Rereading Tyrion V (ASOS-ADWD)

[Lummel]

Yes. Dragons are more than a trump card to be played in the game of thrones - they change the game. We have two and a half examples of this in the series. Firstly the rise of Valyria, pushing and driving entire cultural groups to move, changing the economies and cultures of regions. Second the conquest of Westeros which broke apart the stable seven kingdom system which had been in place for a long time. The half is Daenerys and slavery, but we still have to see how that will play out.

[Ragnorak]

Nicely done, Butterbumps. Still going through the chapter and waiting for the coffee to kick in.

I noticed the ruins last chapter and we get a lot more of them here. Tyrion is passing through the destruction caused by dragons.

“There is no law above the Sorrows, not for a thousand years.”

“And no people, so far as I can see.” He’d glimpsed some ruins along the banks, piles of masonry overgrown by vines and moss and flowers, but no other signs of human habitation.

Tyrion saw ruins rising along the eastern bank: crooked walls and fallen towers, broken domes and rows of rotted wooden pillars, streets choked by mud and overgrown with purple moss. Another dead city, ten times as large as Ghoyan Drohe.

they join once stood Chroyane, the festival city, where the streets were made of water and the houses made of gold.

For me the overwhelming impression I got of dragons was this destruction-- though it wasn't on my first read. The streets in Chroyane made of water brings Venice to mind and all of its Renaissance associations. All destroyed.

Old Valyria brought slavery to Essos with dragons. Meereen used to thrive on trade but the destruction brought by dragons turned that to slavery and a slave trade instead of olives. Volantis tried martial power but the power vacuum left behind in the abscence of dragons turned the use of martial power into two sided destruction instead of one sides destruction so they turned to trade-- gold dragons.

Dany used dragons to subvert trade to gain the Unsullied. She's using dragons to free slaves. There's definitely an element of her turning things upside down but I think there's a more complicated inversion going on. Aside from providing dragons for a Westeros Dance 2.0 she's also playing out the Rise of Old Valyria 2.0 in Essos. I do very much like dragon double meaning and the way Lummel connected it to Cyvasse and the Game of Thrones though.

[Blisscraft]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath. . . Lear, I, i, 124.

Helpful advise, for certain.

Need to reread in light of BB's elegant summary.

[Ragnorak]

To add to Butterbumps Septa Lemore take I'd like to add hope.

Why not Volantis? Perhaps I’ll find her there. A man should cling to hope.

Lemore is an attractive woman who is not flinching in revulsion at the sight of Tyrion or under his lustful gaze. There are other men on this boat and she isn't spurning Tyrion's attention in favor of a taller man's as has been his experience or the dominant view of his past. Her flirting offers hope and a sort of affirmation of the possibility that some woman might find him attractive. Flirting is full of promise, potential, hope and possibilities. Sometimes wanting is better, even more important, than having. If Lemore sees him naked and is repulsed by the sight he loses this hope.

I'm not sure what to make of the Nights Watch stuff but a very nice catch, The chapter opens with Tyrion listening to wind and water and wondering if he dreamed-- all greenseer related. The full moon as an eye could evoke thoughts of Bloodraven.

In general there are a good many positive signs for Tyrion amidst his depression. He reacts well to getting tossed in the river and laughed at. He even joins in the laughter and has no thoughts of taking revenge. Griff, his pale eyed surrogate father, is dressing him in motley like Tywin used to threaten in order to demean him and again he reacts well. I suspect that they are Tyrion's clothes and Lemore is not a servant which is why he was assigned to help rather than to humiliate him. There's quite a harsh edge to the sarcastic exchanges (I'll miss you when the pirates slit your throat) but I don't sense any bitterness or hatred. They all seem to dish it out and take it in their own ways aside from the ever serious Griff.

Tyrion has no inferiority complex when he notes that Aegon has a better ear for languages, he happily admits he was wrong about the size of the river, and uses Aegon's lessons as a learning opportunity without any interference from his ego. In general this odd cast of characters does have a family feel to it that stands out compared to his own family. Griff denies him wine after he over indulges which is somewhat akin to Tywin's reaction to whores. Here there is no "sharp lesson" simply a reasonable externally imposed restraint. The sarcasm is even close to the Lannister family banter.

Some odds and ends that stood out:

His other duty was anything but foolish. Duck has his sword, I my quill and parchment. Griff had commanded him to set down all he knew of dragonlore.

Some battles are won with swords and spears, others with quills and ravens.

Tyrion hears nightingales. Two poems come to mind

The Nightingale

Samuel Taylor Coleridge

A melancholy bird! Oh! idle thought!

In nature there is nothing melancholy.

But some night-wandering man whose heart was pierced

With the remembrance of a grievous wrong,

Or slow distemper, or neglected love,

(And so, poor wretch! filled all things with himself,

And made all gentle sounds tell back the tale

Ode to a Nightingale

John Keats

This just seems rather draon-like

turtles whose ridged and patterned shells were covered with whorls of gold and jade and cream.

Tyrion seeing a cloud dragon reminded me of Sansa's cloud castle.

The clouds in the sky were aglow: pink and purple, maroon and gold, pearl and saffron. One looked like a dragon.

They look like two huge castles afloat in the morning sky. Sansa could see their walls of tumbled stone, their mighty keeps and barbicans. Wispy banners swirled from atop their towers and reached for the fast-fading stars. The sun was coming up behind them, and she watched them go from black to grey to a thousand shades of rose and gold and crimson. Soon the wind mushed them together, and there was only one castle where there had been two.

...as dangerous as...

A book can be as dangerous as a sword in the right hands

and sold you Ned Stark, I know. He will sell us just as quick. A coin is as dangerous as a sword in the wrong hands.

A harp can be as dangerous as a sword, in the right hands.

[Ulrik1312]

In general this odd cast of characters does have a family feel to it that stands out compared to his own family. Griff denies him wine after he over indulges which is somewhat akin to Tywin's reaction to whores. Here there is no "sharp lesson" simply a reasonable externally imposed restraint. The sarcasm is even close to the Lannister family banter.

In the past you mention Illyrio as a surrogate mother for Tyrion, or something like that, with his heavy breast and his positive enforcement.

With that in mind, the act of preventing Tyrion of drinking wine, make me wonder if this could be almost as weaning (I have to look for this word I dont know if it is the correct term) in a baby.

If I am not mistaken, it represents independece and breaking bonds with the mother (Illiryo), something we see here with Tyrion taking a more participative aproach to his time in the Shy Maid.

I know I dont make very clear statements, but I had to say it and once again tell you how much I enjoy this reread.

[Lyanna Stark]

Tyrion has no inferiority complex when he notes that Aegon has a better ear for languages, he happily admits he was wrong about the size of the river, and uses Aegon's lessons as a learning opportunity without any interference from his ego. In general this odd cast of characters does have a family feel to it that stands out compared to his own family. Griff denies him wine after he over indulges which is somewhat akin to Tywin's reaction to whores. Here there is no "sharp lesson" simply a reasonable externally imposed restraint. The sarcasm is even close to the Lannister family banter.

The family feel stood out to me as well, with Griff, even if Tyrion likened him to Tywin with the "pale eyes" actually isn't unreasonable. Then we have Ysilla smacking people with the spoon, everyone is more or less helping out and being cordial, and there's even Tyrion heading "back to school" as it were, with Aegon.

It's extremely sad in the light of Tyrion's own story of how his "mother loved him the best". Aegon may be fake and all, but is the life on the riverboat any more real or fake than what Tywin served Tyrion growing up? Tywin may be dead, but he looms large over Tyrion still.

Another thing I pondered was that Tyrion is however still, in his heart, a Lannister. He thinks the slave catchers don't concern him, since he is no escaped slave, but is he really so naive as he thinks they will only go after escaped slaves and not just anyone convenient? This still mirrors to some degree that Tyrion still sees himself as privileged and not just any man. He is safe, others may get caught.

People complain that Sansa was naive, but I think Tyrion shows a fair share of naivete here too when he thinks he is still untouchable, despite not having any dragons, golden or otherwise (as per young Griff). He only has himself.

[Lummel]

Well then Tyrion seems to be going through a regular seven ages of man (more mummery?), born to Illyrio and feed by him (Mewling and puking in his arms), then weaned as Ulrik pointed out, now as Lyanna says schooled (but not unwillingly and without a satchel)), soon comes adolescent boldness and sexual maturity in the succeeding chapters. Perhaps the idea is that Tyrion has to be reborn and grow up a second time to escape the influences of his first childhood?

That sense of man's progress through life points back to the Sphinx and clubfooted Oedipus too, what goes on four legs in the morning and all that...

Speaking of mummery, there's plenty of it in this chapter, playing at being Hugor Hill, cartwheeling and joking...

[Lyanna Stark]

Perhaps the idea is that Tyrion has to be reborn and grow up a second time to escape the influences of his first childhood?

I like this idea. Perhaps growing up outside of Tywin's shadow will make Tyrion into something different?

I argued in another thread that before, Tyrion has been Tywin writ small, but is it possible for Tyrion to transcend Tywin? Perhaps by growing up again, it will be possible to not just "fill his father's shoes".

[Ragnorak]

In the past you mention Illyrio as a surrogate mother for Tyrion, or something like that, with his heavy breast and his positive enforcement.

With that in mind, the act of preventing Tyrion of drinking wine, make me wonder if this could be almost as weaning (I have to look for this word I dont know if it is the correct term) in a baby.

If I am not mistaken, it represents independece and breaking bonds with the mother (Illiryo), something we see here with Tyrion taking a more participative aproach to his time in the Shy Maid.

I know I dont make very clear statements, but I had to say it and once again tell you how much I enjoy this reread.

Nice catch! Ties in well with his Hugor biography about being breast fed until he was seven. In a way he was thrown in a sack by his brother and sold to this riverfaring mummers troupe to wean him off his unhealthy Casterly Rock dependence.

The family feel stood out to me as well, with Griff, even if Tyrion likened him to Tywin with the "pale eyes" actually isn't unreasonable. Then we have Ysilla smacking people with the spoon, everyone is more or less helping out and being cordial, and there's even Tyrion heading "back to school" as it were, with Aegon.

<snip>

I'm glad I'm not alone with the family feel. There's a nice play on Lannisters taking things with the biscuit he grabs. The biscuit isn't the bearskin; this is a more healthy taking. It seems like the unwritten "family" rule that if you can get past the spoon you get to keep the biscuit. Duck has been here for years and still can't get by mom's spoon while Tyrion does it his first try-- another little tie in to the jealous brothers/breat feeding tale.

His tale is quite sad, though I think the sadness of that tale and the truth of his life that we know contribute to the family feel. You are correct about his naive view of slave catchers. The others clearly feel there are dangers but he has no personal sense of the threats. He is "less so" prepared for the pirates and other grumpkins haunting this river.

[Lummel]

...I argued in another thread that before, Tyrion has been Tywin writ small, but is it possible for Tyrion to transcend Tywin? Perhaps by growing up again, it will be possible to not just "fill his father's shoes".

It does seem a bit like a joke from GRRM.

The dwarf son is his father writ small. He needs to grow bigger to fill his father's shoes and in time, perhaps outgrow him. When do we grow? In childhood and adolescence. So he has a psychological second childhood and the growth will be to his personality (hopefully).

In terms of character change - Tyrion taking breakfast to the helmsman. A thoughtful, comradely gesture. He's not lording it here.

ETA

...Ties in well with his Hugor biography about being breast fed until he was seven. In a way he was thrown in a sack by his brother and sold to this riverfaring mummers troupe to wean him off his unhealthy Casterly Rock dependence...

glad you reminded me of this...er, Jacob's sons getting rid of Joseph, his father's favourite, out of jealously? I think it adds to the family flavours of the chapter

[the Scorpion Knight]

to the dragon part: he could also have meant dragon in sense of person. and unified leadership

[Lummel]

...For me the overwhelming impression I got of dragons was this destruction-- though it wasn't on my first read. The streets in Chroyane made of water brings Venice to mind and all of its Renaissance associations. All destroyed...

Yes. It adds to the story of the field of fire - this is what dragons do, this is their purpose and meaning.

But also it adds a nice air of melancholy, I found these chapters sailing down river very atmospheric. This is also appropriate for Tyrion, Connington, possibly the Halfmaester, Duck, (and who knows about Septa Lemore) these are all men whose original dreams and hopes did not come to fruitition, they are a ruined bunch or they have past lives in ruins that they are leaving behind.

Perhaps there is something of the same sort going on with the two Dornish people. It seems a bit odd for them to have moved from Dorne to the Rhoyne. Are they spies? In AFFC the children of the river are described as gossipy, who will they talk too and what will they say?

[Blisscraft]

It seems to me that eveyone on this little river boat is an orphan. The family they are in the midst of creating is a surrogate one.

About all of those critters - I'm going to leave the dragon alone for now. First, tigers and elephants as symbols of Volantis. Tigers are representatives of wrath and cruelty. They also represent the darkness of the soul and the base powers of instincts. Wild and untameable (think Siegrfried and Roy and that Vegas catastrophy and you'll know what I mean). However, in the service of righteousness, the tiger represents strength and valor. In this regard, with a dual representative nature, the tiger is very like a dragon. In China, there are five tigers of different colors. Each tiger represents a different cardinal direction, North, South, East, or West and the fifth tiger represents the Earth, the center. As such, the tigers represent spatial order in triumph over chaos.

The elephant is considered lucky and grand. It is associated with Mother Earth and is a god, Ganesh, in Hinduism, the Remover of Obstacles and bestower of wealth. As with the tiger and the dragon, there is a dark side to these giants. They are also destructive in their wrath. Because of their size, the elephant can wreak havoc with little effort (like a giant we know Wun Wun). Elephants allegedly "never forget." Which can have positive and negative aspects, as well.

As BB noted above, these creatures as the totems for the political parties in Volantis, have a specific connotation within the story. Tigers, as creatures of wrath, are part of a warlike political party. The elephants, are associated with the Volantene party of trade and commerce, and therefore is a symbol of wealth and prosperty. In the Volantene polical game, the elephants have been winning for awhile. It's amazing how commerce can ascend over conflict. Coorperation through commerce is prefered in Volantis to conflict and conquest. It's a game changer.

That is not to say that commerce is morally above conquest. Afterall, a portion of what Dany has disrupted with her conquest is the slave trade. There are many other problems with commerce as a "god" as well, but I'll leave that for you to ponder.

Turtles - What's the difference between a turtle and a tortoise? Habititat: water vs. the land. Turtles spend much of their time in the water, whereas tortoises spend much of their time on the land.

Both turtles and tortoises represent wisdom, age, antiquity, and constancy. The moral of fabled race between the tortoise and the hare is "slow, but sure, wins the race." However, one thing that mankind seems to agree upon about turtles is that they do not reflect spiritual ascendency. That is, in spite of its dome seeming to be the Heavens and its underside the Earth, or the cirlce within the square, the turtle is a manifestation of the material world. As a symbol of the material world, it can represent imprisonment, introversion and a withdrawl from the world.

Certainly, on the river, the turtles represent danger to Tyrion. He is afraid of them lurking below the surface. They are bonesnappers awaiting his entry into the water to snatch him in their beaks and break him into or drown him. Effectively, the river turtles have indeed imprisioned Tyrion on the boat. He will not bathe, even though I'm sure he needs a good scrubbing with a wire brush. However, once he is thrown in to the river, baptised, so to speak, the god appears. Not as a dove, but a gigantic bonesnapper.

In another thread, someone remarked about the appearance of this big bonesnapper as the reveal that Aegon is a "true king." I won't argue about that. Personally, I don't know whether Aegon is or not, but I will say that when I first read it, I thought the gods appearing at the birth of kings comment was refering to Tyrion, not Aegon, especially, as many of you have noted above, Tyrion has undergone a "rebirth" and now a "baptism."

Ragnorak - love the nightingales. I thought of the Romeo and Juliet lines in Act 3, v, perhaps their first, "lovers quarrel" whether it is the lark or the nightingale.

[Lummel]

It seems to me that eveyone on this little river boat is an orphan. The family they are in the midst of creating is a surrogate one.

About all of those critters - I'm going to leave the dragon alone for now. First, tigers and elephants as symbols of Volantis. Tigers are representatives of wrath and cruelty...

The elephant is considered lucky and grand. ..

As BB noted above, these creatures as the totems for the political parties in Volantis, have a specific connotation within the story. Tigers, as creatures of wrath, are part of a warlike political party. The elephants, are associated with the Volantene party of trade and commerce, and therefore is a symbol of wealth and prosperty. In the Volantene polical game, the elephants have been winning for awhile. It's amazing how commerce can ascend over conflict. Coorperation through commerce is prefered in Volantis to conflict and conquest. It's a game changer...

Thinking back to game theory the elephants represent a co-operative style of playing the game of thrones (everybody benefits) while the tigers stand for an aggressive approach (winner takes all).

I like the orphans point. Westeros is structured around families. People without families, like these orphans, are to my mind extra dangerous as freedom from family is also freedom from social restraints. Why should they play by the rules if they have no family they need to protect or take into consideration?

In another thread, someone remarked about the appearance of this big bonesnapper as the reveal that Aegon is a "true king." I won't argue about that. Personally, I don't know whether Aegon is or not, but I will say that when I first read it, I thought the gods appearing at the birth of kings comment was refering to Tyrion, not Aegon, especially, as many of you have noted above, Tyrion has undergone a "rebirth" and now a "baptism."...

In another another thread I've seen speculation that Tyrion is a Targaryen and due to become king perhaps the king of river roared to herald that? But then again my favourite suggestion in all these circumstances is that it is an in story myth. Some of the people in the boat believe it and they believe that Aegon is due to be rightful king and interpret the Turtle's roar as such. But that is no reason for the gentle reader to assume the hard shelled beast is speaking for the author...although I understand GRRM has a fondness for such creatures.

Oh, and he did mention that he put lots of legends into the books such as Bran the Builder. Bran the builder is supposed to have built the Wall, Winterfel, and Storms End. GRRM mentioned that he has become a legend so that people will look at a structure and say "wow, it must have been built by Bran the Builder" when it actually was not. This is GRRM's attemt on creating a world with myths and legends so if at some point you see, "They say it was built by Bran the Builder or Lann the Clever" realize that its part of the mythos.

from here.

[Blisscraft]

Yes, Lummel. Those orphans. They are certainly an "archetype" within "American" Literature. As a colony that rebelled and "killed" its parents, the theme is ever present from the beginning of our very short history. It comes as no suprise that this little river boat may attempt to upset the familial structures present within Westeros and the rest of GRRM's world.

Also, one of the qualities I love about GRRM's writing is the stories within the stories. It gives the series a depth and complexity that is sadly lacking in most genre works. Like Baelor the Blessed, too mentioned in this chapter, a wealth of stories attached to the "faithful" one. Most of his stories seem to involve destruction rather than building. :uhoh:

[Winter's Knight]

Because I see that Bliss mentions Ganesh: in Hinduism, before beginning any new task- a new job, moving, first day at college, opening a business-it is auspicious to make an offering to Ganesh, god of good beginnings.

[Blisscraft]

Because I see that Bliss mentions Ganesh: in Hinduism, before beginning any new task- a new job, moving, first day at college, opening a business-it is auspicious to make an offering to Ganesh, god of good beginnings.

Very nice, WK. :)

[Uncat]

It seems to me that eveyone on this little river boat is an orphan. The family they are in the midst of creating is a surrogate one.

About all of those critters - I'm going to leave the dragon alone for now. First, tigers and elephants as symbols of Volantis. Tigers are representatives of wrath and cruelty. They also represent the darkness of the soul and the base powers of instincts. Wild and untameable (think Siegrfried and Roy and that Vegas catastrophy and you'll know what I mean). However, in the service of righteousness, the tiger represents strength and valor. In this regard, with a dual representative nature, the tiger is very like a dragon. In China, there are five tigers of different colors. Each tiger represents a different cardinal direction, North, South, East, or West and the fifth tiger represents the Earth, the center. As such, the tigers represent spatial order in triumph over chaos.

The elephant is considered lucky and grand. It is associated with Mother Earth and is a god, Ganesh, in Hinduism, the Remover of Obstacles and bestower of wealth. As with the tiger and the dragon, there is a dark side to these giants. They are also destructive in their wrath. Because of their size, the elephant can wreak havoc with little effort (like a giant we know Wun Wun). Elephants allegedly "never forget." Which can have positive and negative aspects, as well.

As BB noted above, these creatures as the totems for the political parties in Volantis, have a specific connotation within the story. Tigers, as creatures of wrath, are part of a warlike political party. The elephants, are associated with the Volantene party of trade and commerce, and therefore is a symbol of wealth and prosperty. In the Volantene polical game, the elephants have been winning for awhile. It's amazing how commerce can ascend over conflict. Coorperation through commerce is prefered in Volantis to conflict and conquest. It's a game changer.

That is not to say that commerce is morally above conquest. Afterall, a portion of what Dany has disrupted with her conquest is the slave trade. There are many other problems with commerce as a "god" as well, but I'll leave that for you to ponder.

Turtles - What's the difference between a turtle and a tortoise? Habititat: water vs. the land. Turtles spend much of their time in the water, whereas tortoises spend much of their time on the land.

Both turtles and tortoises represent wisdom, age, antiquity, and constancy. The moral of fabled race between the tortoise and the hare is "slow, but sure, wins the race." However, one thing that mankind seems to agree upon about turtles is that they do not reflect spiritual ascendency. That is, in spite of its dome seeming to be the Heavens and its underside the Earth, or the cirlce within the square, the turtle is a manifestation of the material world. As a symbol of the material world, it can represent imprisonment, introversion and a withdrawl from the world.

Certainly, on the river, the turtles represent danger to Tyrion. He is afraid of them lurking below the surface. They are bonesnappers awaiting his entry into the water to snatch him in their beaks and break him into or drown him. Effectively, the river turtles have indeed imprisioned Tyrion on the boat. He will not bathe, even though I'm sure he needs a good scrubbing with a wire brush. However, once he is thrown in to the river, baptised, so to speak, the god appears. Not as a dove, but a gigantic bonesnapper.

In another thread, someone remarked about the appearance of this big bonesnapper as the reveal that Aegon is a "true king." I won't argue about that. Personally, I don't know whether Aegon is or not, but I will say that when I first read it, I thought the gods appearing at the birth of kings comment was refering to Tyrion, not Aegon, especially, as many of you have noted above, Tyrion has undergone a "rebirth" and now a "baptism."

Ragnorak - love the nightingales. I thought of the Romeo and Juliet lines in Act 3, v, perhaps their first, "lovers quarrel" whether it is the lark or the nightingale.

Blisscraft, love it! At the end of it all, all the giant heros with their dragons, trees and direwolfs will be broken, battled down by the efforts, maimed by the wounds of war on body and soul and the dwarf will be king.

I have said on the Arya thread, how i can't see any of the Stark kids returning to a normal life of ruling in a time of peace (as most readers expect them) Sansa, maybe, but only in the North.

But Tyrion King, what a great thought. And wouldn't his father be proud of him :D

[Uncat]

Double post, sorry!

[Lykos]

A very good synopsis, Butterbumps!

I just want to add to the random history the hundred galleys Braavos gavet to a lyseni exile. I think this is an important bit of information. (I have an unretrievable notion, that the Sealord responseable was removed soon after war was done. :dunno: I can´t findwhere I got this idea. :dunce: )

The golden scales of trade and iron sword of war of Pentost are interesting with regard to the Iron Bank. The silver scourge of justice intrigued me too. Silver is flighty as in the kenning which describes silver as pocketsnow (Taschenschnee).

I always listen to several chapters en bloc and have therefore trouble disentangling what happens in each chapter, but I never had so much trouble to make a post without getting ahead of the reread as this time.

For example Joseph (and "the technicolour dreamcoat", that comes up in one of the next chapters), I thought of this as well Lummel.

I think the nursing till he was seven also was a conection to Robert Arryn and shows a longing for motherly love, that Tyrion never experienced. Tyrion is now free to "caper as he pleases" and use his "gift to make people smile", but his father still comes to his mind and bitter memories and guilt take over. And the father of his new life doesn´t allow him to numb these feelings with wine. I really like this circle of life reexperienced idea.

Small interjection regarding Oedipus (clubfoot). This I wanted to mention some threads ago when Winter had brought it up and I just linked to Antigone. Oedipus feet were crippled because his father had them stitched together before he left him to die in the wilderness. (A shepherd took pitty and saved Oedipus. Maybe Snowwhite used this?)

When Jocasta, Oedipus´ wife and mother found out who he was she hanged herself using her robe(Oedipus Rex) and Oedipus blinded himself with two golden needles from Jocasta´s robe.

Could these needles represent Jaime and Cersei - love and hate?

Ragnorak and Blisscraft, I´ve thought of Sansa´s sky castle as well and love your nightingale poetry, I´ve also thought of Romeo and Juliet (the scene is played by the Duke and Dauphin in Huck Finn). I wanted to ask the Shakespeare experts about Tybalt, the antagonist of the play, since Martin used the name in Tybolt several times and Tybald is the name of the maester of the Dreadfort.

Elephants are a piece (Gaja) in Chaturanga (bgona post) and apart from Ganesh (with the elephant´s head) there is Airavata (the first elephant and Vahana of Indra). According to legend a white elephant appeared to Mahamaya the mother of Siddhartha to announce his birth. There is another legend that states the cause for Ashoka to spread Bhuddhism was an encounter with a mother grieving for her killed child at the Kalinga War.

She appealed to Ashoka: "Surely a king with such a great power to take so many lives will find it an easy mercy to give the life of just one. Please return my child to me."

This has nothing to do with this chapter, I know, but I think it might be essential to "Death bending it´s knee" and connects the elephant to it.

Another interesting elephant connection is the Olifant, the horn of Roland.

The wise and moderate Oliver and the fierce Archbishop Turpin are among the men Roland picks to join him. Pagans ambush them at Roncesvalles, according to plan; the Christians are overwhelmed by their sheer numbers. Seeing how badly outnumbered they are, Oliver asks Roland to blow on his olifant, his horn made out of an elephant tusk, to call for help from the main body of the Frankish army. Roland proudly refuses to do so, claiming that they need no help, that the rear guard can easily take on the pagan hordes.

While the Franks fight magnificently, there's no way they can continue to hold off against the Saracens, and the battle begins to turn clearly against them. Almost all his men are dead and Roland knows that it's now too late for Charlemagne and his troops to save them, but he blows his olifant anyway, so that the emperor can see what happened to his men and avenge them. Roland blows so hard that his temples burst. He dies a glorious martyr's death, and saints take his soul straight to Paradise.

According to the german wiki elephants are seen as wise and moderate as well, though they also are said to have a good longterm memory and tend to vengefulness because of this.

Roland dying when he blows the horn reminded me of the dragon horn in Victarion´s possession. A Tyrion and Victarion connection has been foreshadowed in Chapter 32 Tyrion Storm.

There were children climbing the towering wooden structures, swarming up like monkeys in roughspun to perch on the throwing arms and hoot at each other.

"Remind me to tell Ser Addam to post some gold cloaks here," Tyrion told Bronn as they rode between two of the trebuchets. "Some fool boy's like to fall off and break his back." There was a shout from above, and a clod of manure exploded on the ground a foot in front of them.

Tyrion's mare reared and almost threw him. "On second thoughts," he said when he had the horse in hand, "let the poxy brats splatter on the cobbles like overripe melons."

The Iron Suitor Dance.

Even the monkeys were amused. They chattered overhead, and one flung down a handful of his own shit to spatter on the boards.

Another foreshadowing of this might be the Oakenshield reference, Fire Eater mentioned, The Reaver in Feast is set on Oakenshield. Though I like Tyrion in the barrel better as a Diogenes reference. The most famous cynic.

ETA: Ragnorak, I also like how you describe the feeling of the ruins, I was reminded of Moat Cailin for some reason.