[Book Spoilers] What did non-readers of the book make of it?

[Bronn is God]

Larry Williams delivers.

Quote of the week: "Tie-rion is a G"

The man needs his own thread. Although I am a little saddened by the fact that he didnt pick up on the fact that the Hound hunted down and killed Micah. You think they could have cut down a few minutes of Dany's sexy time to show that and start building on an interesting character (The Hound).

[Revah]

Okay, I managed to convince my brother who wasn't particularly impressed by the first episode to watch episode 2 with me. I think he's now hooked.

Best comments:

'Those dogs...they're too smart, aren't they? I think they'll have a big role, they're magic or something, right?'

'Go on, kill her!' (To the guy trying to kill Catelyn - guess he doesn't like her much)

'Those eggs are going to hatch, right? All those candles are keeping them warm, it's an incubator.'

'He needs another slap. Where's that dwarf when you need him?' (When Joffrey lies about what happened)

He explained to me his theory that Drogo is going to cross the Narrow Sea, have a duel with someone (Robert? I'm not sure who he meant) and thus win the Iron Throne for himself, with Dany as queen.

He also asked why we didn't see 'the demons' from the first episode again, as he was sure they were going to be the focus of the series.

At the moment, he dislikes Cersei, Sansa and particularly Joffrey, and likes Arya 'I hope she gets really good at swordfighting,' Ned and the Dothraki.

[NW Deserter]

'Go on, kill her!' (To the guy trying to kill Catelyn - guess he doesn't like her much)

All those candles are keeping them warm, it's an incubator.'

These two lines made me laugh. :laugh:

[Loras]

My partner wanted to start a drinking game: let's do a shot every time we see those bloody eggs.

Other than that, he really enjoyed the episode.

[Ferrum Aeternum]

My parents are completely hooked now...Dad called me Saturday (after watching an encore of the premiere) and I answered his questions for a solid hour. They liked last night's episode as well but mom was very upset by the death of Lady. She didn't understand exactly why Ned did the deed himself, until I explained the significance that the wolves were "of the North" and that Ilyn Payne would have been much less merciful.

[Kaitscralt]

A non-reader friend of mine decided to follow this series as he has trust that HBO makes great shows. I did not tell him to watch it, and he normally does not like fantasy. He told me today that after two episodes he is not confused at all by the name-dropping and rapid scene-shifting, and is interested in next weeks episode (although he predicts Bran will not remember a thing).

[ryanjm]

I read parts of the 1st book and couldn't finish it because I disliked it so much. The HBO series? Love it. Awesome.

I actually went to register to post here, then realized that I had registered like 3 years ago to talk about the 1st book. It's funny to go back and read that :) I may pick up the book again after this season is over and read it straight through with a new appreciation for the flavor of the series.

My main issues when I was reading the book are that, 1) magic is almost non-existent, and 2) there are no traditional "hero" characters that you can 'live through' as they go on an adventure. In the tv show however, I really like all of the characters we're supposed to be rooting for (or at least I'm interested in their story), whereas in the book I didn't really care much what happened to anyone.

Tyrion is my favorite so far just because he's hilarious. I'm hoping he turns out to be one of the "good guys" since his family is obviously whacked. I want to see Cersei and her son die a slow death after what they did in Ep 2.

[TheHalfman]

When I knew this show was coming I made sure to keep bringing it up on the phone to my mom (I know her and my stepdad have HBO) since they always watch the HBO series, no matter what it is, unless they dislike it. Neither of them are huge fantasy fans or anything, they're just the average viewer. Both of them just love the show so far, nothing in particular to say, but they like it.

That is especially promising on my stepdad's part. While he loved Deadwood (big Western buff), typically to keep him interested something has to have a ton of action. So if the show pulled off keeping him interested, when he couldn't even stand the Lord of the Rings movies, I'd say the show is doing alright with the general audience.

[undertow]

I read parts of the 1st book and couldn't finish it because I disliked it so much. The HBO series? Love it. Awesome.

As someone who only read the book b/c of HBO , what do you find different?

[Fez]

I unfortunately don't have any non-reader friends interested in it who have HBO (a few said they'll watch when it shows up on Netflix though, so that's something); however I have found it quite interesting to check out some other forums (usually whose central focus is something else entirely) that have much higher percentages of posters who haven't read the books in order to see their thoughts and speculations. Two things really stand out at me:

1) Jon's parentage is already a major issue. The three biggest theories I've heard are Ned+Cersei, Lyanna+Robert, and Lyanna+Aerys. No R+L=J yet, but that last one is an awfully good guess, particularly since Rhaegar hasn't been mentioned by name yet I think. Regardless it seems commonly thought that Jon is royalty of some type, and that somehow he'll find out before he takes he's vows at the Wall.

2) People love Robert's Rebellion. I know a while back Ran mentioned that he thought the series was missing a lot of the sense of lost romanticism of the past, and maybe to a lot of readers it is. However to people new to the series, there's still plenty. A common refrain I hear is that they loving finding out more about the past as it is revealed through the series; its one of their favorite parts (and they hate it when people give them background information on the grounds that "its not spoilers, it already happened"; instead preferring to find out on their own). Commonly posted is, "it sounds like an entire series all on its own".

Really interesting stuff.

[Kaitscralt]

I read parts of the 1st book and couldn't finish it because I disliked it so much.

:tantrum:

I'm interested in your reasons as well.

[Ferrum Aeternum]

People love Robert's Rebellion. I know a while back Ran mentioned that he thought the series was missing a lot of the sense of lost romanticism of the past, and maybe to a lot of readers it is. However to people new to the series, there's still plenty. A common refrain I hear is that they loving finding out more about the past as it is revealed through the series; its one of their favorite parts (and they hate it when people give them background information on the grounds that "its not spoilers, it already happened"; instead preferring to find out on their own). Commonly posted is, "it sounds like an entire series all on its own".

My dream scenario (probably will never happen) is for Robert's Rebellion to get the feature film treatment. It's arguably the most interesting story in ASOIAF.

[DaddyTorgo]

I unfortunately don't have any non-reader friends interested in it who have HBO (a few said they'll watch when it shows up on Netflix though, so that's something); however I have found it quite interesting to check out some other forums (usually whose central focus is something else entirely) that have much higher percentages of posters who haven't read the books in order to see their thoughts and speculations. Two things really stand out at me:

1) Jon's parentage is already a major issue. The three biggest theories I've heard are Ned+Cersei, Lyanna+Robert, and Lyanna+Aerys. No R+L=J yet, but that last one is an awfully good guess, particularly since Rhaegar hasn't been mentioned by name yet I think. Regardless it seems commonly thought that Jon is royalty of some type, and that somehow he'll find out before he takes he's vows at the Wall.

2) People love Robert's Rebellion. I know a while back Ran mentioned that he thought the series was missing a lot of the sense of lost romanticism of the past, and maybe to a lot of readers it is. However to people new to the series, there's still plenty. A common refrain I hear is that they loving finding out more about the past as it is revealed through the series; its one of their favorite parts (and they hate it when people give them background information on the grounds that "its not spoilers, it already happened"; instead preferring to find out on their own). Commonly posted is, "it sounds like an entire series all on its own".

Really interesting stuff.

Where are some of these forums. I'm so geeked out on this series that I'd love to lurk and read non-reader reactions...

[Lannes]

1) Jon's parentage is already a major issue. The three biggest theories I've heard are Ned+Cersei, Lyanna+Robert, and Lyanna+Aerys. No R+L=J yet, but that last one is an awfully good guess, particularly since Rhaegar hasn't been mentioned by name yet I think. Regardless it seems commonly thought that Jon is royalty of some type, and that somehow he'll find out before he takes he's vows at the Wall.

I imagine we'll begin to get more speculation on this as in episode 2, Robert makes mention of "What Rhaegar did to your sister."

[Knight Of Winter]

1) Jon's parentage is already a major issue. The three biggest theories I've heard are Ned+Cersei, Lyanna+Robert, and Lyanna+Aerys. No R+L=J yet, but that last one is an awfully good guess, particularly since Rhaegar hasn't been mentioned by name yet I think. Regardless it seems commonly thought that Jon is royalty of some type, and that somehow he'll find out before he takes he's vows at the Wall.

One of the things I like the most about the current show is reading comments, opinions and theories of first-time readers/watchers. As for theories, it's quite interesting to see what have they concluded based on the information they have. So much fresh ideas and thoughts remind you how can one piece of information often be seen from various points of view by different people. Really, what do Ned+Cersei=Jon and Lyanna+Aerys=Jon have in common? Like DaddyTrogo, I'm also very curious to read non-reader comments, so I kindly ask you to provide link to these forums.

And while I don't have any non-reader friends who watch the show, I will put some effort into changing this :cool4:

[Hyper]

Where are some of these forums. I'm so geeked out on this series that I'd love to lurk and read non-reader reactions...

The 'Television Without Pity' forums: http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/index.php?showforum=1193

It is a good site to see newbie speculation, the Mods have really tightened down the episode threads for spoilers after the 1st episode thread went off the tracks a bit.

If you care to read newbie speculation, read this thread ('Completely Unspoiled Speculation' - Readers are NOT welcome): http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/index.php?showtopic=3204374&st=0

[Talleyrand]

Like always he is fucking awesome, his description of Joffrey is brilliant

[Knight Of Winter]

If you care to read newbie speculation, read this thread ('Completely Unspoiled Speculation' - Readers are NOT welcome): http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/index.php?showtopic=3204374&st=0

Thank you very much :)

I'll just post some of the posts from the forum Hyper provided link to. Fascinating how much theories have already started to form and develop. So:

about Jon's parents:

Okay, my spec is that Jon Snow's mother is... Cersei!

What we know:

- There was a very weird moment in episode 1 where Ned kisses Cersei's hand when she arrives. I immediately thought there was some history there. Then I forgot about it when it appeared that she was more into family members.

- Cersei tells Ned's wife that she had a dark-haired son. He was killed. She said he looked really like Robert. I think this was lies, and that Jon was that dark-haired son that looked like Ned, and Ned took him away from her. I'm guessing there was some complicated reasoning behind it.

- Robert never met the mother of Jon Snow. Ned never introduced them. He acted evasive in that scene.

It could also be a case of the series spinning out the mystery a bit for the sake of story. I was just surprised that when Jon Snow finally asked, as they are about to part ways, possibly forever Ned still wouldn't spill. It just doesn't seem as if an answer like, "Her name was Willa, she was a camp follower and she died soon after you were born." (which is what Robert seemed to think Jon's mother was...some kind of "Tavern Wench") would have taken any time at all.

I think John Snow is Robert's son, with his dead love, Ned's sister. That would make sense. If Ned's sister hid a pregnancy or was unable to tell Robert for some reason who was off fighting or something, and then she died by the hands of the Targaryens, it makes sense she would have told her brother, Ned. Or left the child with someone and a sealed letter to give to Ned on his return if he were away also.

On the other hand, regarding his parentage, if he joins up that will all be moot (can't have children, can't leave). I was thinking maybe Jon is the son of Ned's sister and the previous king.

And the savviest one

But if Ned's sister is really John's mother then I think it's pretty obvious who his father is, the Targerien guy who kidnapped her! It would explain why Ned lies to everyone including his wife, if Robert found out John was a Targerien son (not just any son, but the son of the guy who kidnapped and raped Robert's love!) he would kill him on the spot

about Jon's choices:

But the thing I've just been taking as a given and realize that perhaps I shouldn't be: Jon Snow is not really going to take that bloody oath and tie himself to the scariest wall to ever wall, in the company of murderers, rapist and monks, I dearly hope. I'm assuming some grim (and or dire, with the added possibility of extremely disgusting) will happen that prevents it. The Ice Zombies (Whitewalkers?) will descend en mass. The friggin' wall will fall down. Something, anything.

about Catelyn-Jon relationship:

I haven't seen how she acted in the books, but I don't quite understand all the hate from Catelyn for this unwanted bastard her husband seems to be flaunting in front of her. Yes, she is mean to him verbally but he seems decently fed and clothed and included in most father-son activities. Given the brutality of this world, he's come off pretty well. I think we're projecting 21st century self-esteem/therapy culture on Westeros to think that having your step-mother not be nice to you is a big deal there. And if Jon is destined to be the unsung hero, well, in fairy tales they frequently have mean step-mothers.

about foreshadowing:

Perhaps I'm taking this a bit too literally but I know the wolf is the sigil of the Stark house. Isn't the stag the symbol of the Royal house? [unless I am confusing it with the blonds, but I think they have the dragon symbol.] The two fought and killed each other and only the pups survived. Foreshadowing maybe? Specially with the bit about the wolves not usually being found so far south. Aren't they all heading south to where ever it is the king lives?

edit: and of course, big kudos to Larry Williams :thumbsup:

[craster's whore]

my guess is they would be confused as hell, if they had not read the books. too many characters with little introduction.

[Hyper]

my guess is they would be confused as hell, if they had not read the books. too many characters with little introduction.

Did you read the quotes in the post above yours? It seems to refute your point. Clearly some newbies have gotten enough information to get a feel for the characters, and speculate about several things.

Now I agree that one really has to pay attention to pick up all the hints, but there ARE a lot of hints there to be found.