MMA IV 2009 - Fall into New Years.

[BigFatCoward]

Why are the main events for 4 out of 5 UFC cards shite?

105 - Couture v Vera

106 - Ortiz v Griffin

107 - Penn v Sanchez (I’ll give them this one)

108 - Evans v Silva

109 - Couture v Coleman (apparently)

With strikeforce putting on better shows now, this is not the time to be resting on their laurels. I know they have injuries but there are a lot of inactive fighters out there. They need to up there game, especially since US fans pay $40 a card, we only pay £10-12 a month and I still think it’s a rip off for that quality of Main event.

[Mya Stone]

Why are the main events for 4 out of 5 UFC cards shite?

105 - Couture v Vera

106 - Ortiz v Griffin

107 - Penn v Sanchez (I’ll give them this one)

108 - Evans v Silva

109 - Couture v Coleman (apparently)

With strikeforce putting on better shows now, this is not the time to be resting on their laurels. I know they have injuries but there are a lot of inactive fighters out there. They need to up there game, especially since US fans pay $40 a card, we only pay £10-12 a month and I still think it’s a rip off for that quality of Main event.

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?showt...0&start=240

I understand the question, but there's already a catch-all MMA thread.

[Dodgesta]

Why are the main events for 4 out of 5 UFC cards shite?

105 - Couture v Vera

106 - Ortiz v Griffin

107 - Penn v Sanchez (I’ll give them this one)

108 - Evans v Silva

109 - Couture v Coleman (apparently)

With strikeforce putting on better shows now, this is not the time to be resting on their laurels. I know they have injuries but there are a lot of inactive fighters out there. They need to up there game, especially since US fans pay $40 a card, we only pay £10-12 a month and I still think it’s a rip off for that quality of Main event.

I thought Silva-Belfort was gonna be 109? And isnt Shogun-Machida rematch supposed to be around that time as well?

I like 107, and 108 could be good if it gets 1 or 2 more good fights which its been trying to get for weeks (from Silva 2 Lesnar 2 Machida 2 Velasquez), but the rest is mediocre. I'm starting to feel like 100 was the UFC's peaking moment.

[Ser Barry]

I just lost a fucking massive post detailing why the next UFC cards are awesome. FUUUUUUCCCKKKKK!!!!!!!!!

I will come back to it when the red subsides.

[Ser Barry]

I'll take Aldo over Brown btw. Brown looked like he had holes vs Faber and if Faber's hands hadn't gone I reckon he would have won. I fancy an upset.

[Ser Barry]

I'll take Aldo over Brown btw. Brown looked like he had holes vs Faber and if Faber's hands hadn't gone I reckon he would have won. I fancy an upset.

Ouch

[Oorag]

Aldo v Brown was great. Aldo is like a mini Anderson Silva.

I really hope Lesnar comes back soon. His fights are exciting and he presents problems for any fighter. It would really suck if he fought his way to the title and then had to retire without a single defense. It's bad enough that we've got to constantly ask, "Well, what would Fedor do to him?" of every UFC HW champ. I don't want to have to ask the same thing about a retired Lesnar.

[Analu]

Why are the main events for 4 out of 5 UFC cards shite?

105 - Couture v Vera

106 - Ortiz v Griffin

107 - Penn v Sanchez (I’ll give them this one)

108 - Evans v Silva

109 - Couture v Coleman (apparently)

With strikeforce putting on better shows now, this is not the time to be resting on their laurels. I know they have injuries but there are a lot of inactive fighters out there. They need to up there game, especially since US fans pay $40 a card, we only pay £10-12 a month and I still think it’s a rip off for that quality of Main event.

I agree that cards have been lackluster for a while now, and looks like it will be for the near future (except for 107), but I don't think it's about them resting on their laurels. There's simply not a whole lot they can do, as far as I can see.

I'd say that part of it is the UFC's fault (unable to sign Fedor, Hendo, etc.), part is bad luck (Rampage resigning, Brock's illness, Big Nog getting staph), and the rest is just mediocre fights and very bad decisions. And they seem to have shot their load with UFC 100. After BJ, all the champs are tied up with one thing or another for a good stretch, it seems. Also, most people I know including myself lost interest in TUF after Kimbo lost and finding out that Rampage/Rashad wouldn't be happening.

Maybe they should merge the WEC into the UFC and set up feather and bantamweight titles or something. I dunno.

Just watched the Aldo-Brown fight. Impressed with Aldo. I thought Brown would be the champ for a long time.

ETA: UFC 108 looks like total ass for a NYE card.

[Horus Ex Machina]

I agree that cards have been lackluster for a while now, and looks like it will be for the near future (except for 107), but I don't think it's about them resting on their laurels. There's simply not a whole lot they can do, as far as I can see.

I'd say that part of it is the UFC's fault (unable to sign Fedor, Hendo, etc.), part is bad luck (Rampage resigning, Brock's illness, Big Nog getting staph), and the rest is just mediocre fights and very bad decisions. And they seem to have shot their load with UFC 100. After BJ, all the champs are tied up with one thing or another for a good stretch, it seems. Also, most people I know including myself lost interest in TUF after Kimbo lost and finding out that Rampage/Rashad wouldn't be happening.

UFC cards have looked like boxing cards for much of this year now. The reason, money. They are running way too many cards. The idea of a "stacked" card was supposed to be par for the course after the Pride acquisitions, but then the UFC decided that they had to start running 2 to 3 cards a month. So as long as they can get enough ppl to pay for it, we're screwed.

Maybe they should merge the WEC into the UFC and set up feather and bantamweight titles or something. I dunno.

Preach on!

Just watched the Aldo-Brown fight. Impressed with Aldo. I thought Brown would be the champ for a long time.

One thing about the FW division is that it's a pretty new division. It still hasn't completely shaken out and likewise with the BW. As good as Aldo is, we still haven't seen enough of the division to say who's unbeatable. I thought it was too soon to say with Brown and it's probably still too soon with Aldo. I like alot of what I see out of Aldo, I like his patience and how he sets up his straight kick and modifies the knees. Very good tactical awareness. Still has a few sticky points in that he'd flail wildly if Brown manage to exchange inside. Even good to great MMA strikers still have some sketchy inside striking technique. And don't give me that "It's MMA not boxing" bs, throwing a 4-5 combo or even just single hooks or uppercuts work in any fight.

[Analu]

UFC cards have looked like boxing cards for much of this year now. The reason, money. They are running way too many cards. The idea of a "stacked" card was supposed to be par for the course after the Pride acquisitions, but then the UFC decided that they had to start running 2 to 3 cards a month. So as long as they can get enough ppl to pay for it, we're screwed.

You could be right, but IIRC, the UFC has been running about 12-14 cards a year for a while now, and have been fairly consistent putting on a couple stacked cards, followed by a couple of so-so ones, rinse and repeat. There hasn't been a really stacked card since 100 and doesn't look to be one anytime soon. UFC 107 might be a great card from my POV, but that's probably since I'm a giant BJ nuthugger.

Even good to great MMA strikers still have some sketchy inside striking technique. And don't give me that "It's MMA not boxing" bs, throwing a 4-5 combo or even just single hooks or uppercuts work in any fight.

Easy there. When have I ever made the "It's MMA not boxing, BS" argument, as you put it? I might (and in point of fact, do) think that elite-level boxers have far greater hand-striking than their MMA counterparts, but I don't think I've ever thrown that in anyone's face here. I understand there's far more than just learning good dirty boxing in MMA during inside exchanges, given the differences.

But now that you bring it up, I do think the majority of MMA fighters have mediocre standup and don't know how to string punches together, often opting for the wild overhand right to try to end it. Can probably count on one hand how many guys in the UFC I consider having elite, precision-level striking: Anderson, Lyoto, BJ. Probably a couple others that I"m forgetting, but I'd love to see guys set up their combos better in MMA.

[Oorag]

It's true we haven't really had a super-stacked card since UFC 100. If this card still had Lesnar/Carwin I think it would have been terrific, but I still won't sneeze at the remainder:

Ortiz / Griffin: Griffin is a top ten guy, and this is Ortiz's first fight after surgery. It's a good match-up with a great wild card factor.

Koscheck / Johnson: This is a great fight. Koscheck is top-tier and Johnson is an exciting rising star.

Thiago / Volkman: No star power here, but Thiago beat Koscheck and hung in there with Fitch, so he's pretty legit, and facing an undefeated newcomer.

Cane / Lil Nog: This is another great fight, Nog's UFC debut, and the winner will probably face the winner of Griffin/Ortiz for a title eliminator.

Sadollah / Baroni: Okay, so this is supposed to be a feeder fight for Sadollah, but I'm still interested to see how Sadollah is improving.

Ben Saunders / Marcus Davis: This should be an exciting stand-up war. I like Saunders a lot, and though he was thrown to the wolves against Swick, I think he could go places with enough experience.

Grove / Rosholt: Rosholt is that wrestling phenom, and I'd like to see him turn it into elite calibur MMA. Grove won't need to worry about his fragile chin this time. Should be some interesting grappling in this one.

On the under-under card, we've got George Sotiropoulos, a good grappler who's 3-0 in the UFC now, as well as some familiar names like Larson and Uno.

[Ser Barry]

The most impressive thing about Aldo is that he is a BJJ guy who had to improve his striking which is a bit scary.

[Oorag]

The most impressive thing about Aldo is that he is a BJJ guy who had to improve his striking which is a bit scary.

Yeah, Aldo's record makes no sense for a "jijutsu specialist." He's won the past six straight fights by TKO. He's only had one victory by submission hold in his entire career, and his only defeat came by way of submission hold.

[Ser Barry]

Yeah, Aldo's record makes no sense for a "jijutsu specialist." He's won the past six straight fights by TKO. He's only had one victory by submission hold in his entire career, and his only defeat came by way of submission hold.

While we are kissing and higging I agree with your post above about Saturday's card. This is a very, very good MMA card which is a good UFC card. If anyone needs a title fight to be interested then I wonder how much they really like the sport. Take this from someone who has trudged around London watching 'MMA' which was worse than you could possibly imagine.

[lessthanluke]

Yeh I'm looking forward to it as well. Johnson and Koscheck especially.

[Analu]

LOL@ questioning whether someone's a real MMA fan because they think an average card is, in fact, an average card. Okay.....

[Ser Barry]

LOL@ questioning whether someone's a real MMA fan because they think an average card is, in fact, an average card. Okay.....

It is not an average card. It might be an average UFC card but it is still a better card than anyone else in the world can put on bar once or twice a year. UFC on a bad day is still a very high standard. If anyone thinks that this is average when compared to other MMA events then yes, I wonder whether they are a fan of the sport or just the spectacle.

[Analu]

If you're comparing it to all the MMA promotions currently running then... well yeah. Of course it's a great card in that context. But from the UFC PPV model? Hardly. It's $45-50 a pop here in the US. I don't know what that translates to in pounds, but it's a decent chunk of change here, especially in this economy.How much was the recent Fedor card? Free. How much are the Strikeforce cards? Free, if you have Showtime. How much were the Dream cards? Free, if you had HDNet.

It's a very average card for someone shelling out $50, and while I haven't checked, I'd bet that a fight-to-fight comparison between this card and the last 30 or so UFC PPV cards would show just how average it is. That said, I'm still going to watch it since I only have to chip in a couple bucks, seeing as I always watch it with a big group. But for someone buying it on their own or with only one or two buddies to chip in? Not worth it, IMO. Can watch it online later.

And it's not necessarily about the spectacle, as you put it. It's about spending hard earned money expecting to see a card climaxing to a great main event. Isn't that what just about every fight fan expects? Does Tito-Forrest really do it for you as a PPV main event? If so, kudos.

I'd say more, but I have to go, and I think/hope you got my point already.

[Ser Barry]

I do get your point and in terms of money spent maybe it is not as great value as other UFC cards. That raises the point that they are victims of their own success. This is not such a bad card. Taken in isolation I think that people would think that it is worth the money it is just that UFC do so many good cards now days that people can afford to be choosey.

We pay £10 a month over here and we get all the UFC cards for that. We also got the Fedor card on a 24hr delay. We can't see Dream or WEC and our local MMA is shite. We are in a position where UFC is the only quality MMA we can see live and in that context this is a pretty cool card. There are stories on the card; Tito's return, Griffin's response to the Silva beating, Johnson being a heel due to his weight cutting issues, Baroni vs Sadollah being such a weird fight, Nog and Cane is a great fight. It is clear that we are coming at it from different contexts. I am glad for every UFC because they don't cost me any more and I get to see good MMA, you guys have to justify the outlay with regards to each individual card. I am sorry that I didn't take that into account earlier but I still stand by my assessment that this is a good card.

[Horus Ex Machina]

A little women's MMA for a sec here. On Couture, I figured she would take a beating in this matchup, but she showed enough toughness in her first fight staying in it with a broken jaw, that I figured that she would keep the fight going to a decision but lose unanimously. Vera showed what I thought she would, cleaner and more efficient striking technique. On her part, she's definitely a comer and will be in it with the 135ers in SF. I hope Couture keeps at it bc she has a fighting spirit, is in great shape, and is a good athlete. But she's not ready for this stage. She should turn down the rest of her SF contract and fight elsewhere while she builds up her technique. It's clear she wanted to go to the ground but could not protect herself for long and didn't have the skills to get Vera off her feet. Kaufman would similarly brutalize her. Good luck to both of these women.