get the result beggars belief. He was one of the most driven, committed players I've ever seen and he was a huge part of United's dominance of the 90s. [quote name='The Inquisitor' post='1365406' date='May 22 2008, 11.17']Well, it does mention player's feinting to take the Pk. Check out page 125, as it explains Law 14 to refs:[/quote] D'oh! Right at the start. Can't believe I missed that. [quote name='The Inquisitor' post='1365406' date='May 22 2008, 11.17']Funny, because I was taught as a child that you could not by my coaches. Moreover, I was hearing the radio as I went to sleep yesterday, and the journalists and former players in it said it was illegal.[/quote] It may well be that it used to be the rule, but they dropped it. Remember that the goalkeeper used to not be allowed to wave their arms and were not allowed to move from their spot on the middle of the goal-line until the ball was kicked. Now they can wave their arms and move along the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Iceman of the North Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Inquisitor, since when did coaches and journalists actually [i]know [/i]the rules? It seems to me that they know the basics of the rules, but have never actually read the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inquisitor Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Now that you mention it, I think it is possible that the Laws of the Game which are updated by the FIFA board every now and then are the "common denominator" to be implemented by the footie governing bodies. That is, that the UEFA, CONCACAF and the national FA's etc. can adapt the Laws to the competitions they sponsor. Which is what happens in reality if you think on it. Just remember how the golden and silver goal were adopted in some tournaments and not in others, the tie break rules differ in competitions and countries, and etc etc. Perhaps that's what might happen with PK taking, or at least more in tune with the notion I had. What is crystal clear is that according to the Laws, [b]Paddy[/b] is correct and I am wrong. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Barry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inquisitor Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 [quote name='Paddiano Ronaldo' post='1365447' date='May 22 2008, 13.16']Barry?[/quote] :blush: Crap. [b]Paddy.[/b] :leaving: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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