Floki of the Ironborn Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 The only difference would be Ned's storyline.Marries the woman he loves, doesn't make an enemy out of Barbrey Dustin, isn't forced to take over when his father and brother are brutally murdered... Seems like a really big improvement from how his life turned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughing Storm Reborn Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Robert would have to kneel to Prince Jonyon Targaryen now and suck it. :D Prince Jonyon wouldn´t be half as cool as Jon and THAT would suck... And to have the most badass human in asoiaf kneeling to a Jonyon?? Man, you´re cruel :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStarkInWinterhell Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Contrary to popular opinion. Whether or not Brandon went to Kings Landing a war was inevitable. Whether calls by:1. Robert for having his bride taken. With perhaps Jon Arryn.2. Rheagar who will not go back to Kings Landing to play Prince.3. Aerys lives up to his name. His Heir ran off with the daughter of a Lord Paramount. He would see or be told by his council they are planning to join Rhaegar. No one would be able to speak sence to a man known as the Mad King. Stop believing otherwise.You people seem to believe that it was going to be all fairytale. If Rhaegar declares war. His main allies are who: Tywin? Questionable. Mace? Doubtful. Doran? Questionable. Jon? Doubtful. Robert? No chance in hell.Tywin would be the most likely to support him and it doesn't make his daughter queen.Mace could be offered Viserys.Doran would be insulted?Jon would have watched his ward be humiliated.Robert would stand with Aerys or no one.The Starks and The Tullys are his only allies. He would lose.Rather Brandon march south or goes fishing. The moment Rhaegar and Lyanna took off war was guaranteed. Rather caused by Aerys or Rhaegar. And chance are Rhaegar loses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthGirl Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Very good question OP. Does anyone know the timeline on this? Did Ned go to the ToJ after Brandon was killed? My thought is why didn't they go rescue Lyanna first? Or had Ned been sent to do that? Brandon died before RR started. I don't see it ending in any other way but a rebellion. Why would the Starks and Robert put up with the Targs shit? Their alliance would be even stronger because Rickard is still alive. I still see Rhaegar getting killed by Robert at some point, if Brandon doesn't take him out first. The only difference would be Ned's storyline. As heroic Robert likes to make it sound, and I'm sure he was ecstatic to have a legitimate reason to start it, RR wasn't about getting Lyanna back. It was because Aerys asked for Ned and Robert's heads. In the grand scheme of things, Lyanna is just a wasted political marriage opportunity. No one other than those affected by it personally would be behind starting a civil war just so Robert can have his "boo". Yes, shame on the family, blah blah blah but Lyanna Stark is hardly the first girl to run away from an unwanted marriage. The family could simply erase her from the family line and say "we want nothing to do with this", Rickard apologises profusely and since Robert is Lord of the Stormlands, there is no parent figure to ask fir reparations or declare hostilities. Robert, being Ned's friend, isn't going to make a fuss for the Starks. The difference politically would be for Targaryens, Rhaegar insulted two LPs who, even if they can't publicly take it out on him, now hate his guts. He offended Elia, and therefore Dorne, and Tywin will be looking to be friends with Rickard and Jon Arryn, who will recommend Cersei marries Robert. Aerys might punish Rhaegar but I find that unlikely. He would probably respond rudely to a request to make Rhaegar return Lyanna and Rickard would have to go along with it, at least publicly. The 7K were a powder keg, but I think the difference would've been that the war would be waged on the political stage and not the military one. People were only unhappy with Aerys and waiting for him to die so rhaegar could succeed but now there was a new batch of discontent lords for him as well. Not to mention the popularity of Rhaegar might decrease because of the Lyanna situation. Of course, Ned and friends can be out there looking for Lyanna and Rhaegar after Brandon and Cat's wedding. How they would find them would be how the KG found them I guess. I think the fact that they were seemingly making zero effort to find her while the war was going on (things like dispatching scouts that could go in small groups and find out where Lyanna was last seen, etc.) shows how little RR actually had to do with her. Basically, I think the instability and hostility would've continued but not as out in the open because the push to action was Brandon and Rickard's deaths + asking for Robert and Ned's heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Guy Garlan Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I think everything goes down pretty much as it did. If both Brandon and Ned survive the war, I could see Robert giving some sort of lordship to his BFF, maybe something like Griffin's Roost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Storm Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I think everything goes down pretty much as it did. If both Brandon and Ned survive the war, I could see Robert giving some sort of lordship to his BFF, maybe something like Griffin's RoostMaybe he would make Ned hand since Arryn still had the Vale to go to. Or maybe Dragonstone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Guy Garlan Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Maybe he would make Ned hand since Arryn still had the Vale to go to. Or maybe DragonstoneYeah, I think Dragonstone would work better, even if some people would say it is too big a prize or that it belonged traditionally to the crown prince. But I think Jon was always Robert's first choice for Hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Maybe he would make Ned hand since Arryn still had the Vale to go to. Or maybe Dragonstone A lot of people say Robert hated his brothers, but I doubt he'd give Dragonstone to Ned and leave Stannis them empty handed. He might be more willing to give Ned Griffins Roost, but if he did I doubt he'd take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Guy Garlan Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 A lot of people say Robert hated his brothers, but I doubt he'd give Dragonstone to Ned and leave Stannis them empty handed. He might be more willing to give Ned Griffins Roost, but if he did I doubt he'd take it.Why not? Winterfell would be in the good hands (sorta) of Brandon and Benjen, and Griffin's Roost is the cat's pyjamas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howling Mad Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 In that case Rickard Stark is alive and controls the events of the rebellion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Why not? Winterfell would be in the good hands (sorta) of Brandon and Benjen, and Griffin's Roost is the cat's pyjamas Its made pretty clear in A Game of Thrones that Nedprefers living in the North. At vest he'd marry a ;anderly and move to White Harbor. Howling Mad In that case Rickard Stark is alive and controls the events of the rebellion. Why would he have any more control than Hoster Tully and Jon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stark thenewwolf Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 saying Brandon had a hissy fit is BS, some other guy stole his betrothed. Maybe Lyanna loved Reagar maybe she she didn't but Brandon had every right to get mad and do what he thought would save her. I think he would be able to take Reagar 1 v 1 on foot anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Shit probably would have still hit the fan. Rhaegar's got some balls on him since a certain Stormlord seceded from the Kingdom because the Targaryens screwed up a Baratheon betrothal not 50 years before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Well, a couple different scenarios: 1. Aerys sees sense. He forces Elia, Aegon and Rhaenys to the SIlent Sisters or the Wall while making Lyanna Queen, with Rickard as Hand and Rhaegar isn't allowed to choose what to wear. Dorne rebels and is curbstomped. Robert gains large tracts of the Crownlands and of Dorne to compensate him. 2. Aerys sees a little bit less of sense. Lyanna and Elia are both queens, until one murders the other or her offspring. Dorne is curbstomped and either Jon or Viserys inherits. Robert gains large tracts of the Crownlands to compensate him. 3. Aerys is as insane as ever. Rickard's Rebellion. North, Vale, Riverlands, Stormlands and Westerlands curbstomp Aerys and make Jon King, with Rickard as regent and Stannis as Hand. Robert gains large tracts of the Crownlands, Dorne and the Reach to compensate him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughing Storm Reborn Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Oddly enough if Lyanna married Rhaegar, and Robert just accepted he could get almost any girl to love him, he would have a happier life but... At least he got a legacy on par with Aegon I, if that costs your happiness then so be it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 If Brandon does not go to Kings Landing then there is no war. Aerys does not execute Brandon, his party or their fathers. He has no reason to ask for Ned or Roberts head. Jon Arryn only got involved when Aerys demanded the heads of his two wards, he is not going to go to war against the Crown over Lyanna. The Riverlands and Vale were already split. The deaths of Kyle Royce, Elbert Arryn and Jeffory Mallister likely swayed some Lords into following the rebels, with Brandon not going to Kings Landing those three still live and less outrage in the Vale and Riverlands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hear me bore Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 If Brandon does not go to Kings Landing then there is no war. Aerys does not execute Brandon, his party or their fathers. He has no reason to ask for Ned or Roberts head. Jon Arryn only got involved when Aerys demanded the heads of his two wards, he is not going to go to war against the Crown over Lyanna. The Riverlands and Vale were already split. The deaths of Kyle Royce, Elbert Arryn and Jeffory Mallister likely swayed some Lords into following the rebels, with Brandon not going to Kings Landing those three still live and less outrage in the Vale and Riverlands.Just because they hadn't declared war because of the kidnapping doesn't mean they wouldn't declare war because of the kidnapping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mountain That Flies Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I don't think so. They already had old and experienced Lords like Hoster and Jon in leadership positions. I'm saying that if Tywin saw that the rebels had Rickard and Brandon fighting with them, he would have decided the royals were screwed from the word go and would have joined them outright, probably trying to take some lands from the Reach. They would not make Tywin a leader of the rebellion, but certainly wouldn't say no to having him on their side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Just because they hadn't declared war because of the kidnapping doesn't mean they wouldn't declare war because of the kidnapping. Lyanna is kidnapped. No war. Brandon is arrested. No war. Rickard is asked to come to Kings Landing. No war. Rickard is arrested. No war. Rickard is executed. Still, no war. Aerys demands Jon Arryn executes Robert and Ned then there is war. Aerys killing two Starks, an Arryn, a Royce and a Mallister triggered a lot of support for the rebellion. And by ordering Jon to kill his wards he forced him to pick a side. There is simply no rebellion without Brandon threatening Rhaegars life at Kings Landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hear me bore Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Lyanna is kidnapped. No war. Brandon is arrested. No war. Rickard is asked to come to Kings Landing. No war. Rickard is arrested. No war. Rickard is executed. Still, no war. Aerys demands Jon Arryn executes Robert and Ned then there is war. Aerys killing two Starks, an Arryn, a Royce and a Mallister triggered a lot of support for the rebellion. And by ordering Jon to kill his wards he forced him to pick a side. There is simply no rebellion without Brandon threatening Rhaegars life at Kings Landing.This doesn't address my point. Just because they didn't declare war until he called for their heads doesn't mean they wouldn't declare war. If he hadn't called for their heads, do you think everything would be forgiven? I think not. Communication is slow in those days so we don't really know how much updated information they were getting in the Vale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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