Maid So Fair Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 I don't have evidence for this, but I immediately thought of Sheira Seastar (although Aemon would be 20-30 years younger than Sheira or BR); maybe that would explain why Aemon and Brynden Rivers don't talk? BR was sent to the Wall basically as a favour and an honour for Aemon, to make the transition easier - if they in fact could not stand each other it would have been a pretty dick move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farwynds Oceanseer Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 BR was sent to the Wall basically as a favour and an honour for Aemon, to make the transition easier - if they in fact could not stand each other it would have been a pretty dick move. You're right. Well, Aemon + Sheira Seastar was pretty much crackpot anyway. You've got to wonder, though, why Aemon shows no awareness of BR's existence when they both served together at the wall for some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumHam Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 You're right. Well, Aemon + Sheira Seastar was pretty much crackpot anyway. You've got to wonder, though, why Aemon shows no awareness of BR's existence when they both served together at the wall for some time. Presumably Lord Commander Rivers went ranging one day and just never came back. So Aemon probably thinks he's dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 Oh agreed http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--ZBMj6uhs--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/18xhyiknurz56jpg.jpgDefinitely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 You're right. Well, Aemon + Sheira Seastar was pretty much crackpot anyway. You've got to wonder, though, why Aemon shows no awareness of BR's existence when they both served together at the wall for some time.Maybe it never came up. He's not a talker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerArthurHeath Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 Maybe it never came up. He's not a talkerMaybe he knows Bloodraven left but doesn't want to reveal that he broke his vows to protect him so doesn't talk about him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 Maybe it never came up. He's not a talker IIRC, I thought Aemon basically said that Egg had emptied the dungeons, and sent everyone including BR, as a sort of honor guard for Aemon when he traveled North to take the black. The way it's worded.....it's hard to say what his thoughts on BR might have been. I haven't read Dunk and Egg novellas yet, but I thought Aemon's statement was intentionally vague. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 IIRC, I thought Aemon basically said that Egg had emptied the dungeons, and sent everyone including BR, as a sort of honor guard for Aemon when he traveled North to take the black. The way it's worded.....it's hard to say what his thoughts on BR might have been. I haven't read Dunk and Egg novellas yet, but I thought Aemon's statement was intentionally vague. I'm talking about him leaving the Wall to become a tree root & intervening adventures Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caerl Targaryen Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 (edited) I disagree. He clearly demonstrated his leadership skills by commanding the wall and leading men into battle at castle black. He's then the only man with a plan to end this.How did he clearly demonstrate his leadership skills? Again, he didn't plan any of the defense of the Wall on the show. That was all Ser Alliser Thorne. When they pushed back Mance's first attempt to test the defenses of the Wall, Jon decides that he will best serve the Night's Watch and his brothers by abandoning them without anyone clearly in charge. This is even stated as being a suicide mission. How is this good leadership? He didn't do anything Edd didn't do.This episode had Jon do the exact opposite of what he does in the book by having him choose to abandon his brothers (something he doesn't want to do there but is forced to by Ser Alliser and Janos Slynt) and by not having him heavily involved in the planning of the defense of the Wall. Edited June 14, 2014 by Caerl Targaryen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 I'm talking about him leaving the Wall to become a tree root & intervening adventures It still doesn't change that Aemon's vagueness seems to suggest........there is a common story believed about BR, before and after the Wall. He speaks of him as a known quantity. I'd guess the vagueness all around is intentional on GRRMs part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 (edited) I guess I didn't like it because the strategy was so stupid ie unrealistic. There should never have been sword fighting out in the open. BW and Book Wall made sense. This was just a bunch of random one on one fights. It should have been waves of wildlings crashing ineffectually against an impenetrable defense. Edited June 14, 2014 by rmholt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 14, 2014 Share Posted June 14, 2014 It still doesn't change that Aemon's vagueness seems to suggest........there is a common story believed about BR, before and after the Wall. He speaks of him as a known quantity. I'd guess the vagueness all around is intentional on GRRMs part. Well ... Oh wait, I don't care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuseprime Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 How did he clearly demonstrate his leadership skills? Again, he didn't plan any of the defense of the Wall on the show. That was all Ser Alliser Thorne. When they pushed back Mance's first attempt to test the defenses of the Wall, Jon decides that he will best serve the Night's Watch and his brothers by abandoning them without anyone clearly in charge. This is even stated as being a suicide mission. How is this good leadership? He didn't do anything Edd didn't do.This episode had Jon do the exact opposite of what he does in the book by having him choose to abandon his brothers (something he doesn't want to do there but is forced to by Ser Alliser and Janos Slynt) and by not having him heavily involved in the planning of the defense of the Wall. I agree. And most Unsullied I have talked to about this seem to think that Thorne was great leader. Unless the show has him die, I think it'd be a dick move to vote Jon as LC. Thorne clearly was the leader on the Wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I totally forgot Merret Frey thinking of intro to LS. Doable tomorrow unlike other scenarios Not required & hope they skip. Tyrion future & CotF should be enough . Need ammo for in season bombs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbor Gold I'm Sold Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I agree. And most Unsullied I have talked to about this seem to think that Thorne was great leader. Unless the show has him die, I think it'd be a dick move to vote Jon as LC. Thorne clearly was the leader on the Wall.Hate to say I saw it coming but... It happened. They took away Snow's leading moment. Everyone kept saying no it won't go like that Thorne and Slynt will be called off on a feint on Eastwatch or other tales. He did fight well and finally got a quality kill on Styr at least. Really his only command was getting Grenn to go die in the tunnel to thwart the leader of the giants. That was an important move but it didn't seem like anyone even knew he gave that order. Sam and those that died in the tunnel know but that's it. Alliser Thorne was the hero in preparing Castle Black and leading the defense. What's done is done I guess.? Hooray for the bold and brave leader Thorne(I think I just threw up a little in my mouth). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbor Gold I'm Sold Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 How did he clearly demonstrate his leadership skills? Again, he didn't plan any of the defense of the Wall on the show. That was all Ser Alliser Thorne. When they pushed back Mance's first attempt to test the defenses of the Wall, Jon decides that he will best serve the Night's Watch and his brothers by abandoning them without anyone clearly in charge. This is even stated as being a suicide mission. How is this good leadership? He didn't do anything Edd didn't do.This episode had Jon do the exact opposite of what he does in the book by having him choose to abandon his brothers (something he doesn't want to do there but is forced to by Ser Alliser and Janos Slynt) and by not having him heavily involved in the planning of the defense of the Wall.i can't really figure out why they felt the need to completely rewrite this part of the story. Ok so they wanted the southern attack on the wall at the same time as Mance's attack from the north. No real problem there. I remember when reading about Snow having to go out to kill Mance what a suicide mission it was. Thorne and Slynt had him screwed. In the show him just choosing this as the best path shows how unprepared he is to be LC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbyhouston Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 In the books, he's prepared to go on a very risky ranging, until talked out of it. I think the mission makes sense, especially after losing the woman he loved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Hate to say I saw it coming but... It happened. They took away Snow's leading moment. Everyone kept saying no it won't go like that Thorne and Slynt will be called off on a feint on Eastwatch or other tales. He did fight well and finally got a quality kill on Styr at least. Really his only command was getting Grenn to go die in the tunnel to thwart the leader of the giants. That was an important move but it didn't seem like anyone even knew he gave that order. Sam and those that died in the tunnel know but that's it. Alliser Thorne was the hero in preparing Castle Black and leading the defense. What's done is done I guess.? Hooray for the bold and brave leader Thorne(I think I just threw up a little in my mouth).It's tough because Noye was the leader of the battle for the Wall & died in the book. Yet Thorne remains unpopular, Slynt his buddy was a coward, Jon might still get LC wo it looking absurd. If they show a prev scene w Thorne abusing recruits ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Well ... Oh wait, I don't care. Well........wait, if you don't care not to be rude.......I guess it was a wasted attempt at just polite conversation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Man Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 This is a very entertaining take on the Jon Snow/Styr fight! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLV5SXlzW-k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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