So was Lyanna stupid or something?

[Wolf Maid]

I lay most of the blame for the war with Rhaegar and Aerys. Even in the best case scenario, that she went willingly, I see nothing good about a man in his twenties, with a wife and 2 kids, running off with a 15 year old girl and hiding her away from her family. Not only does he insult his wife, along with her family, but the family of the girl and the family of her betrothed. He is basically using the only daughter of the Warden of the North as his whore. If Rhaegar thought that anything good could possibly come of that then he is an idiot. The fact that they're monarchs doesn't give them the right to treat their lords' daughters any way they please.

What Brandon did was rash, but he had a right to be upset, his family name was dishonored. He also had a right to expect that consequences be given for what Rhaegar had done. If it had been any other man, he probably would have been put to death or sent to the wall. It would have been better if they had fought one on one to avoid war, but the Starks obviously had the backing to fight a war and win, if it came to that, because that is what happened.

Rhaegar started the problem by taking Lyanna and Aerys finished it, first by killing Brandon and Rickard, then by calling out the Warden of the East.

[corbon]

I see nothing good about a man in his twenties, with a wife and 2 kids, running off with a 15 year old girl and hiding her away from her family.

A man in his 20s, or even very much older, with a girl of 15 is normal in this culture.

So is taking her away from her family, when you look at it plainly.

People bringing up these things are imposing their modern thoughts and cultural expectations on a different culture.

Which is not to say that Rhaegar and Lyanna aren't in the wrong here. Just that these extra little points are not what should be held against Rhaegar. But they frequently are, because people can't see beyond their own cultural prejudices.

He is basically using the only daughter of the Warden of the North as his whore.

Is this sexist? That a woman can only be with a man as a wife or a whore?

Or misandrist? Believing that a man can only 'use' a woman he is not married to as a whore?

No matter.

Fact of the matter is you are making a judgment here, without data. There is reasonable evidence that says they might have even gotten married, and none that says they did not.

If Rhaegar thought that anything good could possibly come of that then he is an idiot.

Or following prophecy.

Or in love and believing it could all be worked out (possibly 'provided' they removed themselves from sight to reduce the possibilities of foolish and irredeemable actions by others).

What Brandon did was rash, but he had a right to be upset, his family name was dishonored. He also had a right to expect that consequences be given for what Rhaegar had done.

Yes, he had a right to be upset.

Yes he had a right to expect some consequences.

No he did not have a right to treason as a first recourse. You go looking for recompense, not demanding the death of the crown prince.

the Starks obviously had the backing to fight a war and win, if it came to that, because that is what happened.

That is a ridiculous statement.

First, just because something happened, does not make it obvious it will happen before hand. If so, then I can hold you, personally, responsible for... well, anything, say this mornings Mumbai bombings. Because they happened, so they must have been obvious, and you didn't give warning!

Ok, so we all know that isn't real.

Second, because it is outright wrong. The Starks did not initially have the backing to fight a war and win. They had to ally with Baratheons, Arryns and Tullys, and secure the Tully's with marriage alliances. And even then it was a near run thing. The royalists, with a bigger army, were do well until first Ser Lyn Corbray picked up his wounded fathers sword and led a charge during which he killed Lewyn Martell which broke the Dornishmen, then Rhaegar died to Robert. It is a battle that could easily have gone the other way.

Rhaegar started the problem by taking Lyanna and Aerys finished it, first by killing Brandon and Rickard, then by calling out the Warden of the East.

Its very equitable of you to place all the blame on Rhaegar and none on Lyanna, despite the evidence on her strong and active personality and no credible evidence that he did anything against her will.

And very nice of you to absolve Brandon for acting stupidly and treasonably because he was upset.

But we can agree that Aerys nailed the coffin door tight.

[malarky1231]

I doubt they got married. Seeing as how Rhaegar already had a wife, this wouldn't have been possible. Targaryens don't practice polygamy, they take only one wife. I think you're confusing mistresses with wives. Seeing as how Aegon IV had nine mistresses this is the cause of some confusion. Targaryens practiced marrying brother and sister together to keep bloodlines pure. Although in some cases they married for political reason, ie Rhaegar+Elia and Daeron II + Myriah.

[Raksha the Demon]

A man in his 20s, or even very much older, with a girl of 15 is normal in this culture.

So is taking her away from her family, when you look at it plainly.

People bringing up these things are imposing their modern thoughts and cultural expectations on a different culture.

Which is not to say that Rhaegar and Lyanna aren't in the wrong here. Just that these extra little points are not what should be held against Rhaegar. But they frequently are, because people can't see beyond their own cultural prejudices.

Is this sexist? That a woman can only be with a man as a wife or a whore?

Or misandrist? Believing that a man can only 'use' a woman he is not married to as a whore?

No matter.

Fact of the matter is you are making a judgment here, without data. There is reasonable evidence that says they might have even gotten married, and none that says they did not.

Or following prophecy.

Or in love and believing it could all be worked out (possibly 'provided' they removed themselves from sight to reduce the possibilities of foolish and irredeemable actions by others).

Yes, he had a right to be upset.

Yes he had a right to expect some consequences.

No he did not have a right to treason as a first recourse. You go looking for recompense, not demanding the death of the crown prince.

That is a ridiculous statement.

First, just because something happened, does not make it obvious it will happen before hand. If so, then I can hold you, personally, responsible for... well, anything, say this mornings Mumbai bombings. Because they happened, so they must have been obvious, and you didn't give warning!

Ok, so we all know that isn't real.

Second, because it is outright wrong. The Starks did not initially have the backing to fight a war and win. They had to ally with Baratheons, Arryns and Tullys, and secure the Tully's with marriage alliances. And even then it was a near run thing. The royalists, with a bigger army, were do well until first Ser Lyn Corbray picked up his wounded fathers sword and led a charge during which he killed Lewyn Martell which broke the Dornishmen, then Rhaegar died to Robert. It is a battle that could easily have gone the other way.

Its very equitable of you to place all the blame on Rhaegar and none on Lyanna, despite the evidence on her strong and active personality and no credible evidence that he did anything against her will.

And very nice of you to absolve Brandon for acting stupidly and treasonably because he was upset.

But we can agree that Aerys nailed the coffin door tight.

A man in his twenties marrying a teenaged girl is normal for Westeros culture. But in the instance of Rhaegar and Lyanna eloping (as I believe they did), I put much more blame on Rhaegar. He was not only a married man; he was some six or seven years older, and compared to Lyanna's age, that is a huge gulf. Rhaegar also had had more life experience than Lyanna. He should have known better. Add to that the fact that as heir to the throne of the Seven Kingdoms, Rhaegar had the responsibility of royalty as well as the perks, and he should have behaved with more restraint. I am sure that Lyanna was not the first pretty teenager who had a crush on him; Rhaegar was not in the habit of making off with maidens. He should have just said no, to himself and to Lyanna. Which is why there might be some credence to the theory of his choosing Lyanna as the one gal in Westeros who could produce the Prince Who Was Promised. Or a second PWWP, if baby Aegon needed a backup.

A married man having an affair with an unmarried woman would definitely not, in our culture, be necessarily construed as the woman being a whore. But in Westeros, with its feudal mindset and double standard, where the noblemen sire bastards and rape with impunity but if their wives fool around they're treacherous at the very least or killed at the worst, then yes, Lyanna's honor would have been publicly besmirched by her flight with Rhaegar and it can be said that in the eyes of the other noble families and possibly the smallfolk as well, Rhaegar would have been seen to have treated her like a whore. Rhaegar's decision to take Lyanna away from her family and betrothed (remember, Rhaegar could have and should have, as the Heir to the seven kingdoms, left her alone) was a tremendous public insult to the houses of Stark and Baratheon. A young daughter of a noble house had power as a maiden, her virginity was sold to the strongest ally or highest bidder as a succession prize, and if there was any question that she came to the marriage bed in a condition other than virgin, then the legitimacy of at least the first child of that marriage could be questioned. Fair? No. Medieval? Yes.

But the final injury was of course given by Aerys, who, in his arrogance and madness, tortured Lyanna's father and brother to death.

If Rhaegar eloped with Lyanna out of passion, rather than mixed passion and wanting her to give him a PWWP, then he should have done so with the idea of making Lyanna his mistress and shelling out massive amounts of money or land/prizes to the houses of Stark and Baratheon as compensation. And Dorne would have to be placated as well, unless Elia went along with it - for all we know, what with her health being frail and her life being endangered if she became pregnant for a third time, Elia might have gladly delegated the sexual aspect of her marriage to Rhaegar to a younger and healthier woman. We don't know...

I think that Lyanna must have sent off a letter home, if only to tell her family that she was alive and well and had gone with Rhaegar of her own free will, no rape involved. Perhaps the letter was never delivered; or, to Brandon and Rickard, it made no difference, their family was still dishonored. Again, we don't know.

[corbon]

I doubt they got married. Seeing as how Rhaegar already had a wife, this wouldn't have been possible. Targaryens don't practice polygamy, they take only one wife. I think you're confusing mistresses with wives. Seeing as how Aegon IV had nine mistresses this is the cause of some confusion. Targaryens practiced marrying brother and sister together to keep bloodlines pure. Although in some cases they married for political reason, ie Rhaegar+Elia and Daeron II + Myriah.

Targaryens have practiced polygamy.

Aegon the Conqueror married both his sisters.

Maegor I 'Maegor notoriously kept multiple wives at a time' according to the wiki (the reference there might refer to also having 3 Grand Maesters executed).

Just because they haven't done it for a while, doesn't mean they can no longer do it. The precedent is there and as far as we know has not been revoked.

Also ideas have been thrown about about Dany considering two husbands, so the dragon may have three heads and she may mirror Aegon's conquest.

[Ame]

I lay most of the blame for the war with Rhaegar and Aerys. Even in the best case scenario, that she went willingly, I see nothing good about a man in his twenties, with a wife and 2 kids, running off with a 15 year old girl and hiding her away from her family. Not only does he insult his wife, along with her family, but the family of the girl and the family of her betrothed. He is basically using the only daughter of the Warden of the North as his whore. If Rhaegar thought that anything good could possibly come of that then he is an idiot. The fact that they're monarchs doesn't give them the right to treat their lords' daughters any way they please.

What Brandon did was rash, but he had a right to be upset, his family name was dishonored. He also had a right to expect that consequences be given for what Rhaegar had done. If it had been any other man, he probably would have been put to death or sent to the wall. It would have been better if they had fought one on one to avoid war, but the Starks obviously had the backing to fight a war and win, if it came to that, because that is what happened.

Rhaegar started the problem by taking Lyanna and Aerys finished it, first by killing Brandon and Rickard, then by calling out the Warden of the East.

If being monarchs doesn't give them the right than the right that they are nobles doesn't grant the right to sell the daughter. A short list of monarchs I could name off the top of my head who did exactly that includes Francis I of France, Jan Casimir of Poland, Richard the Lionheart, Henry II of England, and Henry VIII of England

I could name many more but not off the top of my head. Because Targs practiced Polygamy before and 3 KG were guarding Lyanna I think they eloped which would mean he didn't treat her as a whore; but even if he did that was his right as a monarch. Sorry if the historical examples are a poke in the eye.

[malarky1231]

She was probably his mistress/lover. Not his wife.

[FatR]

If being monarchs doesn't give them the right than the right that they are nobles doesn't grant the right to sell the daughter. A short list of monarchs I could name off the top of my head who did exactly that includes Francis I of France, Jan Casimir of Poland, Richard the Lionheart, Henry II of England, and Henry VIII of England

They didn't do exactly that as evidenced by half of their countries not rising against them (although Henry VIII is a great example of a king whose, uhm, relationships created problems, which direct and indirect consequences plagued his country for centuries). For that matter, some of them couldn't do so if they wanted, a king's recognized mistress status was rather prestigious in late Medieval Europe - still not something desirable for a daughter of highest nobility, but nothing comparable to Westeros, where, outside of Dorn, it is seen as something fit for whores.

Regardless of anyone else's actions, directly insulting two of the eight greatest feudal clans of Westeros, closely allied with two others, when your father already did his best to piss off notoriously vengeful lord of the fifth, and when king's own domain is smaller and less populated than that of the any of the great lords, except maybe Greyjoys, oh and when your own royal house is divided by enmity between you and your father, was an unbelievably dumb move, almost on par with Eddard trusting Littlefinger, after Littlefinger explained in detail why exactly Eddard's current plans are unacceptable for him. Whatever Brandon did (and we don't know what exactly he did, Jaime is not a completely reliable witness, not when drunk and talking with obvious intention to shock his listener, although if we are to judge by the same tale, trial by weapons against Rhaegar was what he most likely actually demanded) made the situation explode immediately. But it had good chances of eventually exploding anyway, with Aerys, even pre-madness Aerys, on the throne. Even though Rhaegar certainly couldn't have imagined Aerys attempting to outright exterminate several Great Houses at once, she should have known better than anyone else, that his father is a petty, spiteful and mistrusting person, unlikely to placate the offending lords and likely to offend them further.

[Wolf Maid]

A man in his 20s, or even very much older, with a girl of 15 is normal in this culture.

So is taking her away from her family, when you look at it plainly.

People bringing up these things are imposing their modern thoughts and cultural expectations on a different culture.

Which is not to say that Rhaegar and Lyanna aren't in the wrong here. Just that these extra little points are not what should be held against Rhaegar. But they frequently are, because people can't see beyond their own cultural prejudices.

Is this sexist? That a woman can only be with a man as a wife or a whore?

Or misandrist? Believing that a man can only 'use' a woman he is not married to as a whore?

No matter.

Fact of the matter is you are making a judgment here, without data. There is reasonable evidence that says they might have even gotten married, and none that says they did not.

Or following prophecy.

Or in love and believing it could all be worked out (possibly 'provided' they removed themselves from sight to reduce the possibilities of foolish and irredeemable actions by others).

Yes, he had a right to be upset.

Yes he had a right to expect some consequences.

No he did not have a right to treason as a first recourse. You go looking for recompense, not demanding the death of the crown prince.

That is a ridiculous statement.

First, just because something happened, does not make it obvious it will happen before hand. If so, then I can hold you, personally, responsible for... well, anything, say this mornings Mumbai bombings. Because they happened, so they must have been obvious, and you didn't give warning!

Ok, so we all know that isn't real.

Second, because it is outright wrong. The Starks did not initially have the backing to fight a war and win. They had to ally with Baratheons, Arryns and Tullys, and secure the Tully's with marriage alliances. And even then it was a near run thing. The royalists, with a bigger army, were do well until first Ser Lyn Corbray picked up his wounded fathers sword and led a charge during which he killed Lewyn Martell which broke the Dornishmen, then Rhaegar died to Robert. It is a battle that could easily have gone the other way.

Its very equitable of you to place all the blame on Rhaegar and none on Lyanna, despite the evidence on her strong and active personality and no credible evidence that he did anything against her will.

And very nice of you to absolve Brandon for acting stupidly and treasonably because he was upset.

But we can agree that Aerys nailed the coffin door tight.

If you're going to judge based on the culture, you have to judge all things in that culture. It seems you're using modern standards for some arguments and medieval standards for others. Obviously, it would not have been normal for him to take the daughter of a high lord away from her family without their knowledge or consent, we know that because he had to steal her away and hide her from them. That would be the same as kidnapping to them. She was promised to someone else. Making the family break that promise is slight on their honor. Not to mention he was taking away chances of alliances and/or property that the family would gain through that marriage.

In that culture Lyanna would have been judged as a whore. He was married and had children. It isn't like he was getting a divorce. Also, I don't see any evidence that they got married or any evidence that that marriage would have been legal.

Whether it was for love or a prophecy, putting thousands of lives at risk is a stupid and selfish thing to do. As the future king, he had a responsibility to do what was best for his people. To not expect any backlash after he publicly humiliated 3 noble families is just dumb. Him running away before the backlash started wouldn't stop it from happening, it just meant that someone else would have to deal with it. Again, a very selfish thing to do.

By backing, I meant their allies. Of course they were not going to fight by themselves. Also, I didn't mean that them winning was a sure thing, but that they obviously had enough backing to get a win. IIRC, the north is the largest region in the realm, they also had the east as well as some southern families. The Targaryen's were at least equally matched, if not outmatched, and there was a good chance that they could lose their Kingdom over this, which they did. He deserved to lose if he was willing to risk that much, rather then put his own feelings aside or, at the very least, try to work things out with the families.

Lyanna doesn't get equal blame because, first, we don't know if she went willingly. But, even so, she was 15. At 15 you get more leeway on mistakes, especially when there is an adult involved. Brandon doesn't get much blame from me on the war either. Anyone else would have likely faced death for what Rhaegar did. Like I mentioned before, they had the backing to go to war but he wanted to settle it one on one. To me, what he did was better than declaring war and putting thousands of lives at risk.

[Lost Time]

As we all know from the red wedding, wedding contracts should be taken pretty seriously. Rhaegar absconding with Lyanna out of nowhere was entirely foolish on both their parts. They pissed off 3 major houses in Stark, Barantheon, and of course DORNE!

Furthermore, he was already married. She would've been pretty much his whore. Her children by him would've been bastards who have no claim to anything. Polygamy would NOT have changed that fact. To a highborn such as herself in a world built on claims and bloodlines, it would've been a disgrace to her family's name.

But ultimately, Rhaegar/Lyanna, Aerys, and Brandon can all be universally blamed for the war. The "kidnapping" was the kindle for the fire that was soon to start. Brandon was the fuel. And Aerys provided the spark and the wind that made that fire uncontrollable.

[Dragonfish]

Also, I don't see any evidence that they got married or any evidence that that marriage would have been legal.

Furthermore, he was already married. She would've been pretty much his whore. Her children by him would've been bastards who have no claim to anything. Polygamy would NOT have changed that fact.

*Sigh* I don't understand why people have such a hard time accepting the fact that there is a polygamy precedent among Targs. You can argue all you want about whether or not there was actually a wedding, but what you can't argue about is that polygamy was legal, that the children of such marriages were legitimate, and that the institution has merely fallen out of favor, not been outlawed, as far as we know. Now, would it have been harder for people to accept polygamy in Rhaegar's day? Sure. But that's an issue of pragmatics, not legality. And ultimately, the real question is not whether people would have accepted it, but whether Rhaegar believed he could get people to accept it. I think the answer to that question is clearly "yes."

[the great garbo]

Rhaeger was the stupid one. He's the heir to the Seven Kingdoms but is apparently too dumb to realize that pissing on half the kingdoms could potentially lead to war? Run off with a Stark girl, who is betrothed to a Baratheon, while still married to a Martell. Plus, the brother of the Stark girl and her Baratheon fiancee are like sons to Jon Aryn and the Lannisters already kind of hate you for being rejected. Wow, really? No one saw that coming?

[C.T. Phipps]

I don't think there's any problem with the fact that Rhaegar and Lyanna did something EXTREMELY stupid despite being otherwise intelligent people.

Allow me to offer my thoughts on what they were probably thinking:

1. If Lyanna is anything like Arya, I have no doubt she considered "permanently dishonoring herself" a small price to pay to be with Rhaegar. Likewise, it might have gotten her out of a marriage to Robert as there's no way he would marry a woman who had allowed herself to be deflowered in such a publicly humiliating manner. At best, she might be disowned and could live with the Prince/later King and sire his bastards.

(Polygamy questions aside)

2. Rhaegar undoubtedly knew he was playing with fire but he probably expected the Baraetheons to be outraged but people he could placate. I doubt Rhaegar realized Robert would react like Rhaegar had spirited off her and raped her daily. He didn't understand Robert was so utterly removed from reality regarding his relationship with Lyanna. He probably just assumed she was just another girl to him.

It's only when Aerys burned alive the Starks that I think THEY decided Aerys had to die and it was a war against the Crown with Robert being all for it.

[Lost Time]

*Sigh* I don't understand why people have such a hard time accepting the fact that there is a polygamy precedent among Targs. You can argue all you want about whether or not there was actually a wedding, but what you can't argue about is that polygamy was legal, that the children of such marriages were legitimate, and that the institution has merely fallen out of favor, not been outlawed, as far as we know. Now, would it have been harder for people to accept polygamy in Rhaegar's day? Sure. But that's an issue of pragmatics, not legality. And ultimately, the real question is not whether people would have accepted it, but whether Rhaegar believed he could get people to accept it. I think the answer to that question is clearly "yes."

Straight up fanfiction right here. Where in the story is this every corroborated? And polygamy is "fine" when both wives are of the same house...your house (I believe Aegon married both sisters). It gets a bit more muddy when you consider 2 different households would have claims to the throne. Lyanna's children by Rhaegar would essentially be legalized bastards. And we know how the history of that has gone already for the Targs and other households...

And anyways, no great house in the kingdom would've accepted this. You can't have princes/kings absconding with wedding contracted young girls all the time, effectively stealing inheritances. That's a precedent I'm sure no one wants set. There's a reason Rhaegar and Lyanna just up and left everyone with no word. It was because they knew the massive shitstorm it was going to kick up.

[C.T. Phipps]

I agree.

I think that people are essentially projecting the idea they want onto the whole thing. They want Jon Snow not to be a bastard in the eyes of the kingdom and someone whose accepted by everyone.

[Dragonfish]

Straight up fanfiction right here. Where in the story is this every corroborated?

If Rhaegar thought he could get away with pissing off three or four of the Great Houses by absconding with Lyanna, or that he could get away with deposing his father in a Great Council, I don't see what keeps us from thinking he believed he could get away with reviving polygamy. The man believed he had clout, it's as simple as that.

And polygamy is "fine" when both wives are of the same house...your house (I believe Aegon married both sisters).

Incorrect. You'll see at this link that Maegor the Cruel had eight or nine wives, all or most from other houses, some of them at the same time. If you're going to accuse someone of writing fanfiction, best get your facts straight.

It gets a bit more muddy when you consider 2 different households would have claims to the throne. Lyanna's children by Rhaegar would essentially be legalized bastards. And we know how the history of that has gone already for the Targs and other households...

Aegon and his sisters surely must have had some sort of system for prioritizing one line over another. When Maegor the Cruel ascended to the throne over his nephew Jaehaerys, it was regarded as unusual because Jaehaerys, as the son of the previous king, ought to have been next in line before Maegor; however, it was not regarded as unusual because Maegor had no claim to the throne whatsoever. So I'm sorry, but the children of Targaryens' second wives are not considered bastards, legally speaking.

Now, of course the polygamy system would create complications with competing claims. But again, that's an issue of pragmatics, not legality.

And anyways, no great house in the kingdom would've accepted this. You can't have princes/kings absconding with wedding contracted young girls all the time, effectively stealing inheritances. That's a precedent I'm sure no one wants set. There's a reason Rhaegar and Lyanna just up and left everyone with no word. It was because they knew the massive shitstorm it was going to kick up.

I agree, it would have been very difficult for the other houses to accept, especially since the Targs no longer have their dragons. But again, that's an issue of pragmatics, not legality. Nothing you've said changes this. And ultimately, the only thing that matters wrt this theory is what Rhaegar believed he could do. Everything we know about Rhaegar suggests he believed he had clout; I see nothing to suggest he wouldn't believe he could revive polygamy if there was an important purpose for it.

I agree.

I think that people are essentially projecting the idea they want onto the whole thing. They want Jon Snow not to be a bastard in the eyes of the kingdom and someone whose accepted by everyone.

If you go back to my last post, you'll see that my point wasn't about whether or not Rhaegar and Lyanna were married. That's still a debatable topic, and while I personally lean toward them being married, I'm still a bit ambivalent about it and could see it going the other way. The main point of my post was to point out that there is a precedent for Targ polygamy in Westeros, and that Rhaegar could (and would, I think) have used that as a justification for marrying Lyanna. Anyone who argues that there's no precedent for Targ polygamy is simply in denial.

[StarkWard]

Rhaegar and Lyanna were both aware that their actions would have disastrous consequences. The question we should be asking is what reason do they know is heavy enough to make them do what they did? Answer: For the PWWP, for the Long Night, for the song of ice and fire. IMHO, the two thought that this cause was greater and carries far more weight than a civil war. They were willing to forsake their families, piss of a few more, and have others die in preparation for something bigger.

[Ivy Snow]

Maybe someone pulled some strings and made it seem that Lyanna was kidnapped to spark anger amongst the Starks? Like idk Varys?

[Ororo727 Jon Snow Fangirl]

Amen. Nowhere is it written that all the Starks have been honorable/just/good/smart whatever. Throughout most of this thread people are acting as if the Starks are always the good guys, regularly skipping over options that would indicate negativity in them. That's just old-fashion bias.

We have good information on about 6-7 Starks, decent info on a few more and vague info on random others. There have literally been thousands of Starks. Extremely small sample size.

Right. The Starks are not all good.

King Brandon, the Burner, burned the entire Northern fleet after the disappearance of his father on the Sunset Sea.

King Benjen the Bitter - not sure what his story is, but the name isn't very pleasant.

King Brandon the Bad - Name kind of says it all.

Brandon - We know his history.

Ned - He was not good in my opinion. He followed rules, however, that doesn't make you a good person to blindly follow without questioning it just makes you not so smart, as he proved to be.

How good was he truly to Jon or Cat?

If, Jon truly is Lyanna/Rhaegar spawn why not tell his wife? Why dishonor her and rub Jon in her face for 14 years because of a promise to a dead girl? Catelyn would understand the need to keep the secret in order to protect Jon's life from Robert. I can see not telling the boy the truth if he is indeed a Targeryan, but your wife?

If, Jon is his child, why not explain it to her if you truly "love" your wife and child? Why have Jon suffer with Cateyln's hate for all of those years?

[Dragonfish]

If, Jon truly is Lyanna/Rhaegar spawn why not tell his wife? Why dishonor her and rub Jon in her face for 14 years because of a promise to a dead girl?

Because the more people who know a secret, the harder it is to keep it secret. Plus, I don't think Ned would want to make his wife complicit in his treason. If he doesn't tell her the truth, then she at least has plausible deniability if the secret gets out.

Catelyn would understand the need to keep the secret in order to protect Jon's life from Robert.

Would she? This is an awfully big assumption. I think it's more likely that Catelyn would consider Jon to be an even greater danger to her family than he was before