[BOOK SPOILERS] Where will season 5 end?

[Tyrion1991]

Apparently, they're combining AFFC and ADWD, bc they happen chronologically. Season 5 will be the first half of AFFC/ADWD and Season 6 will be the second half.

They've said 7 seasons on the whole series repeatedly. They aren't going to be able to cram the ending and last 2 books into one season.

People will get very frustrated if Dany spends 3 seasons at Meereen. They're already devoting season 4 and season 5 to her Meereenese arc; thats a very generous concession to GRRM from D&D and will still be pushing viewer expectations.

I already think the show made a huge mistake having Dany vow to learn to be a Queen so early in season 4. I think casual viewers might be expecting her to leave by the end of season 4 and be really irritated with her arc. They have to absolutely sell that Dany is in dire straits and make caging of the dragons n exile of Jorah good to offset that. They could well run the risk of being accused of keeping her in a holding pattern. Revealing that Tyrion is heading to her at the end of this season could do a lot to maintain interest in her arc.

Also goes without saying. The Battle of Ice and Fire will be in season 5.

Yara/Asha is going to kept captured by Ramsey by the looks of the promo. Likely they will escape together from Winterfell and then be captured by Stannis. Perhaps Ramsey marries her instead of fake Arya?

[JagLover]

to me cutting out the ironbron to me seems like a huge mistake. they play such a huge part in the story, if they are cut that massivly changes the battle of fire, I will never understand why people want to remove a storyline that leads to one of the most exciting portions of books 4 and 5, the kingsmoot. Are there some boring parts in their stoyline yes, but that can be streamlined for the show. it would be a massive change that i just do not see them doing. It would be by far the bigest change yet.

The show is already straining to give enough screentime to what I would consider to be the main characters and storylines, without adding another 5 or so locations, each with their own set of characters next season. Yes the Kingsmoot was exciting in the books but is going to take a large budget to film properly, money that would be better spent elsewhere IMO

[JagLover]

I definitely agree they're setting up Dorne but I think events are going to unfold rather differently...Cersei's sending that ship suggests to me that Cersei is trying to retrieve/rescue Myrcella via violence if necessary...and I think that could go very, VERY badly, possibly resulting in Myrcella's maiming, and really kicking the Dornish intrigue into high gear. Especially if Cersei's "rescue effort" involved a possible attack on Prince Trystane.

Good point

[TeamMartell]

I agree with this 1000000%. They're going for 7-8 seasons, and they don't want to drag out the Meereenese knot. Sansa is running low on chapter's too; this season is ending with the Lord's Declarant scene.

Season 5 will end with Walk of Shame, Battle of Meereen, Jon's death and Sansa doing some TWOW shit.

Taking two seasons to adapt AFFC/ADWD, as you've outlined, will kill the show. How can you not see that from your own post? According to you, all Tyrion does in one season is meet Ageon. And that's just the beginning of your post. You're not a TV writer for a reason.

[Hath4]

to me aegon dorne and the ironborn seem like must have story points to me. They will alomsot certianly paly huge roles in the final two books. in a sense they fufil the power vacum left behind by the crumbling of the starks and lannisters. Will there be some streamlinig in those stories , yes but I do not see them being entirly cut.

[Winnief]

They've said 7 seasons on the whole series repeatedly. They aren't going to be able to cram the ending and last 2 books into one season.

People will get very frustrated if Dany spends 3 seasons at Meereen. They're already devoting season 4 and season 5 to her Meereenese arc; thats a very generous concession to GRRM from D&D and will still be pushing viewer expectations.

I already think the show made a huge mistake having Dany vow to learn to be a Queen so early in season 4. I think casual viewers might be expecting her to leave by the end of season 4 and be really irritated with her arc. They have to absolutely sell that Dany is in dire straits and make caging of the dragons n exile of Jorah good to offset that. They could well run the risk of being accused of keeping her in a holding pattern. Revealing that Tyrion is heading to her at the end of this season could do a lot to maintain interest in her arc.

I for one wouldn't be surprised if Dany's confrontation with Kal Jaqo doesn't happen next season as well, to keep the story arc interesting, and that at the end of Season Five she meets Tyrion.

Yara/Asha is going to kept captured by Ramsey by the looks of the promo. Likely they will escape together from Winterfell and then be captured by Stannis. Perhaps Ramsey marries her instead of fake Arya?

Or at least *tries* to marry her but they escape beforehand.

The show is already straining to give enough screentime to what I would consider to be the main characters and storylines, without adding another 5 or so locations, each with their own set of characters next season. Yes the Kingsmoot was exciting in the books but is going to take a large budget to film properly, money that would be better spent elsewhere IMO

Precisely. Even if they include Euron, (and he would be the only Greyjoy brother-they sure as hell don't need Vic or Damphair) they don't need the expense of the Kingsmoot...not when they have the Battles of Ice and Fire to budget for. You might see some IB raiding scenes, and people reacting in KL, but they'll try to keep it stripped down-assuming they use it at all.

Though I am sure that sometime soon Balon will die since his WAS the third name and leech put in the fire.

[LordCouture]

Episode 1-3: Jon deals with Stannis; Mel warns Jon of "daggers in the dark"; Jon sends Sam, Gilly and Aemon to Oldtown; Jon executes Janos Slynt.

Episode 4: Stannis sacrifices "Mance" and lets Tormund's Wildlings through the Wall.

Episode 5: Stannis leaves Castle Black early on. Melisandre reveals the real Mance to Jon, who sends him to rescue "Arya".

Episode 6-8: Jon negotiates with Tormund; some Wildlings take the Black; they find Wun Wun; Jon sends out the Hardhome mission; Stannis marches through the snow and sets up camp at the frozen lake.

Episode 7: Ramsay marries "Arya". Theon and "Arya" flee later on with Mance's aid.

Episode 8: Theon and "Arya" arrive at Stannis' camp

Episode 9: Battle on the Ice

Episode 10: Pink letter, Jon's stabbing

If they follow this timeline (which is pretty good), then I would put the Pink Letter in Episode 8 (probably the finale scene of the episode). Jon receives the letter and reads it. He learns that Stannis is suppositely dead and Mance is suppositely captured. Fade to black after that. Then, people would be wondering for a week about what happened, whether Stannis really lost the war or not. This leads to Episode 9 where we actually see what happens.

If Stannis wins Winterfell and kick out the Boltons and Freys in Episode 9, then the pink letter lose a lot a value if it's put in the following episode.

[LordCouture]

I'm concerned about the whole plot to crown Myrcella to be honest, because even though it may very well have some lasting consequences (mainly Myrcella's maiming and the introduction of Darkstar, who I actually think will be important), when we compare it to some of the other storylines, well, it really amounts to nothing:

The whole plan fails, some terciary boring characters get killed or exiled, Myrcella (apparently) survives, and Doran reveals his master plan, which lately turns out to be a massive failure

People complain a lot about the Iron Islands storyline, and understandably because some of the POVs there are downright tedious, but the whole kingsmoot thing has huge implications for almost every other storyline: Asha flees to the North and meets Stannis and Theon, Victarion goes to find Dany, and Euron attacks the Reach, which starts the destruction of the Lannister-Tyrell

They can easily switch these boring random characters with the Sand Snakes. And we don't actually know what Doran's plan really is, he's a secretive guy.

I think the Kingsmoot is the perfect introduction for the Greyjoys brothers and Dragonbinder. I hope they keep it. Just cut the stuff that happen prior to the Kingsmoot. If I were D&D, I would do:

4x08: Asha reaches Moat Cailin, Kenning tells her Vic went back to Pyke because Balon is dead. Asha also leaves for Pyke.

4x10: Asha reaches Pyke. She learns Euron is planning on crowning himself, thus she calls for a Kingsmoot (cut Damphair).

5x01 or 5x02: Kingsmoot. After the Kingsmoot, Asha goes to Deepwood Motte and Euron sends Vic to Dany.

[relish5k]

I didn't think I would feel this way, since AFFC dragged so much, but I will really miss the iron born if they're kicked out of the show. Euon is so bad ass, and I really enjoy Victarion's journey to Dany with Moqorro and the Dusky woman. The religious tension there is just...wow. And it would be a good opportunity to add some more people of color to the cast.

[Holy Sock]

It better end with Varys killing Pycelle and Kevan Lannister. Having been absent for a whole season.

[Blutrabe]

It better end with Varys killing Pycelle and Kevan Lannister. Having been absent for a whole season.

I agree. But I have that ominous feeling that we've seen the last of Kevan on the show. :/

Btw, I think it's feasible to have Varys accompany Tyrion to Pentos and stay with Illyrio. That way he can appear in the first two or so episodes as well.

[Lccf]

I really, really hope that season 5 will end where book 5 ends. As I've detailed in another post that seems to have been deleted ( probably too spoilery ), since season 4 will cover some ground from books 4 and 5, it's not impossible that they could complete Feast and Dance by the end of season 5. It will be a BUSY season, for sure, but if they cut here and here, it can be done : do we really need all these chapters with Cersei's small Council in painful detail anyway ? She sucks at ruling, she's losing power to Kevan and the Tyrells, that can be conveyed in just a few scenes. And do we need Brienne's trip to be so long than in the books ? I don't think so. So I'd say season 5 will end with Dany escaping the pits on Drogon's back. ( Given where we're now, halfway into season 4, I guess Dany's wedding will be season 4, not 5's, cliffhanger ).

[Winnief]

The Moon Door episode is next week, which means that Sansa's storyline will be getting into AFFC territory by the end of this season-(with Lady Waynwood and Bronze Yohn) which guarantees she'll be well into TWOW material come next season.

Also since Dany's already met Hizdahr, that reinforces my belief that the marriage and fighting pits won't be too long away and that the showdown with Kal Jaqo will take place in Season 5.

[robdavies1775]

IMBD says Kate Dickie is appearing in episode 10, so I think there will be a new Lords Declarant scene before Lysa's death and also the original one afterwards (next season).

[robdavies1775]

Oops my bad, just saw the preview for Mockingbird, pretty sure the Moon Door is next ep.

As the name implied all along :blushing:

[FC_Lymond]

I am really surprised at how slow Season 4 is progressing. Tyrion on trial for almost the whole season. Ygritte south of the Wall, for a whole season, etc. Some of these plots are taking forever to resolve. Then they will turn around and rush seasons 5,6, and 7... I think it's a mistake.

[Lccf]

It's clear Jon's arc has been really, really slowed down by the Craster Keep mess, so they save the big Castle Black battle for the end of the season. But this is not the most puzzling side-effect : Stannis says he'll leave for the Wall, then ... nothing happens !!! Having the deal with the Iron Bank happen before he leaves for Castle Black, instead of after, is actually an interesting idea to have Stannis' plot make progress while waiting for Jon to be ready for the battle, so to speak, but they should have cut the season 3 finale scene completely. Right now ... it's just weird. And they didn't even try to explain why he's not already en route for the Wall. One line, just to say his army isn't in fighting shape yet or something like that, and the problem is solved, but if there is such a line, I've missed it.

Anyway, I think we all agree that, even if Winds is ready on time for season 6 ( as it seems, based on recent declarations from GRRM ), there is no chance in the seven hells Dream will be ready for season 7, or 8. I Wonder what will happen then ... ( Dunk and Egg season ? )

[Blutrabe]

The Moon Door episode is next week, which means that Sansa's storyline will be getting into AFFC territory by the end of this season-(with Lady Waynwood and Bronze Yohn) which guarantees she'll be well into TWOW material come next season.

I am puzzled by this. They know they're running low on material, why are they rushing Sansa's arc? Man, I want the "Only Cat" scene to be in the finale...

I am really surprised at how slow Season 4 is progressing. Tyrion on trial for almost the whole season. Ygritte south of the Wall, for a whole season, etc. Some of these plots are taking forever to resolve. Then they will turn around and rush seasons 5,6, and 7... I think it's a mistake.

That's quite unavoidable when you split a book in two. Some storyline have plenty material for two seasons, others... not so much.

Anyway, I think we all agree that, even if Winds is ready on time for season 6 ( as it seems, based on recent declarations from GRRM ), there is no chance in the seven hells Dream will be ready for season 7, or 8. I Wonder what will happen then ... ( Dunk and Egg season ? )

The show will surpass the books and spoil them in some way or another. Easy as that. Nobody wants this to happen - not the showrunners, not GRRM, and certainly not the fans. But that's how it'll be.

[Winnief]

I am puzzled by this. They know they're running low on material, why are they rushing Sansa's arc? Man, I want the "Only Cat" scene to be in the finale...

I can think of only two possible explanations:

1. They want more time next season to depict Sansa learning the game from LF-to echo Arya's apprenticeship as an assassin with the FM and Jon's hard learned lessons as LC of the NW. So if/when she does go from Pawn to Player in the Game it won't seem like an overnight transformation out of nowhere but more a natural progression. So they need to get all the other traumas and WTF moments out of the way quickly for Sansa's 'education' to begin.

2. There might be a LOT that's supposed with Sansa in the last two books, (remember D&D know all the major storylines and what the ending is going to be,) so they really need to keep the ball quickly rolling on that one to fit it all in.

These explanations are NOT mutually exclusive for the record-in fact I think it's probably a bit of both-or hope so anyway.

[Colonel Green]

I am really surprised at how slow Season 4 is progressing. Tyrion on trial for almost the whole season. Ygritte south of the Wall, for a whole season, etc.

What about that is surprising? It was always obvious that things like the trial by combat would be saved for the end of the season; and we've known that the Battle of Castle Black was going to be episode 9 for a good while now.