Jon Snow and ''Waking the Dragon'' ''Dragon's Temper''

[TMAG887]

Jon grasped the spear that bore Garth Greyfeather's head and wrenched it violently from the ground. "Pull down the the other two," he commanded, and four of the crows hurried to obey . . . To the men struggling with the spears

Jon managed to wrench one spear from the ground while the other crows even at two men to a spear have trouble pulling them out.

When Jon managed to escape from the wildling party, and he vaulted onto the mare's bare back with a sword in hand, and later thinks How did I ever mount her before, without saddle or stirrups, and a sword in one hand?

Thanks. The escape from the wildings stood out to me as well.

[Jasta11]

There are also several instances in Dance when his temper flares (mainly when talking to the morons who advise him and Axell Florent). The man definitely has limited patience, but it seems to me more of a character trait than any Targaryan legacy.

As for his feats of strenght, I would say it's just adrenaline. Jon is one of the few POV characters that regularily gets in fights. I very much doubt it's superstrenght of any sort, a man can do prodigious things when adrenaline comes up. I've read a story about a guy (amateur boxer, but still) who punched through inches-thick ice to save his son. His hands were ruined for life afterwads, but his son was saved. Yet the man was no Hulk, it's just that when in duress adrenaline makes you forget your limits and give your all.

[Northbound]

Perhaps there is something to the "Awake the Dragon" idea, I hope not though. As much as I love Jon, I don't want him to become too much of a powerful person. Ego/Power could lead to his ruin. Afterall, he has/had power, dude's got a massive wolf, he may end up with a dragon(s). When is too much power, enough for him to become corrupted? I think, getting super human strength; is too much for him.

[Ghost's Shadow]

Who survives four days in an ice cell?

[TheonGreyjoy]

Who survives four days in an ice cell?

One with Snow as last name

[Budj]

A lot of characters get mad, but Jon is the only one we see doing ridiculously awesome stuff. If there is a point to it (which I think there is) we will find out.

[Winterfellian]

Who survives four days in an ice cell?

Karstark survived more

[daario's man]

How strong are Direwolves in comparison to other animals in Westeros? Perhaps all of Ned Stark's children (and nephew) are able to access unusual reserves of strength when angry because of the "gift" of the Direwolves and latent warging abilities?

Yeah, remember how Sansa destroyed that rag doll.

[Lord Martin]

^ Just what I was going to say. I had a thread on here eons ago about Jon's parallels to Norse, Greek, Celtic, etc. mythology and I brought up the berserker parallel.

I agree that some of it is at least down to adrenaline, but the moments also come when he's emotionally volatile or distressed or enraged, which is another hint at a berserker parallel. If lifting a guy by the throat one-handed isn't "waking the dragon," in the sense that Viserys obviously meant it, I don't know what is.

Always proud of getting a response from AM.

I'd like to find that thread if its not archived. Was that the same one with Jon being the "Corn King," i.e the King who is sacrificed when the crops fail... sort of like the Prince of Pentos.

I wonder what other mythologies Jon Snow invokes?

[RhaenysBee]

Well since Jon is Azor Ahai reborn AND the Prince that was promised AND the rightful heir of the Iron Throne AND the Chosen one to defeat the Great Other AND the Chosen one to bring balance to the force Westeros and bring down the Wall so the wildlings can live happily ever after as great pals of the southerners AND he is even the magical Dragon Prince and the beautiful Wolf Maid's son...

... it's sort of the least that he tends to have super powers.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Always proud of getting a response from AM.

I'd like to find that thread if its not archived. Was that the same one with Jon being the "Corn King," i.e the King who is sacrificed when the crops fail... sort of like the Prince of Pentos.

I wonder what other mythologies Jon Snow invokes?

:)

[Isildur's Mane]

I'd like to change my opinion and say that I think that I think his rage moments are because of "waking the dragon" and not because of being a warg.

[Morienthar]

http://i.imgur.com/38GA7rR.jpg

[Illusion]

_{Superhuman feats of strength, while contributable to unusually high surges of Adrenaline, are typically rare 'once in a lifetime' episodes occurring under extreme circumstances. While anger seems to be the common denominator all of Jons displays of abnormal strength, I think there is more to this than just adrenaline. If R+L=J, perhaps Jons is a throwback to the Old Valyrian who first tamed Dragons and also the First Men who drove back the Others and built the wall. All very impressive feats that the blood of the Andals couldn't match. I also believe there is something special about Ghost with his silence and his red eyes. Add this to Jon being a powerful warg and imo, Jon is much more than meets the eye. Unless he's dead of course. :lol:}

[The Lady Lannister]

This is a very interesting theory. In the Mystery Knight the storyline of Egg assumes that true dragons are born by deeds instead of just being a Targ.

Daemon the Second Blackfyre dreams of Dunk becoming the Kingsguard and a dragon being born at Whitewalls, which Daemon thinks is himself. Instead Egg behaves in a true Targaryen fashion with Lord Butterwell and Lord Frey trembling for their lives in front of a 10-year-old lonely no-chance-of-ever-to-be king.

Lord Bloodraven later confirms this.

So perhaps, yes, maybe for Jon to become a Targ, he needs to discover / accept and control his true nature. (same as Dany really)

[C0bR]

Isn't waking a dragon just Viserys' BS? I doubt Jon's "berserk episodes" have any connections to Valyrian blood. Maybe he is just using some mushrooms offscreen.

[Pikachu101]

So now Jon's Superman?

Can we please for once have a realistic Jon thread, where fans don't turn him into a demigod <_<

1. Having a short temper just shows Jon has a short temper; Brandon, Robert, Robb, Arya, Cersei, Joffrey, Aegon etc. all have quick tempers and no they haven't woken their dragon they're human beings.

2. Have we actually see superhuman strength or are fans deciding Jon's a demigod?

3. Why do I have a funny feeling I won't get a realistic answer?

Well since Jon is Azor Ahai reborn AND the Prince that was promised AND the rightful heir of the Iron Throne AND the Chosen one to defeat the Great Other AND the Chosen one to bring balance to the force Westeros and bring down the Wall so the wildlings can live happily ever after as great pals of the southerners AND he is even the magical Dragon Prince and the beautiful Wolf Maid's son...

... it's sort of the least that he tends to have super powers.

Oh god no :stillsick:

[The Lady Lannister]

So now Jon's Superman?

Can we please for once have a realistic Jon thread, where fans don't turn him into a demigod <_<

1. Having a short temper just shows Jon has a short temper; Brandon, Robert, Robb, Arya, Cersei, Joffrey, Aegon etc. all have quick tempers and no they haven't woken their dragon they're human beings.

2. Have we actually see superhuman strength or are fans deciding Jon's a demigod?

3. Why do I have a funny feeling I won't get a realistic answer?

Oh god no :stillsick:

I personally do not think he is superhuman, just that the old saying about the flipping coin and the Targs is perhaps true about him, too.

[Rahgh Neqaj]

_{[...]All very impressive feats that the blood of the Andals couldn't match.[...]}

And yet the Andals were able to kill the remaining CotF (except on the isle of faces and north of the wall; assuming that the green men on the isle of faces are proper CotF) and conquer all of 6 out of 7 kingdoms. The legendary Andal King Artys Arryn reportedly rode a giant falcon. I have a feeling that the Andals are no less outstanding than the First of Men or the Valyrians, they're just less mystified by singers and storytellers who spent thousands of years polishing the First of Men tales and suffer the "everyone has some Andal blood" and "everyone's shit stinks the same if you think about humans not heros" effect.

Jon's bouts of strength I would primarily ascribe to adrenaline, unpreparedness of the opponent and luck with, maybe, a small helping of warg transfer of strength, reflexes or both. The spear: He was angry and determined, that certainly helped. But little differences in the ground can make one spear easy to pull out and another fiendishly difficult. The spear pulled by Jon might just have been the easiest one to pull. Some people are lucky, I always get the trickiest one. ;-) The horse: he's spent years getting on & off horses, he's a reasonably good rider and his warg abilities might have helped to control the horse. Remember that his mother was "half a horse herself" according to the lovely Roose (and some people ascribe that to a latent warg ability in her). Ser Alliser Thorne: I can't remember anything about him being large, small, heavy, light, ... He might just have been ill prepared for Jon gripping & lifting him. Something like being caught in a motion. I don't necessarily read the passage about that quarrel in the sense that Jon continued to lift him for an extended amount of time, could just as well have been something more like a judo throw. Also, remember that GRRM has admitted to have given Tyrion a bit too much fighting skills in the books. Might have happened in this instance as well.

[Pikachu101]

I personally do not think he is superhuman, just that the old saying about the flipping coin and the Targs is perhaps true about him, too.

I think that only works with incest Targs because they could either grow up to be mentally unstable due to the inbreeding or be a normal human being.

Anyway Jon's more of a Stark than a Targaryen, so it doesn't really matter