Wun Wun Greyjoy Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 ^ I sort of agree with the greyscale thing. Val did say that Shireen was dead, and Shireen is way to close to patchface who is also sort of dead.Jon also locked up a couple of dead guys before he himself "died". I also recall it being rather cold when Jon died, and that the others come when it is cold (or the other way around)... overall just lots of dead things on both sides of the wall along with the men of the nights watch being distracted doesn't bode well for the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNinja Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 I've notice a lot of people are convinced that the Wall will be destroyed or knocked over or whatever in order for the forces of ice (others etc) to fight the forces of fire (dragons etc). Does anyone think the wall won't fall?Horn will blow and giant Ice Dragon will come out of the wall breaking it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tini Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Most people in the story are acting without regards to consequences, and often there are totally unexpected consequences. If the Others could destroy the Wall, they would've done so already. No one else at the Wall would willingly destroy it, not the Night's Watch, not the Wildlings, not even the Queen's Men. Not Stannis.I'm not so sure about the parties in King's Landing. Cersei already demonstrated that she considers the Night's Watch some sort of archaic armed force that lacks loyal commanders (loyal to her, that is). We don't know what Aegon/Connington think of it. Most of Westeros seems to consider the Night's Watch and, by extension, the Wall, obsolete, a useless reminder of the past. They might finally decide to abolish the Night's Watch. Or decide to bring down the Wall by blowing a magic horn just to deprive the Watch of the reason for its existence. Most likely the Wall will fall as an unexpected consequence of actions not directed at the Wall itself, though. If the Wall's continued existence depends on the continued presence of the Night's Watch, the Night's Watch current state of disarray might hasten its fall. There are not enough black brothers, and many were lost during Lord Commander Mormont's ranging and the war against the Wildlings. Those who remain are untrained, old, or on rescue missions. The watch is weakening itself further by in-fighting, as Jon's assassination shows. The Wildlings may help, but they are not sworn men (or women) of the Night's Watch. That makes a difference, as the existence of the Black Gate at the Nightfort shows. That gate only opens for black brothers. It might be that the Wall's magic doesn't count the number of its defenders, only the number of sworn brothers in its vicinity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickon is FIERCE Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 ^ I sort of agree with the greyscale thing. Val did say that Shireen was dead, and Shireen is way to close to patchface who is also sort of dead.Jon also locked up a couple of dead guys before he himself "died". I also recall it being rather cold when Jon died, and that the others come when it is cold (or the other way around)... overall just lots of dead things on both sides of the wall along with the men of the nights watch being distracted doesn't bode well for the wall.Good points. I also think greyscale's going to become important; I see Connington's arrival as the source of the Westerosi version of The Plague (as a disease and an event). Never connected it to the Others, though... we shall see... But something's definitely up with that Patchface freak, I know, I know, oh, oh, oh...There is a lot of emphasis on the cold at the end, there... I just thought of it as the Winter progressing, but now I'm not so sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floria Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 I think it's Melisandre who will screw up things. Maester Aemon was mumbling some warning on the ship: "Ice preserves, fire consumes" I don't remember the exact words though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickon is FIERCE Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 It's gonna fall, the whole Jon stabbing looks like a clear way of making sure it doesn't happen on his watch.Excellent point. Hadn't occured to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickon is FIERCE Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 I think it's Melisandre who will screw up things. Maester Aemon was mumbling some warning on the ship: "Ice preserves, fire consumes" I don't remember the exact words though.I interpreted this as a reference to Daenaerys and her dragons and Jon or some other of the Starks. I foresee the dragons being vital in the apocalyptic showdown with the Others/wights- the "consuming" part of the prophesy (and I can't see anyone but Dany ever at the head of the dragon cavalry). But I think she dies in the battle (don't see her making it to the Irone Throne) and the Starks pick up the pieces- the "preserving" part: Jon on the throne, perhaps, Bran the Rebuilder, idk...not at all sure of the details, just a vague hunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taelorn Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 personally, i'm looking forward to all those ravens that get dispatched with "the wall has fallen", and the reactions of those who read the notes.I have a feeling that many of the southern lords, and just general southern society, have forgotten what lies beyond the wall and the true dangers that is there. Heck even some of the northern folks, believed that giants, and other such creatures were just tales to scare children.But I do think that we will have the opportunity to see if other lords sh!t gold, when they hear the news of what is coming their way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleDragon Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I have arrived now to a new idea on the destiny of the Wall! I insist that the Wall was built after a huge invase of the Others in Westeros, and there is no proof it was ever tried in reality. It is built and fortified only the bases of theories. and I think this is the main mistake of the whole concept! We are talking about creatures which tolerate very well the cold and ice, it is emphasised many time during the story. I think an important twist would be in the story if it was a mistake to build the Wall, because ice will fortifie these creatures. the Night Watch have done heroic efforts during the centuries to create the Wall and fortify it, defend it, kings and kingdoms have spent enormous amount of gold to build it and to keep it up, and at the moment when it will be tried in practice, they will realize that it fortifies their major enemies instead of stopping them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Plantagenet Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 ASOIAF opened with the threat of the Others and will surely hinge on it. Their threat becoming suddenly and massively apparent to the whole of Westeros (indeed the world) will surely include the Fall of the Wall. Be that physical or metaphorical. My question is…will this result in the warring factions of the 7 kingdoms uniting to save themselves? Or are they going to be saved by a Targaryen? Probably riding a dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayDubya Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 In the TV show, after they discover the Others, Sam looks up at the wall and says 'I hope the wall is tall enough'. Cue ominous music and a pan and scan up to show the sheer height of the Wall.And, IIRC, this is from the episode that GRRM wrote.If there was ever a stronger indication of the fate of the Wall, I don't know what it would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val the Wildling Princess Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I don't think the Wall will fall "physically" but it will lose the magic that protects it. Actually I'm of the opinion that Jon being betrayed and killed by his brothers by the Wall has caused the fall already at the end of ADWD. Apparently the Wall is protected by blood magic and possible human sacrifices, maybe the sacrifice of a black brother by his own brothers has the opposite effect :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shay Baratheon Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 the Others can just cross by sea, pulling of a Pirates of the Caribbean - the Black Pearl underwater march! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serie Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 @Val: :agree:and lets not forget that its not the Wall alone that protects the realms of men, but the people defending it as well. So when the NW betrays its vows would the Wall be as effecive as before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch-MaesterPhilip Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 @Val: :agree:and lets not forget that its not the Wall alone that protects the realms of men, but the people defending it as well. So when the NW betrays its vows would the Wall be as effecive as before?I don't think they were betraying their vows at all. I think they were defending them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val the Wildling Princess Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 @Val: :agree:and lets not forget that its not the Wall alone that protects the realms of men, but the people defending it as well. So when the NW betrays its vows would the Wall be as effecive as before?Of course, I think it is mentioned that the Wall will serve its purpose as long as the Watch stays true. I'm positive that the oath of the NW doesn't say: I'm the sword in the darkness I won't kill my Lord Commander :D but backstabbing your LC (that technically had not broken his vows yet) doesn't speak in their favor about "staying true" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Ou Pas Cap Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 There always must be a Val on the Wall. If she falls, the Wall will fall. It is known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val the Wildling Princess Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 There always must be a Val on the Wall. If she falls, the Wall will fall. It is known.It is known. I'm staying true :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mini-mitch Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 The wall is described as 'weeping' at several points through the series. I though this meant that the wall was melting or it was foreshadowing that the wall would melt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redriver Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 The Wall will fall.No point in having a huge magic wall in the story ,unless it falls.They will be selling chunks of it on ebay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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