Armstark Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 In the World Book we learn that Queen Rhaneyra Targaryen was once in a quite similar position to Cersei Lannister: Her children had the wrong hair color and their paternity was in doubt.The children in question (Jacaerys, Lucerys and Joffrey) had black hair despite their mother and father having the classical Targaryen silver hair. They were openly mocked as Strongs by their rivals for the throne, Aegon and Aemond Targaryen, because Harwin Strong was the suspected father. King Viserys I. went so far as to outlaw anyone calling them strong punishable by death because calling them strong was to call them bastards and thus tantamount to treason.The name Robert is automatically connected to the late king. So ...Robert Strong... King Strong. The King is a Strong, he has the wrong hair and the wrong blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petyr's Little Finger Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Wow I never realized this, Qyburn has a nice sense of humor. I wonder what Cersei would do if she got the joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay's Penguins Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Cersei knows her history (well, some of it) so I think she'll probably realise and nothing can be done about it since she really needs the knight to defend her against her accusations its too funny.Like an accusation is defending her from an accusation :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armstark Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 Cersei knows her history (well, some of it) so I think she'll probably realise and nothing can be done about it since she really needs the knight to defend her against her accusations its too funny. Like an accusation is defending her from an accusation :laugh: Yes the name of the champion to prove Cersei's innocence proclaims her guilt, great humor indeed :D Also this could give another layer of meaning to Jon Arryn's "the seed is strong" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReleaseTheHound Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReleaseTheHound Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Wow I had never even linked these before wasn't one of rhaenyras sons called Joffrey too? Or am I misremembering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay's Penguins Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Wow I had never even linked these before wasn't one of rhaenyras sons called Joffrey too? Or am I misremembering You're correct. Joffrey was the youngest. He was named by his "father" (Laenor Velaryon, who Rhaenyra was married too officially, while the true father was Harwin Strong (another Strong!)) after his fathers lover Joffrey Lonmouth. Incest, adultery and homosexuality, was there ever a bigger scandal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerys Frost Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Ugh. I got the World of Ice and Fire for Christmas (from two different people actually, ha), but haven't gotten around to reading it. I really need to crack that thing open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LmL Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Cersei knows her history (well, some of it) so I think she'll probably realise and nothing can be done about it since she really needs the knight to defend her against her accusations its too funny.Like an accusation is defending her from an accusation :laugh:Very nice catch. That's a really good joke. Qyburn is one of those really smart guys at parties that make funny but obscure jokes, knowing full well only one other person is going to get it.. and laughs uproariously at his own wit. Oh Qyburn, you dark humorist you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annara Snow Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Ugh. I got the World of Ice and Fire for Christmas (from two different people actually, ha), but haven't gotten around to reading it. I really need to crack that thing open. It's told in more detail in The Rogue Prince novella. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Chase Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Hes the kind of guy that mocks your dead grandma at her funeral without anyone noticing, and instead they thank him for his words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annara Snow Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The name Robert is automatically connected to the late king. So ...Robert Strong... King Strong. The King is a Strong, he has the wrong hair and the wrong blood. Rhaenyra's children had the right blood, though, and their claim came from their mother. The only issue is that they were probably bastards - though their "father" knew the deal and was OK with it and officially treated them as his children. This was not an issue of trying to pass children with no blood relation to the monarch as heirs to the dynasty. Even if they were somehow "exposed" as bastards officially, Viserys I or Rhaenyra herself - after claiming the throne - could have legitimized them, and they'd still have a claim, though I suppose they'd have come after Aegon and Viserys, Rhaenyra's younger sons who were definitely trueborn. Not that Viserys I was ever going to allow anyone to call them bastards, though he probably was aware of it (or was really in denial). In any case, they were his grandkids, of Targaryen blood and dragonriders. Cersei's case is more similar to what it would be like if Alicent had had kids with some guy and tried to pass them as the kings' and heirs to the throne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Yet another example of GRRM's brilliance and sense of humor. Nice catch, OP! :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armstark Posted February 19, 2015 Author Share Posted February 19, 2015 Yet another example of GRRM's brilliance and sense of humor. Nice catch, OP! :cheers: Thank you! :cheers: Rhaenyra's children had the right blood, though, and their claim came from their mother. The only issue is that they were probably bastards - though their "father" knew the deal and was OK with it and officially treated them as his children. This was not an issue of trying to pass children with no blood relation to the monarch as heirs to the dynasty. Even if they were somehow "exposed" as bastards officially, Viserys I or Rhaenyra herself - after claiming the throne - could have legitimized them, and they'd still have a claim, though I suppose they'd have come after Aegon and Viserys, Rhaenyra's younger sons who were definitely trueborn. Not that Viserys I was ever going to allow anyone to call them bastards, though he probably was aware of it (or was really in denial). In any case, they were his grandkids, of Targaryen blood and dragonriders. Cersei's case is more similar to what it would be like if Alicent had had kids with some guy and tried to pass them as the kings' and heirs to the throne. Well of course the situations are not exactly the same but I think the parallels are there and everyone who knows his history could make the connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tyrion I Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 In the World Book we learn that Queen Rhaneyra Targaryen was once in a quite similar position to Cersei Lannister: Her children had the wrong hair color and their paternity was in doubt. The children in question (Jacaerys, Lucerys and Joffrey) had black hair despite their mother and father having the classical Targaryen silver hair. They were openly mocked as Strongs by their rivals for the throne, Aegon and Aemond Targaryen, because Harwin Strong was the suspected father. King Viserys I. went so far as to outlaw anyone calling them strong punishable by death because calling them strong was to call them bastards and thus tantamount to treason. The name Robert is automatically connected to the late king. So ...Robert Strong... King Strong. The King is a Strong, he has the wrong hair and the wrong blood. Brilliant catch indeed! :lmao: But I knew it rang a bell somewhere when I read about Joffrey Lonmouth. <bg> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Wraith Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 In the World Book we learn that Queen Rhaneyra Targaryen was once in a quite similar position to Cersei Lannister: Her children had the wrong hair color and their paternity was in doubt. The children in question (Jacaerys, Lucerys and Joffrey) had black hair despite their mother and father having the classical Targaryen silver hair. They were openly mocked as Strongs by their rivals for the throne, Aegon and Aemond Targaryen, because Harwin Strong was the suspected father. King Viserys I. went so far as to outlaw anyone calling them strong punishable by death because calling them strong was to call them bastards and thus tantamount to treason. The name Robert is automatically connected to the late king. So ...Robert Strong... King Strong. The King is a Strong, he has the wrong hair and the wrong blood. Makes sense, great catch, got to love the depth of Martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamSongs Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Great catch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikkel Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Probably way too subtle for Cersei, hah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Wraith Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Probably way too subtle for Cersei, hah! :agree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lykos Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 This is an awesome catch, that shows that Martin made this joke deliberately and is quite fond of it, (even better than Brown Benn's six foot member). I suspected a joke three years ago because of Lucamore "the Lusty" Strong (thanks to Bran Vras). Lucamore was a Kingsguard who was gelded and send to the Wall for fathering sixteen bastards. Though Qyburn took more than Gregor's manhood though, he took his human will it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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