How will Jon and Dany end up together?

[Old-Growth]

I'm of the opinion that if a Jon and Daenerys relationship does occur, it will not be in a political context and it will not result in marriage. It might very well produce a child, but even there, it would not surprise me if Daenerys remained ignorant to the end that Jon is her nephew.

Everybody seems to be expecting such clean resolutions when this author's modus operandi is anything but.

What's clean about a dynastic marriage that will make one party, viz. Jon, regret his acquiescence to the same for the rest of his life? A melancholy man made more so by his circumstances. It will be a difficult relationship with Jon carrying on in part out of a sense of duty. Furthermore, he may not be the man she wants but the one she needs: the one in whom she can repose her trust. (Cue the Rolling Stones and "You can't always get what you want ......".)

And there is also the possibility that one may die in the new War for the Dawn (after there are children to be sure --- this war may go on rather a while.)

[Warden of the Northwest]

Nothing about his story, IMO, says that he would suddenly abandon everything he has been to that point to press his claim if he learns he's half Targ. I am of the mind that his Stark blood is more important.

This. It baffles me that anyone would think that Jon would have any interest in taking the Iron Throne just from learning about his parentage. We have spent so much time with Jon and been with him through so many incredibly important life events. I doubt that GRRM would take the reader on this journey with Jon where we learn who he is and what kind of character he has only for him to flip the script and do a complete personality 180 just because he finds out his dad isn't who he thought he was.

[PatrickStormborn]

Bright Blue Eyes makes some good points in another thread:

Sorry, but those are all weak.

1. Jon really doesn't care about incest. At all. And anyway, aunt/nephew wasn't really considered taboo in the medieval period.
2. LOL how are Val and Alys more self dependent than Dany? She whipped Kraznys' face into ruin (and then set fire to him with her dragon), she beat Drogon down in Daznak's Pit, etc. Dany may have servants, but so does Jon; if he doesn't like her for it, he's a hypocritical misogynist. (ETA: And what do you think Val, Ygritte et al. are foreshadowing, if not a relationship with Dany? Who else is a major enough character who fits? I've seen a case made for Arianne, but that's just wishful thinking(*).)
3. Is Daenerys truly anti-Stark? Or is she merely anti "the Usurper" (after all, she only ever speaks about Ned Stark). And after her empathising with Robert in Daznak's Pit when she sees Barsena with the boar, can we expect a change in perception from Daenerys?
4. Dany cares about her rights? That's why she stayed in Meereen? That's why she says "Justice... that's what kings are for", "A queen belongs not to herself, but to the realm", etc.?

And following his resurrection/survival, Jon is definitely going to become a darker character in-line with someone like Daario, so...

(*) Spoilers for The Winds of Winter:

First, Arianne is probably going to marry Aegon. But most importantly, her death has been heavily foreshadowed. In the second Arianne chapter (the first one read by GRRM), there's a part where she says to Elia "You could have died!" and "died" echoes three times, and the reporter said the way GRRM read it made it sound like ominous foreshadowing. Then there's the prophecy "And everywhere the dragons danced the people died", which may refer to Arianne if she does truly get involved in the dance. Then there's all the other clues - her choice not to read the books on how Dorne resisted the conquest, not reading the military/history books provided by Doran, etc.

[Twist]

They will first see each other on the battlefield, but I seriously doubt that they will marry

[Wouter]

I suppose Jon and Dany may meet while trying to coordinate actions against the Others, and also while discussing how to avoid mass starvation (especially in the north).

The vision in the House of the Undying points to some kind of connection, which at least from Dany's perspective should be "sweet". Doesn't have to mean they'll get married, though, but it does seem like she will be rather impressed.

[Lord Artos Llyn]

The vision in the House of the Undying points to some kind of connection, which at least from Dany's perspective should be "sweet". Doesn't have to mean they'll get married, though, but it does seem like she will be rather impressed.

This is my admittedly somewhat optimistic vote for what will happen. I don't truly see them killing each other but I doubt they'll end up as lovers in some fairytale ending either. Allies with a bit of distance between them as they acknowledge some shared destiny but ultimately follow their own paths.

[C0bR]

Sorry, but those are all weak.

1. Jon really doesn't care about incest. At all. And anyway, aunt/nephew wasn't really considered taboo in the medieval period.

LOL how are Val and Alys more self dependent than Dany? She whipped Kraznys' face into ruin (and then set fire to him with her dragon), she beat Drogon down in Daznak's Pit, etc. Dany may have servants, but so does Jon; if he doesn't like her for it, he's a hypocritical misogynist. (ETA: And what do you think Val, Ygritte et al. are foreshadowing, if not a relationship with Dany? Who else is a major enough character who fits? I've seen a case made for Arianne, but that's just wishful thinking(*).)

Is Daenerys truly anti-Stark? Or is she merely anti "the Usurper" (after all, she only ever speaks about Ned Stark). And after her empathising with Robert in Daznak's Pit when she sees Barsena with the boar, can we expect a change in perception from Daenerys?

Dany cares about her rights? That's why she stayed in Meereen? That's why she says "Justice... that's what kings are for", "A queen belongs not to herself, but to the realm", etc.?

1. The fact that he never thinks about incest does not change that he would presumably be repulsed by the idea. And yes, aunt/nephew;uncle/niece was considered taboo in most of the medieval societies.

2. Dany is entirely dependant on her dragons. Let's go through the phases of her life without an available dragon:

a) defensless child

B) sex slave

c) basically a hostage and puppet of her enemies in her own city

Without a dragon she is about as self dependent as Weasel.

3. Who knows? You can't be truly anti-Stark when you don't know any other Stark with an expection of Lyanna. I wouldn't put anything past her though.

4. Few retarded decisions and empty words ("Justice... that's what kings are for"? Oh, Dany, you discovered America! Maybe by the end of your bloody quest for what is yours you will fully discover what a ruler is for) are not going to overcome the fact that her whole storyarc is about taking back what is hers by her right.

:cool4:

[King Tyrion VIII]

Sorry, but those are all weak.

• Jon really doesn't care about incest. At all. And anyway, aunt/nephew wasn't really considered taboo in the medieval period.
• LOL how are Val and Alys more self dependent than Dany? She whipped Kraznys' face into ruin (and then set fire to him with her dragon), she beat Drogon down in Daznak's Pit, etc. Dany may have servants, but so does Jon; if he doesn't like her for it, he's a hypocritical misogynist. (ETA: And what do you think Val, Ygritte et al. are foreshadowing, if not a relationship with Dany? Who else is a major enough character who fits? I've seen a case made for Arianne, but that's just wishful thinking(*).)
• Is Daenerys truly anti-Stark? Or is she merely anti "the Usurper" (after all, she only ever speaks about Ned Stark). And after her empathising with Robert in Daznak's Pit when she sees Barsena with the boar, can we expect a change in perception from Daenerys?
• Dany cares about her rights? That's why she stayed in Meereen? That's why she says "Justice... that's what kings are for", "A queen belongs not to herself, but to the realm", etc.?

And following his resurrection/survival, Jon is definitely going to become a darker character in-line with someone like Daario, so...

(*) Spoilers for The Winds of Winter:

First, Arianne is probably going to marry Aegon. But most importantly, her death has been heavily foreshadowed. In the second Arianne chapter (the first one read by GRRM), there's a part where she says to Elia "You could have died!" and "died" echoes three times, and the reporter said the way GRRM read it made it sound like ominous foreshadowing. Then there's the prophecy "And everywhere the dragons danced the people died", which may refer to Arianne if she does truly get involved in the dance. Then there's all the other clues - her choice not to read the books on how Dorne resisted the conquest, not reading the military/history books provided by Doran, etc.

What does the content in the spoiler tag have to do with Jon, Dany or Daario?

What makes you think Jon will become like Daario?

[King Tyrion VIII]

1. The fact that he never thinks about incest does not change that he would presumably be repulsed by the idea. And yes, aunt/nephew was considered taboo in most of the medieval societies.

2. Dany is entirely dependant on her dragons. Let's go through the phases of her life without an available dragon:

a) defensless child

B) sex slave

c) basically a hostage and puppet of her enemies in her own city

Without a dragon she is about as self dependent as Weasel.

3. Who knows? You can't be truly anti-Stark when you don't know any other Stark with an expection of Lyanna. I wouldn't put anything past her though.

4. Few retarded decisions and empty words ("Justice... that's what kings are for"? Oh, Dany, you discovered America! Maybe by the end of your bloody quest for what is yours you will fully discover what a ruler is for) are not going to overcome the fact that her whole storyarc is about taking back what is hers by her right.

:cool4:

I don't think Jon would be very happy with her for killing thousands of Westeros citizens he has dedicated his life to protecting. And feeding off that thought, that's another reason he wouldn't press his claim. He wouldn't want thousands of people to die just so he could be King. Why would he suddenly decide to make the realm bleed when his whole arc has been about protecting it?

[PatrickStormborn]

The content in the spoiler tag was related to one of my points, hence the use of (*).

Why do I think Jon will end up like Daario? Well, when I say "like Daario" I'm exaggerating. But Jon will certainly be very different following Marsh et al.'s betrayal. I'm not expecting him to be at the level of Lady Stoneheart, but he'll definitely be a much darker individual tired of compromise.

1. The fact that he never thinks about incest does not change that he would presumably be repulsed by the idea. And yes, aunt/nephew was considered taboo in most of the medieval societies.

2. Dany is entirely dependant on her dragons. Let's go through the phases of her life without an available dragon:

a) defensless child

B) sex slave

c) basically a hostage and puppet of her enemies in her own city

Without a dragon she is about as self dependent as Weasel.

3. Who knows? You can't be truly anti-Stark when you don't know any other Stark with an expection of Lyanna. I wouldn't put anything past her though.

4. Few retarded decisions and empty words ("Justice... that's what kings are for"? Oh, Dany, you discovered America! Maybe by the end of your bloody quest for what is yours you will fully discover what a ruler is for) are not going to overcome the fact that her whole storyarc is about taking back what is hers by her right.

:cool4:

1. Nope. There's no textual evidence to support that presumption. In fact, quite the opposite - he actually compares Ygritte to Arya... That's a bit creepy IMO.
   
2. When was Daenerys a sex slave? As far as I can tell, Drogo soon began to view her as pretty much his equal and completely respected her. She had a lot of power when she was Drogo's khaleesi. And when was she a hostage and puppet in her own city? Dany CHOSE to make peace with the Meereenese, and they were sacrificing a lot to work with Daenerys (after all, part of the peace process was preventing slavery from being allowed in Meereen). She also had the Unsullied, so she didn't need her dragons. But now she has Drogon anyway. And I'm sorry, but why is it relevant whether or not she fights with a dragon? She has also fought with a whip, like Dothraki warriors do. She has waged war, planned battles, and conquered three cities. Anyone who thinks Jon wouldn't respect her because she isn't a ~spearwife~ is just delusional.
   
3. "I wouldn't put anything past her" is not a valid analysis of textual evidence, is it?
   
4. But that's NOT what her story is about. She wants to reclaim the throne she believes is hers because she believes she has a duty to both her family and the common people to do so. It's the same reason Stannis gives, and he is rarely criticised for it.
   

[The Mother of The Others]

• by waiting for it

by writing it yourself when the overhyped author guy doesn't include it

then paste over the pages you want to replace with the ones you've penned. (this works! I'm 4/4 using this method.)

[Lord Artos Llyn]

• then paste over the pages you want to replace with the ones you've penned. (this works! I'm 4/4 using this method.)

You have to share now.

[naik2902]

dany will ride drogon to burn northerner and there she will encounter jon and his wildling army. she will command drogon to burn jon snow but instead the jon will warg into drogon and will take the control. jon will take dany as his prisoner to winterfell. there dany will fall in love with jon and also drogon will start dating ghost and then both targaryen aunt and nephew will have sex in the godswood.

:ack: i m sorry i like happy ending.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

They will not end up together.

[The Imperator]

dany will ride drogon to burn northerner and there she will encounter jon and his wildling army. she will command drogon to burn jon snow but instead the jon will warg into drogon and will take the control. jon will take dany as his prisoner to winterfell. there dany will fall in love with jon and also drogon will start dating ghost and then both targaryen aunt and nephew will have sex in the godswood.

:ack: i m sorry i like happy ending.

That's far from a happy ending. The only happy ending for this story is a well-written one and your ending is just fanfiction bullshit.

[naik2902]

That's far from a happy ending. The only happy ending for this story is a well-written one and your ending is just fanfiction bullshit.

:bang:

[The Mother of The Others]

That was rude. (Also, when the book comes out, just paste your fanfic over the top of the text!) (Oops, by then books will no longer be printed on paper. Drat! So you'll have to hack the text. WHich will make your forgery tougher to detect! Everybody wins!)

[Ser Creighton]

Sorry, but those are all weak.

1. Jon really doesn't care about incest. At all. And anyway, aunt/nephew wasn't really considered taboo in the medieval period.

LOL how are Val and Alys more self dependent than Dany? She whipped Kraznys' face into ruin (and then set fire to him with her dragon), she beat Drogon down in Daznak's Pit, etc. Dany may have servants, but so does Jon; if he doesn't like her for it, he's a hypocritical misogynist. (ETA: And what do you think Val, Ygritte et al. are foreshadowing, if not a relationship with Dany? Who else is a major enough character who fits? I've seen a case made for Arianne, but that's just wishful thinking(*).)

Is Daenerys truly anti-Stark? Or is she merely anti "the Usurper" (after all, she only ever speaks about Ned Stark). And after her empathising with Robert in Daznak's Pit when she sees Barsena with the boar, can we expect a change in perception from Daenerys?

Dany cares about her rights? That's why she stayed in Meereen? That's why she says "Justice... that's what kings are for", "A queen belongs not to herself, but to the realm", etc.?

And following his resurrection/survival, Jon is definitely going to become a darker character in-line with someone like Daario, so...

(*) Spoilers for The Winds of Winter:

First, Arianne is probably going to marry Aegon. But most importantly, her death has been heavily foreshadowed. In the second Arianne chapter (the first one read by GRRM), there's a part where she says to Elia "You could have died!" and "died" echoes three times, and the reporter said the way GRRM read it made it sound like ominous foreshadowing. Then there's the prophecy "And everywhere the dragons danced the people died", which may refer to Arianne if she does truly get involved in the dance. Then there's all the other clues - her choice not to read the books on how Dorne resisted the conquest, not reading the military/history books provided by Doran, etc.

Not a lot of women in Westeros can say they confronted an angry Dragon and put it in it's place. I think to many people make the Dany and Jon subject or Dany and Jon period, into to much of a black and white conversation. It's either this or that, there never seems to be a middle ground in the discussions, which there probably should be.