[ADWD Spoilers]A Host of Small Matters

[Brandon the Epithetless]

However, I couldn't figure out at the time of reading (late night) whether Aemond worked out to be the brother of Aegon II, or of Aegon III (Rhaenyra's son, Aegon II's successor). We knew previously that Aegon III had a brother (Viserys) but no information about other siblings; we also knew that Aegon II has some siblings, but that they all died in the course of the Dance.

A brother of Aegon II I think, because the way Tyrion deduced it it couldn't have been Aemond's dragon because Swann was on their side, hence the dragon the Swann knight attempted to kill was Rhaenyra's. Besides Aegon III and his brother Viserys II, were quite young when the war ended so I doubt any of their siblings would have been involved in actual fighting as Aegon III was I think Rhaenyra's eldest.

Interestingly was Aemond's mount Visenya's or did he just name it the same, was it ever mentioned in the book?

[Werthead]

Oh yeah, we got some new dragon names. Serwyn the Mirror Shield slew Urrax by confusing him with his reflection and then stabbing him through the eye, but this might just be a legend. The Halfmaester claims that Ser Byron Swann tried the same trick on Vhagar, one of the original three Targ dragons at that time ridden by Aemond, one of Aegon II's brothers, and was killed for his troubles. However, as Tyrion points out Swann was sworn to Storm's End, which was for Aegon, so there was no reason for Swann to be trying to kill Vhagar. So he suggests Swann was trying to kill Rhaenyra's she-dragon Syrax instead.

Interesting that Vhagar was still alive during the Dance, 120 years after Aegon's conquest. That suggests that the three original dragons were different in age (since Balerion died at 200 during the reign of Jaehaerys, potentially many decades - or possibly just two decades - earlier). For some reason I'd always thought of them as hatchling-mates. Not sure why.

On another point, I though it was a bit odd that the eastern continent never got a name in four previous novels, was not mentioned at all in ADWD, but suddenly heads up a whole chunk of the appendices. GRRM could have just left it out and just let it be used in the TV series. Or maybe Samwell will find out in TWoW it's a term used by a few maesters and no-one else gives a toss about it :)

[Arataniello]

A brother of Aegon II I think, because the way Tyrion deduced it it couldn't have been Aemond's dragon because Swann was on their side, hence the dragon the Swann knight attempted to kill was Rhaenyra's. Besides Aegon III and his brother Viserys II, were quite young when the war ended so I doubt any of their siblings would have been involved in actual fighting as Aegon III was I think Rhaenyra's eldest.

Interestingly was Aemond's mount Visenya's or did he just name it the same, was it ever mentioned in the book?

Thank you. That means thst Aemond was previously known, but unnamed, as one of Aegon II's siblings. He therefore also died during the Dance of Dragons.

[Brandon the Epithetless]

On another point, I though it was a bit odd that the eastern continent never got a name in four previous novels, was not mentioned at all in ADWD, but suddenly heads up a whole chunk of the appendices. GRRM could have just left it out and just let it be used in the TV series. Or maybe Samwell will find out in TWoW it's a term used by a few maesters and no-one else gives a toss about it :)

Yes probably right the land is too diverse to be tied down with one name unlike Westeros, so probably only the scholarly types will have the need to use a label.

[KyleLitke]

What was Septa Scolera going to say?

In Cersei's chapter, she asks after Margaery and asks if there's been a trial. The Septa responds with "Soon, but her brother-" before being cut off by the other Septa, who says it is not for them to speak of such things. As far as we know Margaery wasn't going to have a trial by combat. Was it as simple as the Septa about to say that her brother was injured and couldn't defend her in a Trial by Combat? But Cersei obviously already knew that, it happened quite awhile before this. I wonder if there was something else going on with one of the brothers.

[noobilly]

Interesting that Vhagar was still alive during the Dance, 120 years after Aegon's conquest. That suggests that the three original dragons were different in age (since Balerion died at 200 during the reign of Jaehaerys, potentially many decades - or possibly just two decades - earlier). For some reason I'd always thought of them as hatchling-mates. Not sure why.

I remember someone (Barristan?) said something like "the Targaryen dragons were bred for war, and in war they died". So Balerion dying first might not be an indication of age. Maybe it was killed. Maybe by the fanatic warriors of the Faith. Now THAT would make Cersei see them in a different light.

[moffy]

[quote name='Werthead' timestamp='1310748039' post=

The white raven never went to Riverrun. Jaime assumed it had because it was snowing and someone said, "A raven's arrived," and he thought it was a white raven. Then they said no, it was the raven bearing Cersei's letter.

[Werthead]

Here's a question for people: the three-eyed crow, a major mystery from early in the first book, turns out to be Bloodraven, a very obscure character from two relatively hard-to-find short stories. Good idea or irritating for those who haven't read the shorts?

[KyleLitke]

Good idea...why would it be bad? The alternative would be he's a random character nobody ever heard of. It's an awesome nod to people who read the Dunk and Egg stories, and if you didn't, well, then it shouldn't be a big deal.

[Corvinus85]

Not sure if anybody else posted this, but in one of Jon's earlier chapters he thinks of all the capable men of the Watch who have died. Among them he lists Jarman Buckwell. When did he die?

I know that he survived the Fist and got back to Castle Black since he was the one who told the others of Jon's betrayal in ASOS. Maybe he died at the Bridge of Skulls when Bowen Marsh (new member of my black list) led the garrison of Castle Black against the Weeper.

Or did Martin make a mistake? I mean I think he is dead, because he didn't make an appearance in ADWD, but Martin maybe killed him by mistake.

[Songstress]

As for Jorah. Jorah Mormont, meet Karma. Karma, meet Jorah Mormont.

Aye. At one point I put the book down (well, actually, I was reading on my phone's Kindle app, so I put the phone down... doesn't have the same ring) and sat there reveling in the fact that Jorah, who was sentenced to death for selling slaves, had just been sold as a slave.

Delicious poetic justice.

[Datepalm]

Aye. At one point I put the book down (well, actually, I was reading on my phone's Kindle app, so I put the phone down... doesn't have the same ring) and sat there reveling in the fact that Jorah, who was sentenced to death for selling slaves, had just been sold as a slave.

Delicious poetic justice.

Didn't even notice that. (I don't like Jorah very much.) Excellent!

[Claireducky]

Another interesting Easter egg from the appendix-- Lord Tarly had some other things going on at Maidenpool than just keeping the town in order. Apparently Dickon is now wed to Eleanor, the 13 year old daughter and heir of William Mooton, Lord of Maidenpool. If I recall, Tarly had Mooton locked in a cell during AFFC, as well. Looks like Dickon stands to inherit Horn Hill and Maidenpool both.

[Reyne]

Does anyone get the impression that Mirri Maz Duur's prophecy might be coming true?

"When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east," said Mirri Maz Duur. "When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves. When your womb quickens again, and you bear a living child. Then he will return, and not before."

"The Sun rises in the west, and sets in the East" - Quentyn Martell.

"The Seas go Dry" - the Dothraki Sea. "The grass was paler than she remembered, a wan and sickly green on the verge of going yellow. After that would come brown. The grass was dying" (P931)

"Mountains blow in the wind like leaves" - This is a bit iffy, but the Pyramid of Hazkar collapsing into a smoking ruin?

"When your womb quickens again" - It's sort of implied in the text that the berries Dany ate were an abortifacient, and she miscarried as a result. (She can't remember having her period in months.)

"And you bear a living child" - ?

Drogo returns - ? Possibly Dany's new child will be Drogo reborn? Or perhaps he would have gotten better if she hadn't burned him in the funeral pyre.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

"Mountain blow in the wind like leaves" maybe when UnMoutian dies or stops getting Qybrun's treatment's his spell will be undone and the UnMoutian will disintergate???

Just throwing it out there, - I don't think the Moutain will end this way.

[Claireducky]

Does anyone get the impression that Mirri Maz Duur's prophecy might be coming true?

"The Sun rises in the west, and sets in the East" - Quentyn Martell.

"The Seas go Dry" - the Dothraki Sea. "The grass was paler than she remembered, a wan and sickly green on the verge of going yellow. After that would come brown. The grass was dying" (P931)

"Mountains blow in the wind like leaves" - This is a bit iffy, but the Pyramid of Hazkar collapsing into a smoking ruin?

"When your womb quickens again" - It's sort of implied in the text that the berries Dany ate were an abortifacient, and she miscarried as a result. (She can't remember having her period in months.)

"And you bear a living child" - ?

Drogo returns - ? Possibly Dany's new child will be Drogo reborn? Or perhaps he would have gotten better if she hadn't burned him in the funeral pyre.

Nice post, or a couple reasons. I hadn't considered that the berries caused her to miscarry, or even that she was pregnant. I thought it was simply a case of being undernourished during her time with Drogon. Something to think about!

I have never considered mirri maz's words to be prophetical, just a flowery way if saying, "never, hahaha.". But the line about the sun does have echoes of Quentyn and the dothraki sea is drying out. I also like the following persons comment about the mountain bit having to do with the Gregor spell disintegrating. More food for my thoughts, thank you!

[Reyne]

Well, you expect the events to happen in semi-chronological order. And also, they should be connected to Dany somehow (or at least in the East.)

"The Pyramid of Hazkar has collapsed into a smoking ruin." That's the closest thing I can find that satisfies it.

And also, when Barristan accuses Hizdahr of poisoning Dany with the locusts, his alibi is "hot spices do not agree with me."

However, we are told earlier that Hizdahr's favorite meal is "dog in honey, stuffed with prunes and peppers." (P480.) Though it's possible that they were bell peppers...

[Ygritte]

Does anyone get the impression that Mirri Maz Duur's prophecy might be coming true?

"The Sun rises in the west, and sets in the East" - Quentyn Martell.

"The Seas go Dry" - the Dothraki Sea. "The grass was paler than she remembered, a wan and sickly green on the verge of going yellow. After that would come brown. The grass was dying" (P931)

"Mountains blow in the wind like leaves" - This is a bit iffy, but the Pyramid of Hazkar collapsing into a smoking ruin?

"When your womb quickens again" - It's sort of implied in the text that the berries Dany ate were an abortifacient, and she miscarried as a result. (She can't remember having her period in months.)

"And you bear a living child" - ?

Drogo returns - ? Possibly Dany's new child will be Drogo reborn? Or perhaps he would have gotten better if she hadn't burned him in the funeral pyre.

I think she fulfilled the conditions and is fertile again, but that Drogo-reborn would have been this baby, the one she just lost. Now she can have another but it won't be him.

[alpha5099]

It certainly seems like her menstruating is a big deal, though I hadn't considered that she had perhaps miscarried. I was more surprised that she menstruated at all; I had somehow gotten the notion that her barrenness also meant that had stopped, and was surprised that her mentally thinking of when she last had bled was so relatively recently.

[urizen]

Does anyone have any speculation as to why Varys killed Pycelle? Kevan makes sense as Varys himself says but Pycelle? The man is a doddering old fool.

Also, 50 hides of fertile land, how big an area is that?