Bennis of the Brown Shield Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 5 hours ago, Arch-MaesterPhilip said: The City of New York might begin exploring the idea of safe injection sites. I think it's a great idea. Meanwhile the Philippines appear to be adopting a somewhat different philosophy. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/30/rodrigo-duterte-vows-to-kill-3-million-drug-addicts-and-likens-himself-to-hitler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch-MaesterPhilip Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 2 minutes ago, Khaleesi did nothing wrong said: Meanwhile the Philippines appear to be adopting a somewhat different philosophy. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/30/rodrigo-duterte-vows-to-kill-3-million-drug-addicts-and-likens-himself-to-hitler Considering my experience with addicts this scares me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tears of Lys Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 21 hours ago, Khaleesi did nothing wrong said: Meanwhile the Philippines appear to be adopting a somewhat different philosophy. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/30/rodrigo-duterte-vows-to-kill-3-million-drug-addicts-and-likens-himself-to-hitler Oh, my gods. That guy's a real bozo - a bozo with power. What's next? Will he vow to kill anyone with a mental or physical disability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyroclasticFlow Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 On 9/30/2016 at 10:54 AM, Arch-MaesterPhilip said: The City of New York might begin exploring the idea of safe injection sites. I think it's a great idea. I would hope that they have a police presence in these proposed areas, cops who are trained in administering Narcan. That shit saves lives, all cops out on the Island have it (I believe) We've lost too many good people to addiction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch-MaesterPhilip Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 1 hour ago, PyroclasticFlow said: I would hope that they have a police presence in these proposed areas, cops who are trained in administering Narcan. That shit saves lives, all cops out on the Island have it (I believe) We've lost too many good people to addiction I sure it would be monitored by EMTs or physicians. Cops in New York carry it now. It's an absolute plague on Staten Island. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 On 9/30/2016 at 7:38 AM, larrytheimp said: Kratom set to be Schedule I as of today, although there is talk of a postponement. talk of a postponement. Yeah, it sounds like the ban is going forward though there's been quite a bit of chatter and folks contacting Congress and all of that. Just anecdotally I bumped into an acquaintance who'd had issues with opiates and found Kratom and said it helped tremendously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Walker Texas Ranger Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 They're bureaucrats. They have a job, and they'll do it. Congress (ha!) needs to reign them in better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xray the Enforcer Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 [mod] This thread is not the place to discuss one's disdain for people with addictions. [/mod] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireWolfSpirit Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 On September 12, 2016 at 0:01 AM, DireWolfSpirit said: So what are the differences between Kratom (not familiar with) and Methodone (which i'm familiar with) anyways? Just gonna re-ask this in case anyone could explain how they differ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry of the Lawn Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 5 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said: Just gonna re-ask this in case anyone could explain how they differ? They differ in many ways. To start with, methadone is a synthetic opioid, while kratom is the powdered (usually) leaf of mitragyna speciosa, a plant in the coffee family. It is not an opioid but has similar, though significantly milder effects. Unlike methadone and opioids, kratom is not physically addictive, or at least it doesn't seem to be. It also doesn't seem to sedate the respiratory system, which is the actual opioid effect that kills people. If you look at the incidents when kratom has been implicated in overdoses, there is usually another drug present as well. The actual danger it presents is, if we're being most charitable to the decision to make it Schedule I, unknown. Before, kratom was an over the counter herbal supplement. Now it's gpinf to be in the same class as heroin and PCP. About the only similarity to methadone is that both are used to treat opioid addiction (methadone basically by transferring the addiction to one less likely to give you HIV or hepatitis while you ween yourself off it). And instead of actually researching kratom, it's simply going to be banned. My guess is because it's a threat to Big Pharma's monopoly on painkillers. Either that, or gross incompetence sparked by ignorant fear of some new threat to public health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireWolfSpirit Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 From what youve described there Larry, my thoughts also went immediately to the angle of big Pharm wanting it banned because of its threat to their monopoly on painkillers. Just a point of clarity to those earlier exchanges on legalizing opiates. And I realize that this is a minority opinion and that others here dont hold the same view. But back to this question of the whole supply and demand, price is not the only factor. Theres also the restriction of access issue that plays a role in the crime. This is just as big a factor as price alone. Opioids may be abundant enough that it can be considered commoditized or mass produced and this does make its cost lower, but its still restricted, illegal and in some cases the addict has to resort to desperate measures to get their dose. Severely addicted people will resort to such harmful behavior to get those drugs (anything from robbery to murder) that I still believe some legal 24 hour access needs to be in place to protect the larger society from the uncontrollable uges and impulses that can be unleashed by someone in desperate need of a fix. Just because some addicts seemingly have got it worked out, have been able to find an affordable and reliable routine to get their fix, does not translate to , " street opiates are cheap and easy to get" , so theres no danger in crime by addicts desperate to get drugs/money. Thats wishful thinking. In reality, drug users regularly rip off each other on the streets because they know this crime cant be reported. When a ripped off user has had there supply taken they are still left on the street to get there fix and in many cases getting that fix becomes "By any means necessarry". This is the point that we see the danger and harm in the drug trade that tethers out to wider society, the petty theft, home invasions, assaults, the manipulation of innocents and so forth. I do think finding a way to make life less desperate to the user is safer overall and the ideas like the NYC "safe sites" sound like a step on the correct course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Walker Texas Ranger Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I'm not sure you need Big Pharma to explain it. It seems to me that it's just that when the DEA sees a new mind altering substance, it wants it banned. That's just how any bureaucratic organization works- it sees everything as a nail. The NSA sees a new medium of communication anything, it wants it spied on. Walmart sees a new gadget, it wants it sold for pennies while screwing over the suppliers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireWolfSpirit Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Beyond big pharma domestically, I imagine there would be dozens if not hundreds of entities internationally, particularly in Asia, that are perfectly knowledgeable and capable of making any drug out there. Those supplies are certainly finding there way to the black markets just like our homegrown meth lab supplies do. Drugs are an international business after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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