De-clawing cats

[lessthanluke]

It's 18 amputations, causing the cat severe pain, distress and disability, and purely for reasons of human vanity. If that's not "harmful", I'm not sure what is.

I have to agree. As someone else said its for your convenience and nothing else.

[Arbor Gold]

I also believe this. I have seen no personality changes from my 3 declawed cats.

How old were your cats when you had them declawed?

I did also state, earlier, that in the US, letting your cat be indoor/outdoor or outdoor only is usually considered animal neglect.

Source?

[Kel]

Not spaying and neutering actually can have harmful affects on your animal. They are more likely to develop health issues later in life. Altered animals live longer, healthier lives. Female cats and dogs have reduced risks of uterine, ovarian, and breast cancers; male cats and dogs have reduced risks of prostate cancer and disorders.

[Chaldanya]

Please. Keep your cat indoors. Cats are top predators and need to be kept away from anything they would hunt. Housecats will hunt anything, and they will hunt for pleasure, not necessity.

No.

My cats enjoy going out doors and seriously living in London rats and mice are in abundance so there's no worry there.

Lucky you. But they are still a menace, especially when they're in season, and their fucking can be heard for miles around.

It looks like you're talking about feral cats which by and large haven't been neutered. Aside: We live in cat central, nearly every house has at least one cat; I hear fighting about 1ce or 2ce every 3 mths if that. Please don't tar all outdoor cats with the same brush. 'K?

N

[The Iceman of the North]

While we're on the subject, what are the general consensus of de-clawing your wife or SO? Those scratch marks can be a bitch.

[JungianQueen]

We don't declaw. Never have, never will. We also have a small child and we do a little thing called, "making sure your child is never alone with the cat" mentality. Actually, I think it's a good rule of thumb for young children and all animals.

We've never had problem cats insofar as scratching people, but we did have one that tried to claw the furniture. You spend time and train them otherwise. Either be responsible for your animal or get a pet rock.

[Minaku]

No.

My cats enjoy going out doors and seriously living in London rats and mice are in abundance so there's no worry there.

It looks like you're talking about feral cats. The reason they can be heard for miles around (aside: we live in cat central and I hear them fighting once a mth if that) is that the feral cats haven't been neutered or spayed. Please don't tar all outdoor cats with the same brush. 'K?

N

Well, clearly we live in two different countries, and already there's been some mild bashing of America on the thread in the form of criticizing our infrastructure. We do things differently here, that's all, and that's all that needed to be said instead of mentioning giant roads with menacing cars. I love my cats. They will stay indoors. I do what I can to make sure they stay happy, including giving them places to claw and climb, toys to maul the stuffing out of, and a species appropriate raw diet. Who knows what kinds of poisons or parasites are out there. And if an indoor/outdoor cat thought it would take up space at the foot of my bed, I think not.

I will try not to tar all cats with the same brush because we know they care so much about what we think of them, much like dogs or horses.

Now I have to quit typing because my child is trying to eat my arm and give me an Indian rope burn (that so isn't PC but that's what he's doing) at the same time and by God, that shit hurts.

[Mme Erzulie]

Declawing is a cruel, heinous and vile act. I have seen the surgery and recovery first hand while working for a vet. It is a long and painful recovery for the cat and frankly, a stupid thing to do to an animal. If you are more concerned for your furniture than the welfare of your pet, then don't get a cat.

This, and what Hereward posted.

How people can value their furniture over a living animal (that they presumably chose to acquire and purportedly love) is beyond me.

If you have to keep your cat indoor for safety reasons, I think that's very unfortunate, but defensible, and it's probably preferable to the cat being left to its own devices.

I've got a friend in the UK who has indoor cats, and I just don't get it. They're kept indoors "because they're purebred", and the owner does not want them to get parasites and diseases. I'll be watching her cats peer longingly through the window facing the garden, where happy, healthy, normal cats are running around, playing, chasing, experiencing, being cats. As I said, if you live somewhere with hawks or next to the freeway, I can understand keeping the cat confined. Otherwise, not really. Quality of life shouldn't be applicable to humans only.

But there is no justifiable reason you can give me for why de-clawing a cat is ok. I would view proponents of this as extremely selfish individuals, who have a very ego-centric world view and are not familiar with the concept of sacrifice or compromise.

I also visited some friends in the US last summer. They had two dogs and a cat. The cat was de-clawed, and my heart bled for that cat every day. One of the dogs was a big, slightly wild (not properly exercised) Old English Sheepdog, and it would just walk all over the cat. I'm used to seeing dogs who chase or attack cats get one on the nose and then never go near the cat again. This cat had one option: run. Which it couldn't do very well, given that it had no claws to secure purchase on the floor. Every time it would try to run, it was like watching a cartoon, with feet spinning for seconds before the poor thing was able to get off the mark. I didn't want to confront the family about it since we were living under their roof (for free), but I feel ashamed about that. I wish I'd had the courage to tell them what I thought, and hopefully educate them in the process. They were lovely people, and I'm sure if they actually knew what de-clawing a kitten entails, they would be aghast.

I love both dogs and cats (as well as most other animals), and it would bring so much joy into my life to have one, but currently, my lifestyle would not let me provide a good and healthy environment for a pet, so I abstain. When or if I get one (or more), I'm going to make sure that I do my very best to make sure that any animal I get will have as happy and natural a life as possible.

And just because your (de-clawed) cat seems happy is not an argument in favour of de-clawing. I've seen 3-legged cats that are very happy, that does not mean amputating a cat's leg is A-OK.

Also, animals die. There will always be a slight chance that your cat will die if you let it out, but in most cases I'd say it's not big enough to severely curtail its natural behaviour.

[RaceBannon42]

I trim my cats claws. One puts up with it without a fuss, the other objects rather vehemently. If I dont trim them on occasion they get razor sharp and hurt like hell when I play with them. They also will get stuck in things if they get to long.

I am not in favor of declawing. I wouldnt do it to my cats, but I'm not going to demonize someone who does.

My cats like to go outdoors. They will try and slip out when I let the dog out. Normally if they get out they run over to the neighbors and poop in the bushes then come home. I do not as a policy let them out as they please. I had to have one cat euthanized because he got out, ran off, and was severely injured. The other risk of letting cats outside is infectious diseases. Feline Luekemia and Feline HIV is highly prevelent in stray cats, and both can be readily passed in a cat fight. Both FeLV and FIV are fatal.

Edited to add. They first cat I had was indoor/outdoor. He lived to be about 9 months as someone poisoned him.

[Nichole]

Growing up, my mom declawed all or our cats as kittens. I never noticed any behavioral problems because of it. Now with my cats, I choose not to. I don't see the point and my furniture is fine even though my cat can grow some massive claws. We clip every once and a while, but as Scot pointed out, boy is that fun.

My cat also goes out doors as he pleases. We installed a dog door when we got our dog and the cat took to it right away. He mostly stays in our fenced back yard. He is cross eyed, so he is not a very good hunter. :P He is ten and in good health. My mom's cat, who was declawed, quite the little hunter and loved going outside, lived to be eighteen. Cats who go out side can live long lives, but the chances of them dying by being hit by a car, attacked by another animal, or from disease do go up. Cats that live strictly indoors can live a very happy life as well. It is what works best for you and your situation.

[Tears of Lys]

We had our dear, departed kitty declawed when we first got him many years back, and I've always regretted it. Yeah, he would swing from the curtains in his wild teen-cat years, but so what? Besides, with a little extra effort, like the well-timed water spray bottle and other devious methods, you can teach your cat to be just about anything you want him to be - it takes EFFORT, just like anything else.

He certainly was worth the extra work. Like anything, they are what you put into them.

Regarding the USA laws vs. Rest of the World, it's getting to the point over here too that, while you can still find vets who'll declaw, there's a growing movement against it.

[Mme Erzulie]

Good.

[palimpsest.]

Around here, declawing cats is very uncommon. I've never seen a declawed cat. I think that this is mostly because people don't even bother spaying/neutering their cats and just let them roam free all the time. I don't think I've ever seen an indoor cat either - people are pretty set on 'it has to be a cat and roam free' mentality.

However, I understand the logic of keeping your cat indoors, since I've spent most of my life in a village where everybody has cats and they all let them wander around. There are unwanted litters all the time, I suspect that many of my ex neighbors killed those unwanted kittens every time they appeared, and of course, it was perfectly ordinary to find a dead cat on the road every few days.

I think that it's ok to let your cat outdoors if you have a place where it can run around without people throwing rocks at it or cars running over it by accident. Otherwise, I'm in favor of keeping cats indoors.

[Chaldanya]

We do things differently here, that's all, and that's all that needed to be said instead of mentioning giant roads with menacing cars. I love my cats.

Except that I didn't say anything about that, did I? I also didn't make any value judgements on people who choose to keep their pets indoors. I said my cats were happier outside than in.

I will try not to tar all cats with the same brush because we know they care so much about what we think of them, much like dogs or horses.

Ok, I phrased it wrong. But look into your phrasing, will ya? I meant don't tar all owners of outdoor cats with the same brush as not caring about the neighbourhood or the ecosystem because you were definitely talking about feral cats and not outdoor cats that have a home to go to.

N

[GoN]

I'm against de-clawing, and pro-indoor. Is this the product of being an expat? :uhoh:

[Mlle. Zabzie]

I've had cats my entire life. My parents' cats have been indoor outdoor. Two got hit by a car. One we think a coyote or fox got. Their most recent cat got bitten by a snake, and had all kinds of issues (but survived and is now 17). They had two cats make it to 20. They never declawed them. The only declawed cat they've ever had was a rescue that came that way. She had all kinds of issues and was on valium for a while (seriously).

Our cats are indoor cats (we live in a city). They have lots of toys, scratching posts, etc. When we take them to my parents', they get to go out on the screened in porch, but I really wouldn't want them to be outside. I am also against declawing - I clip our cats' nails, and I've been known to use "soft paws." I started when they were kittens, so they don't really have a problem with it. They are both neutered. Incidently, the rescue organization we adopted from made us promise to neuter and not to declaw.

In the main, I think it is better to rescue a cat, even if you know you are going to declaw it, but I think that it is better by far not to declaw.

[Lany Freelove Cassandra]

Also, animals die. There will always be a slight chance that your cat will die if you let it out, but in most cases I'd say it's not big enough to severely curtail its natural behaviour.

I think on this part, it is very much a cultural thing and we are going to have to agree to disagree. While in Europe this seems to be very standard, in the US in urban and suburban areas, it is considered neglect to let your cats out.

[Nichole]

I think on this part, it is very much a cultural thing and we are going to have to agree to disagree. While in Europe this seems to be very standard, in the US in urban and suburban areas, it is considered neglect to let your cats out.

And this might be even more regional than the overall US. Here, plenty of people let their cats out, I see cats all over my neighborhood. I wouldn't call all of them neglected either.

[Galactus]

I think on this part, it is very much a cultural thing and we are going to have to agree to disagree. While in Europe this seems to be very standard, in the US in urban and suburban areas, it is considered neglect to let your cats out.

I think it's just as strong an urban vs. rural thing.

[GoN]

I was going to say the same as Nichole. Growing up in NC (suburbs) indoor/outdoor combos were generally the norm in any given neighborhood.