The missing sex scene

[brashcandy]

I know GRRM gets a lot of flack for not being able to write good love/sex scenes but I think the problem is that he spends a lot of time writing ones between characters that we either don't really need to see having sex ALL the time (Tyrion) or at all (Sam) (Lysa/LF) or with one character that we want to see (Jon) just not with another character (Ygritte) And he kinda cheapens all the encounters a bit - most of them are of the hard and fast variety of sex, mixed in with some slapping around and myrish swamps.

What I want to see in TWOW is a real genuine sex scene between two people that care a lot or love each other and are taking their time in the bedroom. GRRM needs to slow it down and take it easy. This is why I still vote for the San/San bedroom scene as my favorite love scene even though it had no sex. All the ingredients were there though (except perhaps Sansa being a tad wee too young)

GRRM can obviously write twisted romance very well so he should be able to give a realistic portrayal of what "twisted" sex looks like without resorting to stereotypical depictions and dodgey metaphors.

[Verboten]

... SANDOR WAS GOING TO RAPE SANSA. That is not romantic. At all.

[brashcandy]

... SANDOR WAS GOING TO RAPE SANSA. That is not romantic. At all.

I love a good rape scene actually

[headtrip_honey]

I love a good rape scene actually

:shocked:

[Verboten]

I love a good rape scene actually

Happening to a twelve year old. You're disgusting.

[brashcandy]

:shocked:

Sorry, i was being a troll trying to learn from Verboten

Sandor was not going to rape Sansa, i know this is the interpretation many people take from that scene but i really don't. Actually, that's another missing sex scene besides Renly and Loras!

[headtrip_honey]

Sorry, i was being a troll trying to learn from Verboten

Sandor was not going to rape Sansa, i know this is the interpretation many people take from that scene but i really don't. Actually, that's another missing sex scene besides Renly and Loras!

K...well...troll better next time?

Otherwise I will have to throw this graphic at you and beat you with it.

[Sand Snake No. 9]

Sorry... Love triangle is what I meant. Taena to Cersei in AFFC: "When she wed Lord Renly at Highgarden, I helped disrobe him for the bedding. His lordship was a well-made man, and lusty. I saw the proof when we tumbled him into the wedding bed where his bride awaited him as naked as her name day, blushing prettily beneath the coverlets. Ser Loras had carried her up the steps himself. Margaery may say that the marriage was never consummated, that Lord Renly had drunk too much wine at the wedding feast, but I promise you, the bit between his legs was anything but weary when last I saw it.” I think Renly is bisexual and Loras is gay and completely in love with him.... So in love, he doesn't care the guy beds his sister. This doesn't mean Renly doesn't love Loras, though.

I think Taena is a butt-kissing liar who would have told Cersei anything she wanted to hear to remain in her favor. I also suspect that she's a spy, although I don't know for whom, and that if Cersei brings Taena back to court she'll be making yet another mistake.

But on topic: I'll pass on the gay sex scene too. GRRM's heterosexual sex scenes are squicky enough for me, especially those of the near-rape-of-the-underaged girl and or the puking-abusive-dwarf variety. I thought the girl-on-girl stuff was completely gratuitous.

Actually, the only scene I found vaguely erotic in the whole series was Jaime's naked stroll across the bathhouse to join Brienne in the pool, mostly because I could imagine Brienne's head about to explode. As for the rest, a quick cut to crashing waves would have been just fine.

[lady crackhead]

same here, I hardly excited about GRRM straight sex scenes and shudder at thought of him attempting a gay one.

It would get too confusing, what with an extra manhood in there. Eg, "He took his manhood in his hand."

...How was the one from the tv show awful? What was awful was the red-headed whore constantly flashing everyone and having a gratuitous sex scene in the middle of a conversation with Littlefinger.

The complaints over the cocksucking noises are overblown. If it was Daenerys or Cersei making that noise, at least half of you wouldnt be moaning over it. And those noises just mean he's doing it right; who wants a dry blowjob?

I personally found it distastely. Not the act of gay sex, but how it was portrayed. It took in my view all the depth out of their relationship.

That whole scene gave their relationship depth and the sex added to it. What exactly did you find so "distastely" about it?

At 15-16, Robb and Jon were young and innocent when it came down to sex. And arrogant as Loras is, Renly has always struck me as the more... vividly and glaringly outspoken. But sure, it's just as possible that it was the other way around. Or maybe it was mutual :dunno:

I'm wondering why Jon & Robb are so innocent, too. First of all, they're living with the biggest slut in the north. Who likes to brag. Secondly, it's medieval times; people were bawdy. It makes more sense that a boy growing up privileged would have plenty of chance to have sexual experiences around ye olde castle, like Theon & most probably Loras.

She being Brienne.

Ha, Bourne ;p Verboten, youre getting sloppy with my name. I prefer a good sense of humor in a man and that joke about the peach was a dud.

also disagree about Brienne. I can easily see that inspiring such loyalty, and coupled with the fact that he's quite a handsome devil, have no trouble believing she would think she's in love with him.

You just said what we implied, that Brienne fell for Renly because he was nice to her and charming/handsome enough. She's just an overgrown teen girl at heart. I hope she swears herself to Sansa at some point and they have castle pajama parties where they talk about their crushes. Just like on the "Sandor Cleagane" threads.

I know GRRM gets a lot of flack for not being able to write good love/sex scenes.... or with one character that we want to see (Jon) just not with another character (Ygritte) And he kinda cheapens all the encounters a bit - most of them are of the hard and fast variety of sex

Hard and fast sex? Where? Other than his first time, Jon takes it slower afterwards. Theon doesnt just tell the captain's daughter to get on her knees, he sweetens her up and also makes her listen to his, "On the Iron Islands...", sexposition for about 3 pages, any more and she'd beg him to put it in her ear. Tyrion is constantly having drawn out sex scenes full of foreplay. So I dont see where your complaint is coming from unless you want a drawn out romantic lovemaking scenario of the kind you get in a 'romance' or 'bodice ripper' book. IMHO, Asha & Qarl's se scene was drawn out and romantic.

What I want to see in TWOW is a real genuine sex scene between two people that care a lot or love each other and are taking their time in the bedroom. GRRM needs to slow it down and take it easy. This is why I still vote for the San/San bedroom scene as my favorite love scene even though it had no sex. All the ingredients were there though (except perhaps Sansa being a tad wee too young)

It sounds like you want fanficted lovemaking. The people of Westros just did not take enough baths to justify a scene like that.

GRRM can obviously write twisted romance very well so he should be able to give a realistic portrayal of what "twisted" sex looks like without resorting to stereotypical depictions and dodgey metaphors.

Maybe he can squeeze a diamond out of his ass from a chunk of coal, too. Youre asking for the stars from someone who relies on words such as "manhood", "fat pink mast", "mound", and in at least one instance, "thing."

I love a good rape scene actually

Oh right. Unless it's an Ironborn doing it.

[seanbean4lyfe]

It would get too confusing, what with an extra manhood in there. Eg, "He took his manhood in his hand."

The complaints over the cocksucking noises are overblown. If it was Daenerys or Cersei making that noise, at least half of you wouldnt be moaning over it. And those noises just mean he's doing it right; who wants a dry blowjob?

That whole scene gave their relationship depth and the sex added to it. What exactly did you find so "distastely" about it?

I'm wondering why Jon & Robb are so innocent, too. First of all, they're living with the biggest slut in the north. Who likes to brag. Secondly, it's medieval times; people were bawdy. It makes more sense that a boy growing up privileged would have plenty of chance to have sexual experiences around ye olde castle, like Theon & most probably Loras.

Ha, Bourne ;p Verboten, youre getting sloppy with my name. I prefer a good sense of humor in a man and that joke about the peach was a dud.

You just said what we implied, that Brienne fell for Renly because he was nice to her and charming/handsome enough. She's just an overgrown teen girl at heart. I hope she swears herself to Sansa at some point and they have castle pajama parties where they talk about their crushes. Just like on the "Sandor Cleagane" threads.

Hard and fast sex? Where? Other than his first time, Jon takes it slower afterwards. Theon doesnt just tell the captain's daughter to get on her knees, he sweetens her up and also makes her listen to his, "On the Iron Islands...", sexposition for about 3 pages, any more and she'd beg him to put it in her ear. Tyrion is constantly having drawn out sex scenes full of foreplay. So I dont see where your complaint is coming from unless you want a drawn out romantic lovemaking scenario of the kind you get in a 'romance' or 'bodice ripper' book. IMHO, Asha & Qarl's se scene was drawn out and romantic.

It sounds like you want fanficted lovemaking. The people of Westros just did not take enough baths to justify a scene like that.

Maybe he can squeeze a diamond out of his ass from a chunk of coal, too. Youre asking for the stars from someone who relies on words such as "manhood", "fat pink mast", "mound", and in at least one instance, "thing."

Oh right. Unless it's an Ironborn doing it.

:bowdown:

i am a fan of your blunt and sarcastic responses. haha

but who is the biggest slut in the north that Jon and Robb live with?

wait nvm, just realized it's Theon :P

hmm it might be because Theon is a few years older. and just slutty in nature...

god, he's the best

[Sivin]

Oh right. Unless it's an Ironborn doing it.

Hmmm... I read that line, and thunder crackled in the distance.

[CrypticWeirwood]

but who is the biggest slut in the north that Jon and Robb live with?

wait nvm, just realized it's Theon :P

hmm it might be because Theon is a few years older. and just slutty in nature...

I always thought the definition of a slut was anybody who got more sex than the speaker.

[lady crackhead]

Oh hai, I have something to say!

[Verboten]

I'm wondering why Jon & Robb are so innocent, too. First of all, they're living with the biggest slut in the north. Who likes to brag. Secondly, it's medieval times; people were bawdy. It makes more sense that a boy growing up privileged would have plenty of chance to have sexual experiences around ye olde castle, like Theon & most probably Loras.

Then Greyjoy, Slut Of The North!

[voodooqueen126]

It would get too confusing, what with an extra manhood in there. Eg, "He took his manhood in his hand."

The complaints over the cocksucking noises are overblown. If it was Daenerys or Cersei making that noise, at least half of you wouldnt be moaning over it. And those noises just mean he's doing it right; who wants a dry blowjob?

That whole scene gave their relationship depth and the sex added to it. What exactly did you find so "distastely" about it?

I'm wondering why Jon & Robb are so innocent, too. First of all, they're living with the biggest slut in the north. Who likes to brag. Secondly, it's medieval times; people were bawdy. It makes more sense that a boy growing up privileged would have plenty of chance to have sexual experiences around ye olde castle, like Theon & most probably Loras.

Ha, Bourne ;p Verboten, youre getting sloppy with my name. I prefer a good sense of humor in a man and that joke about the peach was a dud.

You just said what we implied, that Brienne fell for Renly because he was nice to her and charming/handsome enough. She's just an overgrown teen girl at heart. I hope she swears herself to Sansa at some point and they have castle pajama parties where they talk about their crushes. Just like on the "Sandor Cleagane" threads.

Hard and fast sex? Where? Other than his first time, Jon takes it slower afterwards. Theon doesnt just tell the captain's daughter to get on her knees, he sweetens her up and also makes her listen to his, "On the Iron Islands...", sexposition for about 3 pages, any more and she'd beg him to put it in her ear. Tyrion is constantly having drawn out sex scenes full of foreplay. So I dont see where your complaint is coming from unless you want a drawn out romantic lovemaking scenario of the kind you get in a 'romance' or 'bodice ripper' book. IMHO, Asha & Qarl's se scene was drawn out and romantic.

It sounds like you want fanficted lovemaking. The people of Westros just did not take enough baths to justify a scene like that.

Maybe he can squeeze a diamond out of his ass from a chunk of coal, too. Youre asking for the stars from someone who relies on words such as "manhood", "fat pink mast", "mound", and in at least one instance, "thing."

Oh right. Unless it's an Ironborn doing it.

I may disagree with you about SanSan, but OMG you are funny... all that extra manhood lol.

[lady crackhead]

Then Greyjoy, Slut Of The North!

THE SLUT IN THE NORTH !

[Woman of War]

Don't you think it is wonderfully provokative that the ugly disfigured dwarf gets more sex than all all those beautiful people around? And the quality is not worse compared to the pathetic or nonexistent sex life of most characters

I believe it's meant to irritate the reader

[brashcandy]

Don't you think it is wonderfully provokative that the ugly disfigured dwarf gets more sex than all all those beautiful people around? And the quality is not worse compared to the pathetic or nonexistent sex life of most characters

I believe it's meant to irritate the reader

:) Tyrion's sex life meant to irritate the reader.... hmmm, not sure, but i do wish we got to see more people doing it. And the reason why Tyrion gets so much sex is because he has the money to pay for it and he doesn't mind doing so. He has no ties to anyone like Jaime and no illusions about himself either.

[voodooqueen126]

Don't you think it is wonderfully provokative that the ugly disfigured dwarf gets more sex than all all those beautiful people around? And the quality is not worse compared to the pathetic or nonexistent sex life of most characters

I believe it's meant to irritate the reader

it certainly does that.

but being provocative is not really virtue, it's sort of like Chris Offili's painting of the Virgin Mary made of elephant dung and surrounded by vaginas. Far more important is to tell the truth or to set a moral example, rather than engage in author wish fulfilment...just as Chris Offili fulfilled his wish to offend people and be disgusting, but it was actually just vile.

Wish fulfilment

[Woman of War]

Chris Ofili's work is wonderfully ambiguus ,playing with so many stereotypes ( holy-dirt, rich-poor, .....) and BEAUTY, see the Holy virgin colours gold and blue chosen, vs. UGLINESS. yes it's a great example, especially with Martin's tendency to turn Tyrion even uglier with time, the antithesis to hero dreams. Maybe I am just a crazy artist myself but provokation is one of Martin's main themes to me. I believe art is meant to make people think, not to give the answer.

And maybe most male Nobles would have the money to buy whatever sex they wish and they wouln't mind if they couldn't get it for free via rape or forced marriage. In less important characters this will happen offscreen, Sandor e.g., won't have been whoring less in his spare time after a little killing, I guess. Only in Tyrion's case his inability to relate to women is a major storyline.

Fortunately there are some women who claim their right to be sexually active.