Dany gets under my skin sometimes...

[SummerKnight]

Can we not have 1 thread where we can bitch about Dany?

yes. you can have one. i'd be happy if you guys even had 2. But we dont need 10 new threads a week stating the same opinions over and over. so, ask your local moderator to sticky one of these assanine, reptitive, thoroghly exhausted threads so you all can sit around your internet and do what internet-sues do best: bitch.

I already proposed what you've suggested at the beginning of this thread, with no response.

Seriously. give the haters a single thread where they can bitch to their hearts content.

PLEASE

[Nukelavee]

Hmm, nevermore, good way of putting it - she IS too much an idealist.

Plus, she seems to have an innate ability to lead/rule, which is odd, as she's had no mentor, and spent most of her life as basically an object.

When was she schooled?

Summerknight - here's a novel suggestion: Don't read the threads if they vex you. It seems a pretty workable plan.

[nevermore]

Hmm, nevermore, good way of putting it - she IS too much an idealist.

Plus, she seems to have an innate ability to lead/rule, which is odd, as she's had no mentor, and spent most of her life as basically an object.

When was she schooled?

Summerknight - here's a novel suggestion: Don't read the threads if they vex you. It seems a pretty workable plan.

you are correct there, she does have very natural decision making style, the way she dealt with the riders in Yukai (is it? the one where they meet that second son bastard or something)was way to clever for a kid who never even been in real war.

[Bronn is God]

If someone created a thread to bitch about Bronn, would you leave it be?

Yes I would. Infact I am yet to create a thread that bashes people for not appreciating Bronn enough, so I have shown my self-control in this regard.

[Maestress Sand]

then the United States should really be given back to the Indians

Um, yeah. Can't happen, but it should. ;)

[iamthedave]

Yes I would. Infact I am yet to create a thread that bashes people for not appreciating Bronn enough, so I have shown my self-control in this regard.

I love Bronn. He's one of my favourite non-POV characters, and I hope he survives to the end. I was really pleased for him when he got his lordship.

[Noroldis]

About the invader part...You Americans have short memories, 300 years is nothing. :) With that, I'm more refering to Westeros, and it's great Houses, and thier sense of the past. It's clear to us that the seven "kingdoms" was more an empire than a kingdom, and it's member "states" still wish to be "free". So, again, has Dany ever considered just how big a war she faces, and for how long?.

The Iron Islands might well wish for complete independence, but at the start of the ASOIAF the rest of the Seven Kingdoms seemed willing to be part of a unified realm. Back when Aerys went on his killing spree, the North, Stormlands and the Vale didn't secede, they united to overthrow Aerys and the Targaryen dynasty. And in ASOIAF itself the North and Riverlands declared their independence, true, but IMO that was more a reaction because they didn't like any of the then-candidates for the Iron Throne than out of any deep-seated desire for secession.

As for Dany herself, yes, she really should be trying to learn as much as she can about Westeros, and failure to do so might well result in bad consequences when she invades.

[Sherrit]

My own mother finds her chapters the best. They're the ones that are agonizing to re-read for me. I don't know if I have a strong opinion of Danny. I feel like from the beginning I've just accepted that she's going to win.

Still, I wonder what Danny will do when she learns all about what her father has done...

Furthermore, I wonder how she'll treat Jaime if she ever learns the true story of her father's death.

Would she be just (depending on if you think him right or wrong) or would she lop his golden end off? An interesting way for the Kingslayer to go.

[MightilyOats]

Hate to break it to people but that's most certainly rape under modern sensibilities and in most places in, under modern law. The whole point is that the sex is not consensual.

It's made EXTREMELY explicit in the scene in question that it was 100% consensual.

This isn't rocket science.

[MyDogIsNamedDanerys]

It's made EXTREMELY explicit in the scene in question that it was 100% consensual.

This isn't rocket science.

Which scene are you referring to?

[Enguerrand]

I find these threads quite funny.

-Dany has it so easy! Nothing bad ever happens to her.

-Dude, she has had her entire family tortured and murdered driven from her home and spent her entire life at the whim of others in fear of being assassinated.

-Yes well but she doesn't show that its affects her, I want to read about her misery.

Well I guess its true that she never dwell on her misfortune, the way most people do. ”If I look back I'm lost”, but really if she was a girl that spent her time crying in a corner she wouldn't get any closer to Westeros Which I guess would be realistic, most people who has little, won't end up with a kingdom, but this bread and butter of storytelling.

Is Napoleon Bonapartes journey from herding goats on Corsica to emperor and conqueror of Europe realistic?

[Enguerrand]

To put rape in perspective, you have to reach the 20th century to find laws calling a husband forcing himself on his wife sexually, rape.

Its quite clear in the book that a wife is accesible to her husband whenever he wants.

In most cases it doesn't even occur to them that they could say no. Even though Cersei find Roberts advances loathsome she doesn't consider it rape.

And in Dany's case its also the fact that she is stranger in completly different culture at the complete mercy of a savage that is dreaded across two continents for his ability to murder, rape and pillage.

How many women of today sensibilites would tell Drogo to get lost if they were transplanted into Dany's shoes?

As to Dany's love for Drogo. She has spent her entire life on the run, fearing for her life, at her brothers whims.

Now she has been married of to a guy, that no one messes with if they can help it, that has the power to make all her hope and dreams come through, if she pleases him.

Watch Sansa with Tyrion, ”there is beauty in every man” Dany is culturally conditioned to care for her husband, and have very good reasons to do so besides that.

Another thing to think about is that even those girls that gets locked into a basement for decades as sexual toys can express affection for their tormentors. Being at the mercy of someone else changes your mind.

Most would call it rape and worse anyway.

[iamthedave]

I find these threads quite funny.

-Dany has it so easy! Nothing bad ever happens to her.

-Dude, she has had her entire family tortured and murdered driven from her home and spent her entire life at the whim of others in fear of being assassinated.

-Yes well but she doesn't show that its affects her, I want to read about her misery.

Actually I don't. I find her moping endlessly tedious. But I find the arguments people use to defend her flimsy because they raise things that Dany herself is seemingly unaffected by. In fact, if Dany just got the hell on with it I'd respect her. But no, she mopes, and navel gazes, and mopes, despite the fact she is one of the safest, most powerful characters in the entire series, where characters who don't have a tenth of her advantages struggle their hardest against impossible odds, and - shock of shocks - ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING.

I mean, holy hell, can you imagine what a different book we'd be reading if Tyrion was the one in charge of her budding empire? He'd have invaded Westeros, conquered Kings Landing and retired to Casterly Rock to giggle and laugh at his final victory, all his dreams accomplished by now.

Compared to everyone else, she has had a path paved in gold and lined with roses, and she still insists on bitching about it. God alone knows how depressed she'd be if she had to walk in the shoes of Tyrion Lannister or Davos Seaworth.

[SummerKnight]

Compared to everyone else, she has had a path paved in gold and lined with roses, and she still insists on bitching about it. God alone knows how depressed she'd be if she had to walk in the shoes of Tyrion Lannister or Davos Seaworth.

what the hell are you talking about? have you even read the books?

[{ Emilia }]

Compared to everyone else, she has had a path paved in gold and lined with roses, and she still insists on bitching about it. God alone knows how depressed she'd be if she had to walk in the shoes of Tyrion Lannister or Davos Seaworth.

Talking nonsense just for the sake of being confrontational?

Having your whole family killed and having endured what Mirri Maz Dur did to her (dead baby? infertile now? nasty crap) can hardly be called having "had a path paved in gold and lined with roses".

No, not even "compared to everyone else".

[iamthedave]

Having your whole family killed and having endured what Mirri Maz Dur did to her (dead baby? infertile now? nasty crap) can hardly be called having "had a path paved in gold and lined with roses".

I mean her path to her goals.

Who else has gained so much by doing so little? That's the definition of an easy road.

[Nukelavee]

Knowing you are the only member of your bloodline around is unpleasant... but the only family she lost was her brother.

We do tend to forget certain things about Dany when we discuss her, tho. She spent 14 years as a commodity, with a crazed brother her only constant.

The journey across the desert? It's pretty glossed over... but, yeah, that was harsh.

The problem is, I think, she doesn't show any of the effects, really, of those experiences. They shattered her brother, and she seems impervious to what she goes up against.

Compare that with a few other major characters. Tyrion? He's gone thru as crappy a life, in it's own way, AND he's now noseless, a kinslayer, and on teh run.

Jon? His whole family was wiped out (he thinks), his comrades are like, reverse decimated, he's lost his lover, and, well, he's seen some seriously terrifying stuff.

Actually, I really hope Barristan does tell Dany the true events of the rebellion (and we get to see it). I think learning just how much of her current situation was her own family's fault will go a log way to making her more real.

Look at the bright side, tho, folks - She's NOT Honour Harrington.

[Enguerrand]

Compared to everyone else, she has had a path paved in gold and lined with roses, and she still insists on bitching about it.

Hm? Just about every major character in the series are born filty rich with inherited fiefdoms,right to dispense law, collect taxes, able to call thousands of soldiers and bannermen to war when they please.

Only thing Dany starts out with his her familys legacy, which is almost as much a liability as a resource.

[Bronn is God]

Having your whole family killed and having endured what Mirri Maz Dur did to her (dead baby? infertile now? nasty crap) can hardly be called having "had a path paved in gold and lined with roses".

Tragic, beautiful princess now with Dragons and a big ass army.

So if your life is tragic, you deserve to have the most imba thing in the entire universe? And be able to shitstomp everything without raising a finger? And be so utterly self sufficient?

I hate Dany because she got dragons. Suddenly everything was skewed and became ridiculous. No one deserves dragons, least of all the tragic princess who I have to root for.

[Trebla]

Tragic, beautiful princess now with Dragons and a big ass army.

So if your life is tragic, you deserve to have the most imba thing in the entire universe? And be able to shitstomp everything without raising a finger? And be so utterly self sufficient?

I hate Dany because she got dragons. Suddenly everything was skewed and became ridiculous. No one deserves dragons, least of all the tragic princess who I have to root for.

She has a SMALL army and is now surrounded by enemies with much larger armies than she has. She has dragons, which the blood price was her husband and her unborn son, but they are still small and everybody in the world either wants to steal them or kill them.

Nobody says you HAVE to root for her. You can just keep on rooting for the badass male characters. ;)