Emeralds

[Lost Melnibonean]

@J. Stargaryen: What do you make of this sequence from Daenerys II, Clash?

Outside her walls, dusk was settling over Qarth, but a sun had risen in Dany's heart. "Dead?" she repeated. In her lap, black Drogon hissed, and pale smoke rose before her face like a veil. "You are certain? The Usurper is dead?"

...

He sent me poisoned wine, yet I live and he is gone. "What was the manner of his death?" On her shoulder, pale Viserion flapped wings the color of cream, stirring the air.

...

Beneath Dany's gentle fingers, green Rhaegal stared at the stranger with eyes of molten gold. When his mouth opened, his teeth gleamed like black needles. "When does your ship return to Westeros, Captain?"

Quaithe had just recently left Daenerys in Xaros palace and Daenerys had been contemplating what she should be doing. She was glad to rest but then seemed to need to do something, like conquering esteros, which we find out in Dance is what Quaithe wants her to do. Drogons pale smoke made me think of Bloodraven. Ive suspected for a long time that Quaithe is Shiera is and is working with Bloodraven. Then, pale Viserion stirring the air had me thinking the connection was there, so I keep looking to connect Rhaegal. Rhaegal did appear but there was no connection. Rather than pale smoke or pale wings stirring the air, we get teeth gleaming like black needles from the green dragon.

[Fire Eater]

No problem...

Arya II, Dance

The first head is either Daenerys or Aegon. The other is the second. Aegon will betray Daenerys for his love of Arianne and one or both of them will die. The other will too. And of course Jon will be "reborn."

I don't think they'll ever join, but rather Dany will know Aegon's true identity before she lands in Westeros.

[Lost Melnibonean]

I don't think they'll ever join, but rather Dany will know Aegon's true identity before she lands in Westeros.

I know you do. I enjoy reading most of your posts. But then what do you make of this...

The trees stood beneath him, warriors armored in bark and leaf, deployed in their silent ranks awaiting the command to storm the hill. Black, they seemed . . . it was only when his torchlight brushed against them that Jon glimpsed a flash of green. --Jon IV, Clash

[Fire Eater]

I know you do. I enjoy reading most of your posts. But then what do you make of this...

The trees stood beneath him, warriors armored in bark and leaf, deployed in their silent ranks awaiting the command to storm the hill. Black, they seemed . . . it was only when his torchlight brushed against them that Jon glimpsed a flash of green. --Jon IV, Clash

The trees could suggest CotF given that their wardrobe was made up of bark and leaves, and they live in a subterranean cave, beneath Jon's feet.

[J. Stargaryen]

I notice that the crown from the Tourmaline Brotherhood has heads of jade, ivory and onyx. At first blush this would seem to be for her three dragons, but again you have Black and Green. But this time its white as the third option.

And a fun fact, Tourmaline per its wikipedia page has "pyroelectric" properties and so it can attract and then repel hot ashes... sort of like the Brotherhood accepting Dany into Qarth and then calling for her expulsion... I doubt this is a coincidence.

Oh, that's interesting and I bet you're right. Good catch.

Btw, glad you liked my Black Prince analysis. It hasn't gotten much attention, but I definitely think there is something to it. In certain ways -- predeceasing his father, black armor, Black Prince's Ruby being one of the crown jewels/Rhaegar's rubies -- it's quite clear that this Edward was an inspiration for Rhaegar.

@J. Stargaryen: What do you make of this sequence from Daenerys II, Clash?

Quaithe had just recently left Daenerys in Xaros palace and Daenerys had been contemplating what she should be doing. She was glad to rest but then seemed to need to do something, like conquering esteros, which we find out in Dance is what Quaithe wants her to do. Drogons pale smoke made me think of Bloodraven. Ive suspected for a long time that Quaithe is Shiera is and is working with Bloodraven. Then, pale Viserion stirring the air had me thinking the connection was there, so I keep looking to connect Rhaegal. Rhaegal did appear but there was no connection. Rather than pale smoke or pale wings stirring the air, we get teeth gleaming like black needles from the green dragon.

Well, I will direct you to Schmendrick's R+L=Lightbringer thread. At the end of this post, or if you can click this link and just scroll up a bit for the whole passage, but here was my contribution:

Dragons and needles (a blade that symbolizes Jon). Again. And J.Stargaryen made a great observation about this passage: If Needle is Jon's smile, and dragons have needles for teeth, does that mean Jon has a dragon's smile?

[Lost Melnibonean]

Any extra significance to this...

Sansa did not know what to say. Is it a trick? Will he punish me if I tell the truth? She stared at the dwarf's brutal bulging brow, the hard black eye and the shrewd green one, the crooked teeth and wiry beard.

Sansa III, Clash

[J. Stargaryen]

Any extra significance to this...

Sansa III, Clash

Overall, Tyrion's mismatched black and green eyes indicate one of two things, or perhaps both: 1) he has a part to play in the upcoming DotD2, or; 2) it signifies his intra-dynastic conflict with Cersei.

Taking note that this is in ACoK, it is probably also more BotB foreshadowing.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Overall, Tyrion's mismatched black and green eyes indicate one of two things, or perhaps both: 1) he has a part to play in the upcoming DotD2, or; 2) it signifies his inter-dynastic conflict with Cersei.

Taking note that this is in ACoK, it is probably also more BotB foreshadowing.

I meant that the black was described as hard and the green as shrewd...

[J. Stargaryen]

I meant that the black was described as hard and the green as shrewd...

In that case I'm not really sure. :)

I suppose you could look for instances where people are described as shrewd or hard, -- There's one in my sig. ;) -- but I'm not sure if you'd be able to demonstrate any reliable correlation.

[Lost Melnibonean]

In that case I'm not really sure. :)

I suppose you could look for instances where people are described as shrewd or hard, -- There's one in my sig. ;) -- but I'm not sure if you'd be able to demonstrate any reliable correlation.

I'm wondering if we should see a hardening of Daenerys's character and more cunning from Aegon.

[Lost Melnibonean]

@J. Stargaryen: I know you discussed Renly's emeralds during his parlay with Stannis but how about this from the next Catelyn chapter where Stannis's shadowbaby whacks Renly...

"I beg you in the name of the Mother," Catelyn began when a sudden gust of wind flung open the door of the tent. She thought she glimpsed movement, but when she turned her head, it was only the king's shadow shifting against the silken walls. She heard Renly begin a jest, his shadow moving, lifting its sword, black on green, candles guttering, shivering, something was queer, wrong, and then she saw Renly's sword still in its scabbard, sheathed still, but the shadowsword . . .

"Cold," said Renly in a small puzzled voice, a heartbeat before the steel of his gorget parted like cheesecloth beneath the shadow of a blade that was not there. He had time to make a small thick gasp before the blood came gushing out of his throat.

Catelyn IV, Clash

[J. Stargaryen]

@J. Stargaryen: I know you discussed Renly's emeralds during his parlay with Stannis but how about this from the next Catelyn chapter where Stannis's shadowbaby whacks Renly...

Catelyn IV, Clash

Well, I was really sticking to mentions of the word emerald(s) in the OP. I already made note of his tent in Cat IV:

The candles within Renly’s pavilion made the shimmering silken walls seem to glow, transforming the great tent into a magical castle alive with emerald light. Two of the Rainbow Guard stood sentry at the door to the royal pavilion. The green light shone strangely against the purple plums of Ser Parmen’s surcoat, and gave a sickly hue to the sunflowers that covered every inch of Ser Emmon’s enameled yellow plate. Long silken plumes flew from their helms, and rainbow cloaks draped their shoulders. - Catelyn IV

Renly the usurper in his emerald "castle."

I think the black and green mentions once again reinforces the same theme that GRRM made apparent by the naming of TPatQ, or, the Blacks and the Greens. Stannis has the superior claim to Renly. Intra-dynastic conflict, especially with regard to the IT.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Well, I was really sticking to mentions of the word emerald(s) in the OP. I already made note of his tent in Cat IV:

I think the black and green mentions once again reinforces the same theme that GRRM made apparent by the naming of TPatQ, or, the Blacks and the Greens. Stannis has the superior claim to Renly. Inter-dynastic conflict, especially with regard to the IT.

Maybe it foreshadows Daenerys taking Stannis's support from him, assuming he defeats Roose and Davos recovers Rickon and Wyman honors his pledge. We know that the North fought on the black side in the Dance of Dragons. And I seem to recall an SSM where the George said the North tended to be loyalist after Torrhen knelt. We know that Daenerys is going to slay the lie that is Stannis or his claim. Perhaps Drogo will remove Stannis and Daenerys will claim Stannis's forces the way Stannis claimed Renly's.

[J. Stargaryen]

Maybe it foreshadows Daenerys taking Stannis's support from him, assuming he defeats Roose and Davos recovers Rickon and Wyman honors his pledge. We know that the North fought on the black side in the Dance of Dragons. And I seem to recall an SSM where the George said the North tended to be loyalist after Torrhen knelt. We know that Daenerys is going to slay the lie that is Stannis or his claim. Perhaps Drogo will remove Stannis and Daenerys will claim Stannis's forces the way Stannis claimed Renly's.

My take is that the mentions are isolated to themselves. At least as far as I can tell. When you think about it, one person can even shift from green to black, or black to green, depending on who else is involved; e.g., Between Renly and Joffrey, Renly has the better claim. Or, Dany > fAegon, but Jon > Dany. Of course the real Aegon > Jon or Dany.

That is, if it's a matter of 'better claim vs. weaker claim' rather than 'rightful claim vs. usurper'. I'm not completely clear which it is, tbh.

[Hrafntýr]

Kudos, J. Stargaryen, for such a clear and insightful analysis of the emerald motif. You've not only raised my appreciation for the literary qualities of the novels, but you've given me a lot to think about with your wonderful hypothesis about the Trident.

One ever so minor addition I'd make to your discussion of "pigeon egg" gems, one that may have seemed to obvious to include: besides the echo with Aegon's name, the "egg" is also clearly suggestive of birth (with a bonus for pigeons being linked to love/sex/procreation). Thus, Tobho Mott's not only indicates secrecy and "blue blood" but could also suggest "offspring." I think this works for the Cersei emerald pigeon egg refs too: in the first, she's got her offspring standing right beside her. In the second, from FfC, I'd be curious: is this conversation during the time when some readers speculate that Cersei might be pregnant? The "emerald the size of a pigeon's egg" around her neck could suggest so, with the little twist that someone else is usurping Jaime's "legitimate" role as her lover.

I'd also agree with other posters that the connection to the eyes like sapphires of the Others/wights is highly suggestive in terms of your overall theory. Part of me thinks that Jon could stay a Snow, rather than adopt the name of Stark or Targaryen, and I think it remains to be seen what his relationship to the blue-eyed lot is going to be.

Oh, and one last little titbit, vis-a-vis your comments about Oldstones on the Blue Fork: apparently the sigil of House Mudd is a golden crown studded with emeralds on a red-brown field.

[J. Stargaryen]

Kudos, J. Stargaryen, for such a clear and insightful analysis of the emerald motif. You've not only raised my appreciation for the literary qualities of the novels, but you've given me a lot to think about with your wonderful hypothesis about the Trident.

Thanks. The Trident portion is my favorite too. Partially because it helped validate the ruby and sapphire analyses that had already been presented. Even if people didn't quite agree with all of that, I think the emerald symbolism plus the Trident analysis here makes it look a lot like we were at least on to something.

One ever so minor addition I'd make to your discussion of "pigeon egg" gems, one that may have seemed to obvious to include: besides the echo with Aegon's name, the "egg" is also clearly suggestive of birth (with a bonus for pigeons being linked to love/sex/procreation). Thus, Tobho Mott's not only indicates secrecy and "blue blood" but could also suggest "offspring." I think this works for the Cersei emerald pigeon egg refs too: in the first, she's got her offspring standing right beside her. In the second, from FfC, I'd be curious: is this conversation during the time when some readers speculate that Cersei might be pregnant? The "emerald the size of a pigeon's egg" around her neck could suggest so, with the little twist that someone else is usurping Jaime's "legitimate" role as her lover.

I completely agree. I was implying children, but I should have made the point clearer because you're right about eggs being suggestive of birth.

Regarding the emerald egg around her neck, and I can't recall if this was discussed already, but I wouldn't be surprised if it tied into the valonqar prophecy. Since, as you pointed out, it suggests (her) children. And Maggy states that Cersei will outlive them, only to die at the hands of the valonqar. The expectation that the little brother is actually Jaime fits in nicely with the two mentions of pigeon-egg sized emerald Cersei wears; first on her finger when Joff first sits the IT and Ned is arrested, and then around her neck in AFfC, Jaime III.

I'd also agree with other posters that the connection to the eyes like sapphires of the Others/wights is highly suggestive in terms of your overall theory. Part of me thinks that Jon could stay a Snow, rather than adopt the name of Stark or Targaryen, and I think it remains to be seen what his relationship to the blue-eyed lot is going to be.

I'm also not completely sure what to make of the sapphire link to the WWs, nor am I completely convinced that Jon will become a Stark, despite my prediction in the OP. Snow seems like a good bet too.

Oh, and one last little titbit, vis-a-vis your comments about Oldstones on the Blue Fork: apparently the sigil of House Mudd is a golden crown studded with emeralds on a red-brown field.

This makes sense in a way, since the Riverlands are situated between the North and the "south" and the Baratheon-Lannister dynasty will, imo, likely end up being the middle dynasty of the series. Whether the third one is Stark, Snow, Targaryen, or other Other is the part I'm less sure of.

Btw, there are definitely some (very possible) secret Targaryen ties to the color blue. Jon and the blue roses, Ice Dragon, Blue Fork stuff. fAegon and JonCon dying their hair blue. The blue fire in Varys' castration story, which fits with my belief that he's descended from Aerion Brightflame.

[Visenya the Dragon]

Great work op!

I have been thinking about WW, and trying to piece it together, but it always leads me back to the cotf. So sapphire =secret. The secret is cotf created them to defend their land. They see the future, and seen what would happen to them.

Maester Luwin to Bran:

"Take a lesson Bran. The man who trusts in

spells is duelling with a glass sword. As the

children did."

glass sword=ice sword

Dalla to Jon:

"Sorcery is a sword without a hilt. There is no safe way to grasp it."

So cotf created the WW, but could not undo it. But found ways to kill them instead. I had always seen cotf as only good, but now I see them as grey.

[SerGrahamando ofUttershill]

I have a couple of thoughts on Tyrion's green/black eyes. If these colours represent intra-dynastic conflict, having these two colours within one character could symbolise his own conflict with himself. Tyrion is quite often his own worst enemy. He often hates his family, but repeatedly risks his own life for their benefit.

If, as someone suggested, it means that he will have a foot in both Aegon's and Dany's camps it could be that he is going to bring them together rather than working against both.

[J. Stargaryen]

Great work op!

I have been thinking about WW, and trying to piece it together, but it always leads me back to the cotf. So sapphire =secret. The secret is cotf created them to defend their land. They see the future, and seen what would happen to them.

Maester Luwin to Bran:

"Take a lesson Bran. The man who trusts in

spells is duelling with a glass sword. As the

children did."

glass sword=ice sword

Dalla to Jon:

"Sorcery is a sword without a hilt. There is no safe way to grasp it."

So cotf created the WW, but could not undo it. But found ways to kill them instead. I had always seen cotf as only good, but now I see them as grey.

This idea has more or less been around for a long time, as far as I know, but it's not entirely clear who or what the WWs are. I think the idea that there is some secret to their identity and/or origins would certainly fit nicely with the sapphire thread though. :)

I have a couple of thoughts on Tyrion's green/black eyes. If these colours represent intra-dynastic conflict, having these two colours within one character could symbolise his own conflict with himself. Tyrion is quite often his own worst enemy. He often hates his family, but repeatedly risks his own life for their benefit.

If, as someone suggested, it means that he will have a foot in both Aegon's and Dany's camps it could be that he is going to bring them together rather than working against both.

These are good points. He's a conflicted character.

[J. Stargaryen]

One interesting note regarding emeralds, rubies and sapphires, is that the latter two both come from the minerald corundum, whereas emeralds are from an entirely different mineral called beryl. I only mention this because it sort of mirrors the concept suggested in the OP that Jon Snow will lead a new dynasty by the end of the series, which I think will be called House Stark (or Snow), even though he is technically the rightful Targaryen heir. While the Baratheon-Lannister dyansty is something entirely different.

In other words, if Jon ended up as king it would still constitute a continuation of the Targaryen bloodline—via the rightful heir, btw—as rulers of the 7K, even if he rules as a Snow or Stark.