GUEST RIGHT

[Mladen]

We all know definition of the guest right. We know how it is sacred and how everyone despise House Frey for killing Robb Stark and his bannermen. We heard the story of Rat cook. If breaching the Guest Right is punishable by all Gods in Westeros, who should be punished? For one thing is certain, Freys weren`t the only one to break it.

1. Jaime Lannister - pushing Bran Stark off the window while being Stark guest

2. Joffrey Baratheon - ordering a man to kill Bran, and torturing Sansa in KL (well he paid, I mean he`s dead)

3. Wyman Manderly - those Freys are dead and cooked, right?

4. Arianne Martell - Myrcella was guest of House Martell and she was almost killed

5. Olenna Tyrell - organizing Joffrey`s murder at the wedding

6. Littlefinger - plotting to kill SR (don`t know if this counts, since now he lives with Robin)

There has to be more of them, but these are the ones at the top of my mind. Should they be punished for what they`ve done, or the Guest right doesn`t apply to all? What do you think?

[Minsc]

Wyman insured that their guest right was over before he killed the three Freys.

[Scipio Africanus]

Only Jamie and Olenna (very argueble, as I believe Garlan poisoned Joff) broke guest rights. Somehow you left out the Freys which is an achievement I suppose.

Guest right only applies if the guest as broken fast with the host under the host's roof (and in particulair bread and salt or something like that).

[Theda Baratheon]

Let's not be hatin' on those mmmmmm Frey Pies

[Mladen]

Let's not be hatin' on those mmmmmm Frey Pies

Not a chance...

Wyman insured that their guest right was over before he killed the three Freys.

It is a techicality, don`t you think. But, you have the point.

[FittleLinger]

Jaime did the greatest bit of violating guest right - he was kingsguard and murdered the mad king. In his freaking throneroom. He was the most remarkable of guests to the most remarkable of hosts. Not sure if Aerys ever fed him bread and salt though. :dunce:

[Theda Baratheon]

Not a chance...

:smug: Good, good.

[Sasha Steelsong]

Not a chance...

It is a techicality, don`t you think. But, you have the point.

Nope. Horses are expensive and that is what he gave them for guest gifts which officially end guest right. It might be considered a technicality but it is one that stands up. Guest right is only good for as long as you are a guest, when it is over I think everything is fair game.

I do think Jaime and Olena are definitely in violation of it but who knows if they will be recognized as having violated it. No one is really looking into either incident anymore. The Starks are so scattered that who pushed Bran out the window doesn't matter anymore and everyone thinks Tyrion killed Joffrey (and why Tyrion insists on confirming this to anyone with ears I'll never know but that is for another topic).

[Mladen]

Nope. Horses are expensive and that is what he gave them for guest gifts which officially end guest right. It might be considered a technicality but it is one that stands up. Guest right is only good for as long as you are a guest, when it is over I think everything is fair game.

I do think Jamie and Olena are definitely in violation of it but who knows if they will be recognized as having violated it. No one is really looking into either incident anymore. The Starks are so scattered that who pushed Bran out the window doesn't matter anymore and everyone thinks Tyrion killed Joffrey (and why Tyrion insists on confirming this to anyone with ears I'll never know but that is for another topic).

I am not talking of people knowing and judging them for violating the guest right. I mean, if it is understandable to assume that Freys are going down for what they`ve done, is it natural to believe the same rule will apply to all, especially Olenna and Jaime?

[Scipio Africanus]

I am not talking of people knowing and judging them for violating the guest right. I mean, if it is understandable to assume that Freys are going down for what they`ve done, is it natural to believe the same rule will apply to all, especially Olenna and Jaime?

Characters inbook don't believe so, especially Walder/Jamie/Olenna. However Martin writes accounts/tales of perps who breached guest right and eventually ended up cursed. Considering the amount of tales/prophecies which come true in Martins texts it seems likely that bad things will happen to those who breach guest rights.

[Fire Eater]

Only Jamie and Olenna (very argueble, as I believe Garlan poisoned Joff) broke guest rights. Somehow you left out the Freys which is an achievement I suppose.

Guest right only applies if the guest as broken fast with the host under the host's roof (and in particulair bread and salt or something like that).

Good point about Olenna breaking guest right. At Joffrey's wedding guest right is violated like at the Red Wedding. Olenna was a guest at the Red Keep. Although, it could be argued that the Red Keep belongs to the Targaryens and Stannis after them, and had no right to provide guest right in the first place.

Wyman gave his guests horses as guest gifts, which are given on the day the guest departs and is no longer protected by guest right.

All the violators of guest right will die before the series ends. Cersei will find out what Olenna did, and have her executed, especially since she vowed to see Olenna dead. Jaime lost the sword hand he broke guest right with, and he will die alongside Cersei when he kills her.

[King of the Bread]

Wyman did not technically violate guest right as pointed out before because he gave them guest gifts signifying they're leaving his protection, but it does depend on how literally you are going in your interpretation. Also how did Arianne violate guest right? Myrcella was not harmed by Arianne nor did Arianne intend for Myrcella's disfigurement to occur. I don't believe guest right forces the host to protect every single one of his guests against all harm, just not to harm them himself.

[Harald Hard-Ruler]

We all know definition of the guest right. We know how it is sacred and how everyone despise House Frey for killing Robb Stark and his bannermen. We heard the story of Rat cook. If breaching the Guest Right is punishable by all Gods in Westeros, who should be punished? For one thing is certain, Freys weren`t the only one to break it.

1. Jaime Lannister - pushing Bran Stark off the window while being Stark guest

2. Joffrey Baratheon - ordering a man to kill Bran, and torturing Sansa in KL (well he paid, I mean he`s dead)

3. Wyman Manderly - those Freys are dead and cooked, right?

4. Arianne Martell - Myrcella was guest of House Martell and she was almost killed

5. Olenna Tyrell - organizing Joffrey`s murder at the wedding

6. Littlefinger - plotting to kill SR (don`t know if this counts, since now he lives with Robin)

There has to be more of them, but these are the ones at the top of my mind. Should they be punished for what they`ve done, or the Guest right doesn`t apply to all? What do you think?

Really don't see how Arianne broke guest rite, she wasn't actually trying to harm her guest... but to each their own I suppose

[kissdbyfire]

The Freys were killed on the road, so to speak. Olenna was the guest herself not the hostess.

[Mladen]

Wyman did not technically violate guest right as pointed out before because he gave them guest gifts signifying they're leaving his protection, but it does depend on how literally you are going in your interpretation. Also how did Arianne violate guest right? Myrcella was not harmed by Arianne nor did Arianne intend for Myrcella's disfigurement to occur. I don't believe guest right forces the host to protect every single one of his guests against all harm, just not to harm them himself.

Well, Arianne thing is a little bit strechy. True, Arianne didn`t intend Myrcella any harm, but she did put Myrcella in danger.

[Khal Cherian]

Guest right only lasts the night you eat the bread and salt at the castle so I'd say Arrianne and Wyman and even Jeoffrey are off the hook. Also I don't think LF at the eyrie or Sansa at KL would be considered guests so they don't count. Jaime will have to pay and so will Olenna.

[Scipio Africanus]

Well, Arianne thing is a little bit strechy. True, Arianne didn`t intend Myrcella any harm, but she did put Myrcella in danger.

Arianne didn't try to kill Myrcella under her own roof. Quite the contrary she tried to crown her and by the time Areo caught up to her she was incredibly far from home.

Guest rights means some dude/gal coming to someone's house and sharing their food, meaning the host had to protect their guest under their own roof. In the ASOFAI story, only the Rat Cook, Freys, Jamie and Olenna (arguebly) breached guest rights.

[Harald Hard-Ruler]

The Freys were killed on the road, so to speak. Olenna was the guest herself not the hostess.

I always assumed guest-rite works both ways. Protecting both the host as well as the guest.

[Mladen]

I always assumed guest-rite works both ways. Protecting both the host as well as the guest.

Actually it does...Everone is putting down their swords, and no one can harm anyone. Lyn Corbay situation in Eyrie, when he drew his sword on LF, Anya Weynwood asked `Are you a Corbay, or Frey?`

[FittleLinger]

It's just a tradition and a saying. Meaning that if someone punishes them, it will be Martin. Not the old gods, not the new, not omen. At least that's how I think. This, the curse of Harenhal, and MMD's "prophecy" I think are all parts of the historical fiction side of the books, not the supernatural.