Oberyn Martell Cast

[daeneryslover]

No, wasn't about you. I was taking a jab at all the people who'd called Pedro's casting a travesty, frequently insinuating racial issues in the process. Hop over to the site I mentioned and witness the insanity first-hand. The way things are going, Martin himself is inches from being labeled racist as well.

The world according to uberfans... what a sad place that would be.

Well some people like to just argue and "troll" others. This is the internet after all. I'm not too familiar with the messages on WiC, but I read their articles daily and their messages by their readers always have some unnecessary venom in them.

By the way I consider myself an uberfan but I realize that each reader has their own imaginative view on the characters...

Can't speak for others, but I never saw you as the race patrol. In fact, I agreed with you on a lot of points, and I still think your appearance is fairly close to how I imagined Oberyn myself.

The race patrol to me were the people who swoop in and just say "TOO WHITE!!", or the others who seemed to take it as an act of racism on the part of D+D.

This show is an adaptation of novels, and as with any novel character we all have our own imaginings of them. The people who seem to think their vision of the character is more accurate than another person's are the people I see as acting as race police. You haven't done that at all.

Phew! Yeah I don't want anyone to think I'm racist :)

Some people can be too forceful on others :(

[Andrés Garcia]

People forget what Antonio Banderas looked like when he was young. This is pretty much exactly how I pictured The Red Viper, except with a widow's peak:

http://celebwallpape...anderas-156.jpg

[daeneryslover]

People forget what Antonio Banderas looked like when he was young. This is pretty much exactly how I pictured The Red Viper, except with a widow's peak:

http://celebwallpape...anderas-156.jpg

What a stud...

Anyways let's be honest HW makeup can do anything. Pedro will nail it!

[Kim87]

Please research the definition of "Olive Skin". It is a spectrum and yes it does not have to mean dark skinned but dark skin is part of the spectrum. My father is much darker than I am (see Avatar) and he has a blond hair/blue eyed uncle. Plus if i marry a natural blonde/blue eyed girl it's very possible that I have children that are blue-eyed/blonde although yes it is unlikely but possible.

Yes the topic of olive skin has come up several times before. I have heard the arguments before. But that is irrelevant now; Martin has now publically stated that Spanish fit his image of salty dornishmen. This is not really Indian… But hey there is always cosplay.

[daeneryslover]

Yes the topic of olive skin has come up several times before. I have heard the arguments before. But that is irrelevant now; Martin has now publically stated that Spanish fit his image of salty dornishmen. This is not really Indian… But hey there is always cosplay.

Buddy look at my pic. Now look at the picture GRRM referred to. Now look at me. Do it 3 more times. Do you get it yet or no?

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://hollywoodnose.com/images/net_worth7/hrithik-roshan-wealth/hrithik-roshan.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.hindustantimes.com/Entertainment/Celebrity/Hrithik-Roshan/I-introlist.aspx&h=698&w=930&sz=464&tbnid=VW5YZ6V73gR3dM:&tbnh=86&tbnw=115&zoom=1&usg=__-rdpj117bGH6B277U74h6qNxPQk=&docid=06l7DymiWX_ZeM&sa=X&ei=7-3VUe-6AeP9igK7zYGwDg&ved=0CJcBEP4dMBE

An Indian actor named Hrithik Roshan.

Please try again and this time make a better point thank you!

[Jamie Lannister]

He looks alright to me. Yeah sure, he's not the guy I had in mind when reading, but eh. He must be doing something right to have impressed that many people.

[Gramsci]

Yes the topic of olive skin has come up several times before. I have heard the arguments before. But that is irrelevant now; Martin has now publically stated that Spanish fit his image of salty dornishmen. This is not really Indian… But hey there is always cosplay.

Not all Indians look the same. Many people in Northern India could easily be confused as a Mediterranean, while many from Southern India could be dropped into Somalia and most would not even bother with a second glance.

Just because the actor selected is Indian doesn't mean Sunspear suddenly becomes New Delhi

[Kim87]

Buddy look at my pic. Now look at the picture GRRM referred to. Now look at me. Do it 3 more times. Do you get it yet or no?

http://www.google.co...ed=0CJcBEP4dMBE

An Indian actor named Hrithik Roshan.

Please try again and this time make a better point thank you!

I have no real desire to make a point, if you want to entertain the notion that you are the perfect example for Oberyn, do so. If it makes you happy go for it, though it is a bit odd how you keep repeating it over and over. The same if you want to entertain the notion that Indians on average could pass for Spaniards.

[daeneryslover]

I have no real desire to make a point, if you want to entertain the notion that you are the perfect example for Oberyn, do so. If it makes you happy go for it, though it is a bit odd how you keep repeating it over and over. The same if you want to entertain the notion that Indians on average could pass for Spaniards.

You make me shake my head hahahaha

[Tony Soprano]

GRRM has finally shared his thoughts about Pascal being cast as Oberyn, and he has pretty high hopes. He also states that he imagined the Dornish to be more Mediterannean looking rather than African.

[Dacey]

Seems Martin chimed in on the casting. Report is over on winteriscoming.net.

Yum. Nothing sweeter than watching the Race Patrol eating their words. :drool:

Wow, what an insanely horrible thing to say about people of color who were hoping to see somebody who looked like themselves portrayed as a hero for once.

[Gramsci]

Wow, what an insanely horrible thing to say about people of color who were hoping to see somebody who looked like themselves portrayed as a hero for once.

This is a quote from winteriscoming.net:

YES AND YES WE SPANISH, ITALIANS, GREEKS ARE NOT MOORS. GRRM, the creator of all this, said it quite clearly. Salty Dornish are based in us, and we have not brown skin. In fact, I’m from Spain, with white skin and brown to light hair, same as most of my friends. Most of us Mediterranian guys don’t look like moors. So all of you that wanted a stupid, and most of all, NOT FAITHFUL to the books Dorne crowded with black and Indians guys, get a life and leave us in peace.

Those are the kind of people he was referring to as "race patrol." In this case the guy was going in the opposite direction of what was stated. Not people who politely came on and said, "I am of a dark complexion and was excited to see someone of a color similar to mine cast as Oberyn."

And what do you mean "were hoping to see somebody who looked like themselves portrayed as a hero for once." Like there aren't plenty of films and tv shows where a person of color is a hero?

By all means google Oberyn casting and be amazed at the amount of people who accused D+D of out and out racism in casting Pascal as Oberyn.

[Dacey]

And what do you mean "were hoping to see somebody who looked like themselves portrayed as a hero for once." Like there aren't plenty of films and tv shows where a person of color is a hero?

Oh boy, I can only assume you're drastically unfamiliar with the demographics of major characters in Hollywood films and other popular media. Go spend some time researching this issue and get back to me.

By all means google Oberyn casting and be amazed at the amount of people who accused D+D of out and out racism in casting Pascal as Oberyn.

Why would I find it amazing that people are accusing casting directors who cast a white Chilean man in the role of a character who was widely interpreted as a person of color of being racist? If Oberyn was definitively a man of color, it would certainly be racist. These are people who interpreted Oberyn as a person of color. Under that interpretation, it would be an incredibly racist thing to do. It is neither unreasonable nor surprising that people are saying that.

[Broken Fox]

So crying racism over the wrongful interpretation of a character's race = Acceptable?

GRRM cleared the air on this. There's really nothing more to discuss.

[Gramsci]

Oh boy, I can only assume you're drastically unfamiliar with the demographics of major characters in Hollywood films and other popular media. Go spend some time researching this issue and get back to me.

Why would I find it amazing that people are accusing casting directors who cast a white Chilean man in the role of a character who was widely interpreted as a person of color of being racist? If Oberyn was definitively a man of color, it would certainly be racist. These are people who interpreted Oberyn as a person of color. Under that interpretation, it would be an incredibly racist thing to do. It is neither unreasonable nor surprising that people are saying that.

My best advice for you, if this is really such a touchy topic? Go watch Zorro or Aladdin, and maybe that will make you feel better. In the mood for something "darker"? Maybe Lethal Weapon or Green Mile. Not good enough? How about Bruce Almighty? I hear they cast a black man as God

This is getting crazy. If you honestly think believing D+D was racist for casting Pedro Pascal is sane, I am speechless. It isn't like GRRM said the casting was fair to the books or anything.

[Which Tyler]

I don't know ANYONE who ever once imagined Antonio Banderas as Oberyn, while reading the novels.

Have you read any of the varius "dream casting" lists over the last few years? He's mentioned plenty of times; not far off (my impression) as often as Oded / Fehr, despite being far less realistic an option

[Alia of the knife]

When I first read the books, I actually did get Spain, but I also thought a Spain/French hybrid as the French can be "dark" as well, but still run the gambit, as well as Martell actually being a French surname.

Martin has said that he is a "low magic" fantasy writer, and references history quite a bit. He referenced HEAVILY a book on the times of the fourteenth century, but for the life of me, I can't remember the name of the book.

The Plantaganets, and later English Monarchs married both France and Spain to keep the peace, keep alliance, and to keep the crown bloodlines within the family. Finding out that the Dornish were a Spanish/ Mediterranean/ Welsh hybrid was news, but it also made sense as well given some of the names, (Gruffydd ap Llywelen), and the fact that they intermarried with the Welsh Princes to have an English hold in the land.

The Normans, and later Angevin/Plantaganets couldn't depend upon war all the time for alliances.

A Llywelyn Fawr, (called the Great), rested enough concessions from the Magna Carta, he became the first official Prince of Wales.

As long as D&D remain consistent with the Authors intent, (and there is much diversity in his series), and keep consistent with the characters, then no one should be offended.

To reverse this, would it be fair to Martins equally LARGE Hispanic population both in the Americas, and without to be dismissed to accommodate another demographic when the Author is on the record about who/what the characters are supposed to be, and they know that?

In terms of casting, I kind of expected a Vincent Perez type from his "Queen Margot" days.

http://www.bing.com/...selectedIndex=8

[daeneryslover]

When I first read the books, I actually did get Spain, but I also thought a Spain/French hybrid as the French can be "dark" as well, but still run the gambit.

Martin has said that he is a "low magic" fantasy writer, and references history quite a bit. He referenced HEAVILY a book on the times of the fourteenth century, but for the life of me, I can't remember the name of the book.

The Plantaganets, and later English Monarchs married both France and Spain to keep the peace, keep alliance, and to keep the crown bloodlines within the family. Finding out that the Dornish were a Spanish/ even Welsh hybrid was news, but it also made sense as well given some of the names, (Gruffydd ap Llywelen), and the fact that they intermarried with the Welsh Princes to have an English hold in the land.

The Normans, and later Angevin/Plantaganets couldn't depend upon war all the time for alliances.

A Llywelyn Fawr, (called the Great), rested enough concessions from the Magna Carta, he became the first official Prince of Wales.

As long as D&D remain consistent with the Authors intent, (and there is much diversity in his series), and keep consistent with the characters, then no one should be offended.

To reverse this, would it be fair to Martins equally LARGE Hispanic population both in the Americas, and without to be dismissed to accommodate another demographic when the Author is on the record about who/what the characters are supposed to be, and they know that?

In terms of casting, I kind of expected a Vincent Perez type from his "Queen Margot" days.

http://www.bing.com/...selectedIndex=8

I'm glad you edited out what you implied about the sexual openness of Middle Easter and Indian people. It's an utterly ridiculous and naive statement.

1. Middle Eastern: Many of these people are Muslim. Are you aware of what Islam says about sex between a married couple? It's quite sexually open. Yes this area is behind the times but the "Sexual Revolution" is a recent thing. Give it 30-40 years and you'll see.

Btw do you realize that in the areas and time periods that you referenced in your post sexuality was not open like it is today?

To be honest the part of your post about Middle Easterns/Indians (that you have edited out) is based on a perception that you have gained from watching/reading about these people instead of interacting with them. I on the other hand have done proper research. Plus guess what? I am one of them!

2. Indian: Karma Sutra.

Another contributor that makes me shake my head...Oh yeah Vincent Perez. Who does he look like. Hmm he certainly looks like me!

[I know I know]

Why would I find it amazing that people are accusing casting directors who cast a white Chilean man in the role of a character who was widely interpreted as a person of color of being racist? If Oberyn was definitively a man of color, it would certainly be racist. These are people who interpreted Oberyn as a person of color. Under that interpretation, it would be an incredibly racist thing to do. It is neither unreasonable nor surprising that people are saying that.

This is why the word "racism" has lost much of its moral bite.

Imagine if people started declaring political opponents attracted to asians to be "pedophiles", because asians are short? The mis-use of the word would slowly leech meaning and moral force from it.

Obviously, D&D aim to cast true to GRRM. Accusing them of "racism" for this is not reasonable.

[The Unborn]

I'm glad you edited out what you implied about the sexual openness of Middle Easter and Indian people. It's an utterly ridiculous and naive statement.

1. Middle Eastern: Many of these people are Muslim. Are you aware of what Islam says about sex between a married couple? It's quite sexually open. Yes this area is behind the times but the "Sexual Revolution" is a recent thing. Give it 30-40 years and you'll see.

Btw do you realize that in the areas and time periods that you referenced in your post sexuality was not open like it is today?

To be honest the part of your post about Middle Easterns/Indians (that you have edited out) is based on a perception that you have gained from watching/reading about these people instead of interacting with them. I on the other hand have done proper research. Plus guess what? I am one of them!

2. Indian: Karma Sutra.

Another contributor that makes me shake my head...Oh yeah Vincent Perez. Who does he look like. Hmm he certainly looks like me!

Ok now saying over and over again how you "look SO MUCH like Oberyn" is getting creepy as hell and after reading so many pages I'm confused... what is exactly your point ?