LIttlefinger: book vs show

[Nilan8888]

In my opinion sadistic perverts are not the only evil people in this world. He's not showing any signs insanity which makes him even more evil in my opinion. Come on, he's pushing his newly-wed bride through the moon door as soon as he's become the Lord Protector of the Vale. He basically started the War of Five Kings that cost the lives of thousands of people both soldiers and the smallfolk. The bottom line is he wants to gain power at any cost. IMHO it can be defined as evilness.

Absolutely.

Joffrey, Ramsey and Littlefinger are EVIL, no doubts about it. They are rational people with personality disorders. They are insane, but high-functioning to the point that it doesn't matter.

Gregor is a mad dog. He's got a severe chemical imbalance in his head, and completely irrational. I actually don't quite consider him as 'bad' as the others, although he needed to be put down more urgently than even Geoffrey.

[Pinkie Baelish]

No more pimp scenes! Whatever will they do to introduce random naked prostitutes into the story. Maybe he'll take some with him.

Calling it now: Two lesbian prostitutes teleport and somehow, using cunnilingus and body contortions, act out the flashbacks that show LF's treachery, while Lysa is giving her monologue that details his plans from the beginning.

[Le Cygne]

I can totally picture that, and they would go there in a heartbeat if they didn't have their rule: no flashbacks.

Shae replaced the Hound for Sansa on the show. And Littlefinger isn't Littlefinger without a naked prostitute in the frame. So Shae is coming with Sansa to the Eyrie. Problem solved.

[Pinkie Baelish]

I can totally picture that, and they would go there in a heartbeat if they didn't have their rule: no flashbacks.

Shae replaced the Hound for Sansa on the show. And Littlefinger isn't Littlefinger without a naked prostitute in the frame. So Shae is coming with Sansa to the Eyrie. Problem solved.

With the added bonus of sparing Tyrion the trouble of killing Shae so he remains our good guy.

See, "show apologists" can laugh at the show too :P

[Le Cygne]

With the added bonus of sparing Tyrion the trouble of killing Shae so he remains our good guy.

See, "show apologists" can laugh at the show too :P

Yes, I appreciate that. :)

[ServantOnIce]

In my opinion LF is more subtle in the books.

And yes he is evil. Its practically a given.

This. A.G. is doing a great job with Littlefinger, but as all characters have to be adapted for TV for the quality of the production, LF has to be adapted for folks who don't read books and folks who can't read subtle signs.

As I and a few others have mentioned, TV watchers don't have the time or the desire to re watch and study to catch the subtle signs of the books. Ben-Weiss aka D and D have to make sure the audience catches and understands how dangers LF, Varsy and Roose Bolton really are.

[PatrickStormborn]

It's obvious that Littlefinger is dangerous as soon as he betrays Ned, and later we realise the full extent of the threat he poses when it's revealed he basically orchestrated the entire war. We don't need endless monologues to show how dangerous he is.

And, in contrast, Varys has been shown to be less dangerous, when in fact he is far more dangerous than Littlefinger.

[Khal-a-bunga]

It's obvious to us that Littlefinger is a major player, but I don't think non-readers (for the most part) understand how much of what has happened comes down to his plotting. All of my friends who watch the show are non-readers, and though many of them 'like' the character, they've never even hinted that they think he might have a large part to play in all of this, in spite of how his character has been portrayed on the show. He's this mastermind villain who is hiding in plain sight, as it were, which should make the revelation that this entire war started as a result of his meddling just as effective as it was in the books, despite the fact that we've seen much more of his character and know more about his motivations. Littlefinger is only subtle in the books because he has no P.O.V. chapters. He's certainly more Shakespearean on the show (not equating the writing here), but I think that was a better choice than downplaying his character in order to make him less "obvious" (which is a critique that makes very little sense to me, in the first place). In any case, his character should be having his biggest season yet, and I'm excited to see him away from King's Landing and with a new set of characters.

And, in contrast, Varys has been shown to be less dangerous, when in fact he is far more dangerous than Littlefinger.

Prove it.

[Dragonstoned]

Happy that my label of 'show apologist' appears to have caught on, I love you all really.

On topic though, given that Varys and Olenna knew of Littlefinger's plan to take Sansa to the Vale with him, what happens when she disappears and is searched for? Will they not put two and two together and realise where she's gone, rather than Littlefinger leaving them with no idea which is the only thing that stops Sansa being found? Call me pessimistic but I sense a plot hole ahead.

[PatrickStormborn]

Prove it.

... Erm, was the end of ADwD not proof enough? He's literally hiding inside the Red Kep with potentially hundreds of child spies who could strike at any time. If he wanted to wipe out the Lannisters, he could have done so by now.

Varys has also been playing a much longer game than Littlefinger, and his motivations are less clear. It's possible that he's been planning and plotting for this war since he was first hired by Aerys.

And, as of yet, we have absolutely no idea what weaknesses he may have. We already know Littlefinger's, and he is in a much more vulnerable position than Varys.

Like seriously. Littlefinger vs Varys? Not even a competition.

[Colonel Green]

On topic though, given that Varys and Olenna knew of Littlefinger's plan to take Sansa to the Vale with him, what happens when she disappears and is searched for? Will they not put two and two together and realise where she's gone, rather than Littlefinger leaving them with no idea which is the only thing that stops Sansa being found? Call me pessimistic but I sense a plot hole ahead.

Olenna and Margaery would know where Sansa is in the books too, unless they're complete idiots. Varys knowing about Littlefinger's designs but not evidently guessing that he's behind the assassination may be a bit of a stretch.

The bigger plot hole (or, perhaps, a character being dumb) in the show's revised version of Sansa's escape is why Varys, being aware that Littlefinger is trying to get Sansa to come with him, doesn't just tell Sansa (or otherwise make known to her through other channels) that Littlefinger is the guy who sold out her father to the Lannisters. She'd never want to go with him if she knew that. Instead he's engineered a needlessly complicated Tyrell marriage pact that collapses and does nothing to stop her from considering Littlefinger as a potential ally in the future (or, even if he still wanted to do that, also still reveal Littlefinger's treachery; have Margaery do it, for that matter).

[Blue Rose Prince]

I understand that D&D needed to tone up the Littlefinger threat for a television audience to follow it, but IMO they went too far. The #1 question about Littlefinger that I’m asked by people who only watch the show is why someone that obviously evil and untrustworthy is still trusted with any power at all (to say nothing of perhaps recieving a late night visit from the little birds ala Kevan Lannister). The show is so busy ensuring that the audience knows LF is a backstabbing, scheming, social climbing pimp who lusts for Sansa that it is difficult to understand that LF’s power is in his subtlety. When he is gloating to Varys about the death of Ros it is hard to believe that he hides behind a harmless façade.

To me, the beauty of Littlefinger in the books was the slow, creeping realization that this guy is one of and most dangerous and twisted players in the game of thrones. I got that feeling in season one but from season two on all I’ve been getting from Littlefinger’s character scenes (i.e. the ones where he does not advance the main plot) is pure, obvious evil smacking me in the face.

Maybe Littlefinger is just one of those characters that is so complex that he cannot be converted from the page to the screen without controvesies like this thread.

[Janicia]

The show portrays both Littlefinger and Varys as more emotional than the books do. In the books, they are very rational actors, while LIttlefinger has a temper / volatility in the show and Varys is more of a softie and somebody who reacts to Lannister shenanigans in unguarded ways.

[Lannister Hamster]

I understand that D&D needed to tone up the Littlefinger threat for a television audience to follow it, but IMO they went too far. The #1 question about Littlefinger that I’m asked by people who only watch the show is why someone that obviously evil and untrustworthy is still trusted with any power at all (to say nothing of perhaps recieving a late night visit from the little birds ala Kevan Lannister). The show is so busy ensuring that the audience knows LF is a backstabbing, scheming, social climbing pimp who lusts for Sansa that it is difficult to understand that LF’s power is in his subtlety. When he is gloating to Varys about the death of Ros it is hard to believe that he hides behind a harmless façade.

To me, the beauty of Littlefinger in the books was the slow, creeping realization that this guy is one of and most dangerous and twisted players in the game of thrones. I got that feeling in season one but from season two on all I’ve been getting from Littlefinger’s character scenes (i.e. the ones where he does not advance the main plot) is pure, obvious evil smacking me in the face.

Maybe Littlefinger is just one of those characters that is so complex that he cannot be converted from the page to the screen without controvesies like this thread.

I think the characters in the tv show underestimate him.

If you consider all his plotting he is still just a minor lord who works for them as Master of Coin. He also proved himself totally loyal to the Lannisters after betraying Ned Stark and saved them from Stannis by creating a marriage pact between Joffrey and Margaery.

LF has no independent power so why worry about him when they have bigger problems?

[scotcat]

First of all let me say that I think A.G. does an excellent job. Do I prefer book Littlefinger? Yes, but only because he's more subtle menace.

The thing with the TV series is that the characters - all of them - have to be adapted for an audience that, at least in part, have no knowledge of the books prior to watching or simply have no desire to go and read the books (the TV series being sufficient). Hence, it's not as subtle. Things that work well as a slow burn in a series of novels wont necessarily translate well on screen.

[King of the Road]

Regardless of how complex show Littlefinger is, I don't think anyone can deny that he's mightily entertaining. For a TV show, who honestly doesn't love the hammed-up, obvious, Iago type villain, especially when they're portrayed as well as Aiden Gillen does it.

[DaveyJoe]

I agree that, even if the character is a bit dumbed down, I find Aiden's performance to be very entertaining, especially his scenes with Varys. I think I'm one of the few people who loved the scene he had threatening Ros in S2E2. I love how he want from concerned to menacing in a matter of seconds.

[DarkAndFullOfTurnips]

I agree that, even if the character is a bit dumbed down, I find Aiden's performance to be very entertaining, especially his scenes with Varys. I think I'm one of the few people who loved the scene he had threatening Ros in S2E2. I love how he want from concerned to menacing in a matter of seconds.

I think it was a great scene as well. Well acted by both parties as well.

[DaveyJoe]

Also, I can't help but crack up at how creepy this line delivery is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ez37fRLzZJk&feature=youtu.be&t=2m42s

[King of the Road]

I agree that, even if the character is a bit dumbed down, I find Aiden's performance to be very entertaining, especially his scenes with Varys. I think I'm one of the few people who loved the scene he had threatening Ros in S2E2. I love how he want from concerned to menacing in a matter of seconds.

I liked that scene as well. That was actually one of the less caricatured scenes and really made Littlefinger very threatening, acted terrifically by Aiden Gillen.