[BOOK SPOILERS] How can they handle seasons 4 and 5, if it gets there?

[Humble Asskicker]

I think the best thing they could do is to combine the fourth and fifth book into 2 or 3 seasons. So, they will be able to tell the entire storyline and without losing the audience, because they might miss all of their favorite characters that weren't in the Feast for Crows. Since the fourth and the fifth were written during the same time span, I don't think this will be much of a problem.

That would be the absolute best thing to do if they wanted to put their audience to sleep. Have you actually read Feast/Dance? I'm in the clear majority in opining that Feast is a let-down, and in the clear minority in claiming that Dance really isn't a bad book, but I will readily admit that there is very little that is visually exciting in either novels. You could squeeze out ten episodes tops from those two books. Any more and it would be a huge drag.

I'm actually excited about the adaptation though. If you cut out all the filler (which is most of the content) you are left with a potentially riveting season.

Here's how it should go:

Season 2: Clash with some Storm. 10 episodes.

Season 3: First half of Storm, focusing primarily on Robb's downfall. 8-10 episodes.

Season 4: Final half of Storm, with the Greyjoy and Dorne chapters from Feast interspersed, and some of the beginning chapters of Dance. 10 episodes.

Season 5: The rest of Dance and a goodly chunk of Winds of Winter. 10 episodes.

Season 6-7: The finale. I'm not sure if this will be comprised of 2 books or five books or more, but for the tv series, it should only be 2 seasons, 8-10 episodes each.

No doubt there will be those who moan loudly about how every little detail was not retained. I say to those, suck it. Through bitter experience we've learned - as should have you - that sometimes you can have too much on your plate, and less is more.

Would this mean the TV show catches up to GRRM? Of course, but who doubted this would happen anyway. GRRM is not going to begin writing his next novel until the beginning of next year, and even then he'll be taking numerous breaks to travel and visit the filming of the tv series. So even at his peak speed (Storm), it will take him 3 1/2 years to complete book 6. And you would have to be wildly optimistic to believe him capable of that anymore.

The tv series will catch up to GRRM regardless (provided the series is allowed to continue to that point).

[Bastien]

Season 5: The rest of Dance and a goodly chunk of Winds of Winter. 10 episodes.

I was thinking this too, particularly if [redacted potential DWD spoilers I just realized I posted]. Bottom line, combining FFC and DWD and having them completed by the end of Season 5 needs to happen IMO. Can you imagine the audience sitting thru two seasons of Daenerys dithering in Meereen? There's a guaranteed way to drive off your audience. It'll probably be bad enough that the Others haven't attacked by then, given some comments from non-readers I've seen. There's something to be said for building up anticipation yes, but also for making good on promises.

[mpbarnes]

I was thinking this too, particularly if [redacted potential DWD spoilers I just realized I posted]. Bottom line, combining FFC and DWD and having them completed by the end of Season 5 needs to happen IMO. Can you imagine the audience sitting thru two seasons of Daenerys dithering in Meereen? There's a guaranteed way to drive off your audience. It'll probably be bad enough that the Others haven't attacked by then, given some comments from non-readers I've seen. There's something to be said for building up anticipation yes, but also for making good on promises.

I agree, and having recently finished ADWD I still stand by my original points with a slight revision now below,

Season 2 = 2012: COK + 15% of SOS (10 ep.)

Season 3 = 2013: 85% of SOS (12 ep.)

Season 4 = 2014: AFFC + ADWD (12 ep.)

Season 5 = 2015: "WOW" (12 ep.)

Season 6 = 2016: "ADOS" or a film trilogy for 2017,2018 and 2020.

I'm changing things mainly because...

Very little really happens in ADWD, which combined with nothing really happening in AFFC = only 1 necessary season. There is no way to stretch out Dany's storyline over two seasons based off of what is in ADWD, every chapter in ADWD is Dany in Mereen, at court, reports of someone dying. I don't see 5 episodes out of everything before her wedding, let alone two seasons! Even when things start to move, it's still a more or less 3 episode arc, wedding, fighting pit, dothraki sea. In a 12 episode season the wedding could be at ep. 7, the pits at ep. 8 or 9 and the final bit saved for the finale. Dany's story in ADWD can't be sidelined and it can't be expanded. Because so little of it is in ACOK, they HAVE to include more from ASOS which means that can't be two seasons either. The only character whose journey is robust enough in ADWD, in my opinion, is Tyrions, but even that could be contained within a 12 episode season, I was working it out just a moment ago in the car. Add all the cliffhangers together from both books and you have a great couple of final episodes for a single season.

So I'm still hoping for Season 3 to be Mostly ASOS, I'm sorry I just don't think the RW works as a season finale, there's not enough ASOS to carry another season and not enough that can be added from AFFC/ADWD to combine the two post RW.

At this point I really think that by Season 5 & Season 6 will not be directly based off of a book. I think GRRM and the writers will move ahead, and Season 6, unless it does go to film, will be way ahead of the finished book.

[JagLover]

In terms of how they will handle books 4&5 it is not really a matter of personal preference, what the book fans would like to see or not, but just the logic of the medium.

Firstly the limitations of both budget and the ability of audiences to identify the characters which limits the number of speaking parts. Season 2 will already have one of the largest cast lists of any TV show and that has far fewer POV's and the minor characters they interact with than AFFC & ADWD.

Secondly there is the need to finish in a realistic timescale. The most any series with a continous narrative can expect is 7 seasons IMO, and probably less. I.E three before AFFC & ADWD and at least two after, hence only one season can be allocated. If we compare it with past epic sci fi Babylon 5 only had five seasons and had to compress two seasons worth of material into the fourth season because they believed they were about to get cancelled. It is simply the nature of TV shows, they will have to maintain a constant momentum, which doesn't include multiple sub plots and new charcaters noone cares about.

Thirdly two seasons split in half the way AFFC & ADWD were would not work on the screen. The alternative would be a Kalediscope as each episode can only allocate a few minutes to each major character.

What I believe they will do (if they reach that far). Is excise entire plotlines. Most of the Iron islands, the Aegon storyline entirely, most of the events in Mereen etc.

A season with Jon as LC, Sansa in the vale, Arya in training, Cersei ruling and making a mess of things, Tyrion's adventures (picking up his storyline at the brothel where he was captured) and a restricted Mereen plotline. Would limit the plot to already established characters and actors, while offering a decent season's worth of development.

[JagLover]

I agree, and having recently finished ADWD I still stand by my original points with a slight revision now below,

Season 2 = 2012: COK + 15% of SOS (10 ep.)

Season 3 = 2013: 85% of SOS (12 ep.)

Season 4 = 2014: AFFC + ADWD (12 ep.)

Season 5 = 2015: "WOW" (12 ep.)

Season 6 = 2016: "ADOS"

I agree with this timetable, and I think that is the only way it can work on TV. A season 5 or 6 that staggers to the end of ADWD, would be promptly cancelled at that point and we would never reach the end on TV.

The 15% of ASOS I would move to season 2 is predominantly Dany storyline. The climax in Astereen would be an awesome way to finish the second season.

[Leuf]

I think they should just forget about the books after season 3 and go their own way. They don't have to try to make Feast and Dance work and they don't have to wait for GRRM to wrap things up.

[oierem]

Season 3 must DEFINATELY include pretty much everything from ASOS. (unless, perhaps, the last part of Sansa's story).

Therefore, season 4 would combine most (if not all) of the next two books. However, the huge problem is that George will still have to write the next couple of books.

So, they either wait more than a year after Season 3 (which is, I think, possible), or they make up their own ending.

Seasons 1-3 (books 1-3) seems to be their main goal right now.

[Eggplant Wizard]

I think the show and the books are going to diverge more once we get to ASOS because of budgetary reasons and the length of the season. Sure there's a lot of filler you can cut out but you still have a lot of battles in there and different expensive things.

They will have to expand some characters and add more stuff like a previous poster said. Jaime is one of my favorite characters so I hope they do that. That conversation he had with Cat was very similar to the one they have in ASOS with several identical exchanges. I assume they will show his attempted escape. And...I don't know what else they could show really. He is in jail after all.

The thing about having such a large cast is that it complicates the depth you can get into on TV. The actors want to act and I really wonder how they will keep certain actors under contract with so few episodes to their name. Take Littlefinger for instance, they expanded his role in the first season. I don't remember what he was doing on ACOK and he wasn't in the following books much.

[gillyflower]

This is how I'd do it.

Season 1) AGOT

Season 2) ACOK

Season 3) ASOS up until a certain wedding. Wouldn't that make a season finale to remember?

Season 4) The rest of ASOS, plus the Iron Islands chapters up until the Kingsmoot. The Shield Islands Victarion chapter will have to wait until the next season.

Season 5) AFFC/ADWD minus most of the Iron Islands chapters.

Season 6) AFFC/ADWD

:agree:

[EddardStarkForever]

Season Two: A Clash of Kings, some early scenes from A Storm of Swords.

Season Three Part One: ASOS up to Joff's wedding.

Season Three Part Two: The rest of ASOS.

Season Four: A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons made into one season.

Season Five: The Winds of Winter

Season Six: A Dream of Spring

I've read AFFC and ADWD and they can definitely cut down both books to one season. Hopefully the last two books will be have much more action and excitement, although if they're more character based like AFFC/ADWD then maybe you could squeeze them into just one season, too.

[Rodgex]

After seeing a roughly general consensus for 6 seasons, I've been convinced that that probably is the best thing, at least that way the tv audience will not become bored with the show dragging out and we will actually get to see the whole series made on the tv show. Lots of other shows have been cancelled prematurely so it's better to have it completed thatn being perfectly accurate to the book and stopping half way through. Also, the only thing I am worried about is what happens when the show catches up with GRRM, which could happen by WoW, but definitely by ADoS....?

[Azerate]

Personally I'd love to see most of aFFC skipped, a huge chunk of the book were basically fillers and side stories not relevant nor interesting.

[JagLover]

. Also, the only thing I am worried about is what happens when the show catches up with GRRM, which could happen by WoW, but definitely by ADoS....?

I imagine he could give them a rough guide as to how events are supposed to play out easily enough.

[Which Tyler]

Personally I'd love to see most of aFFC skipped, a huge chunk of the book were basically fillers and side stories not relevant nor interesting.

I'm interested every time I see people saying this.

How on earth do you know that those side-stories aren't relevant? have you actually read the series right through to the very end already, and therefore know what is and isn't relevant?

Last I checked, GRRM hadn't finished the story; so at this stage, only GRRM knows what is and isn't relevant from the first 5 books

[oierem]

I imagine he could give them a rough guide as to how events are supposed to play out easily enough.

Do you really think that Martin will spoil his own book?

[Caligula_K]

I'm interested every time I see people saying this.

How on earth do you know that those side-stories aren't relevant? have you actually read the series right through to the very end already, and therefore know what is and isn't relevant?

Last I checked, GRRM hadn't finished the story; so at this stage, only GRRM knows what is and isn't relevant from the first 5 books

I'm going to make some predictions here, even as someone who likes A Feast For Crows:

-Brienne's red herring side trek with Nimble Dick that takes up two chapters will not be relevant. Nor will her going up to twenty different people and asking if they know a maiden with auburn hair

-The Iron Islands kingsmoot will be relevant. The two to three chapters setting up the kingsmoot... Not so much.

-Cersei doing stupid things will be relevant. But it will also be condensed for the TV show, as it should be.

[Tall Tyrion Lannister!]

You could take out the Cersei prophecy stuff, since it's all internal thoughts anyway, just have her do the crazy stuff she does. instead of brienne going up all the people she goes up too just have it be like 5. or just have it be those pople she meets on the road and seems to spend the whole chapter with.

I would think it'd be like this

Season 2- ACOK and maybe a couple chapters of Jaime. Jaime getting his hand chopped off would be a nice way to end the season.

Season 3 remainder of Jaime's stuff and maybe the rest of ASOS.

Season 4 remainder of ASOS, if not AFFC/ADWD

Season 5 AFFC/ADWD if not in season 4

Season 6-7 the rest of the show.

[Black Amethyst]

I don't think we are going to see it go past a third season. I would be pleasantly surprised though. AFFC doesn't lend itself to the tv series format very well at all, and was the least liked book, for lack of action. If they do continue past a third season, I would imagine it would be heavily modified and diverge much more from the book.

[irith]

Honestly I'll be shocked if the TV series makes it through to the end. Knowing that, a lot of people want it to end with Season 3, presumably wrapping up SoS... but that's not likely. That season should be very successful, so they'll press on and do Season 4, then promptly fizzle out, from a combination of lack of action, and the possibility of them having caught up to GRRM at that point.

Let's look at this. Neither Feast nor Dance would be even remotely passable as its own season in the TV medium, thus they have to be combined. But then, we're looking at being done with the current five books in 3 years... and even if GRRM finishes Winds by then, that will only give him a year to finish Dream. He won't outrun the TV series.

I really doubt that the Feast/Dance season will do well. That's the most likely place for it to get cancelled.

However, if the series somehow keeps going, the only real way forward is:

S1- Game

S2- Clash, with a few strategically placed events from Storm to keep characters relevant and make some arcs more satisfying.

S3- Storm, possibly with 1 or 2 extra episodes, but I'm leaning towards them just axing a few little threads of plot.

S4- A few bits of Storm if they don't condense it too much, and then all of Feast and Dance. Those have to be condensed to stay relevant.

S5- Winds

S6- Dream

By season 3 there will be a lot of differences; the huge cast just isn't realistic for TV at that point. Lots of things will be cut and/or condensed. There are tons of relatively minor characters who can be cut or combined with others.

[JagLover]

Do you really think that Martin will spoil his own book?

It is doubtful whether the TV show will ever reach the end, but fingers crossed, let us say they do. WOW might be out by the time they get to that season, but no further IMO. Do you think GRRM would want them blundering blindly into the dark and departing entirely from his storyline.

Furthermore I think a big part of his income is coming from the TV series (and from sales of his books to fans of the TV show) so why wouldn't he want to make it the biggest success he can?