James Arryn Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 It's true that they had to rebuild a fleet and their homes. Since they don't have tree rich islands, that would have taken a lot of iron mining. Not to mention their lands weren't the best agricultural lands, so part of the mining incomes would have to be spent on importing food. On the other hand, Theon knows several of the ships' names from before his hostage-ward time. So, many of them might have needed nothing more than patching up, rather than rebuilding a whole new fleet. I'm not sure on the timeline of Theon's travels, but he does remember traveling first along land, and that doesn't sound a if he traveled home at lightning speed, but took his time wenching and stopping at taverns to have his fill. And then the man he travels with by boat is not an Ironlander, but it's some merchant ship. So, that's not the fastest ship either. It took definitely more than days. I got the impression it took him at least a month if not more.Another huge issue is how they work iron without a lot of wood to burn to make charcoal, but w/e.About Theon, it's less about how long it takes him to get there; warning would only have needed days or hours, and passing ships usually trade information and often cargo. So all it would take is one faster ship that stopped for a chat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 He begged Lysa and the Baratheon brothers for a crown? I sure didn't read that anywhere, and now you will go to your argument: I'm right until proven otherwise, without realizing that the onus to prove yourself correct is on you, and so I do not have to prove that you're incorrect so much as that you have to prove you're correct.IIRC He wanted to team up against the Lannisters with the others, and was willing to cede independence for that ( Catelyn's words: Let a grand council be called).I meant it in the same way as robb giving balon a crown. Robb said that if balon gave him his ships hed give him a crown. However, balon says that robb wants him to win his war. As late as a storm of swords he was sending ravens to the eyrie for the vale to bail him out after he screwed up. And he offered an to fight the lannisters (something he was alteady doing) for baratheon support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Reaver Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Another huge issue is how they work iron without a lot of wood to burn to make charcoal, but w/e. Eh, wood isn't the only fuel source. Peat moss, for instance is an excellent source. Or they could simply trade for that, too, explains why the mining isn't all that profitable, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 ^ Not sure if trolling. :bang: I doubt Robb's letter really made a big difference, but it certainly could have been worded better. "Look how generous I am, giving you back your son. Now if you just give me your fleet, and I'll give you a crown too! I'm 16 years old!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 ^ Not sure if trolling. :bang:Im not trolling at all. It was arrogant. Balon should have made a deal with tywin and then invaded the north. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Eh, wood isn't the only fuel source. Peat moss, for instance is an excellent source. Or they could simply trade for that, too, explains why the mining isn't all that profitable, really.Peat moss doesn't make charcoal, and afaik charcoal is required to sustain the temperatures needed for iron working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Reaver Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Peat moss doesn't make charcoal, and afaik charcoal is required to sustain the temperatures needed for iron working. You can make charcoal out of any fuel source, be it animal or vegetation by removing water through slow pyrolysis (heating in absence of oxygen). Wood is simply the most common source of fuel used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rahloo Connington Posted August 8, 2014 Author Share Posted August 8, 2014 Im not trolling at all. It was arrogant. Balon should have made a deal with tywin and then invaded the north. Hmm, okay maybe Robb was being arrogant; but he was what a 15 or 16 year old boy that had just smashed the King Slayers army. That shouldn't be overlooked, then after smashing the King Slayer he extends an olive branch to Pyke in order to make common cause and take down the Lannisters. Also Balon wanted a crown, could you imagine him getting one from Tywin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 You can make charcoal out of any fuel source, be it animal or vegetation by removing water through slow pyrolysis (heating in absence of oxygen). Wood is simply the most common source of fuel used.Really? I have honestly never heard of peat moss coal. The wood:coal ratio is ridiculous along medieval lines, so I can't imagine the volume of peat required. Are you sure about that this was done, as opposed to theoretically possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Hmm, okay maybe Robb was being arrogant; but he was what a 15 or 16 year old boy that had just smashed the King Slayers army. That shouldn't be overlooked, then after smashing the King Slayer he extends an olive branch to Pyke in order to make common cause and take down the Lannisters. Also Balon wanted a crown, could you imagine him getting one from Tywin?No, but he sill doesnt need robbe permission to be a king. If anyyhing, robb needed balon more than balon needed robb. He should have been more respectful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 No, but he sill doesnt need robbe permission to be a king. If anyyhing, robb needed balon more than balon needed robb. He should have been more respectful.If he had been more respectful and Balon went Balon: Robb should have behaved Ike a King. The Ironborn respect strength; weakness is merely an invitation, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Reaver Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Really? I have honestly never heard of peat moss coal. The wood:coal ratio is ridiculous along medieval lines, so I can't imagine the volume of peat required. Are you sure about that this was done, as opposed to theoretically possible? Here you go: http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2013/02/18/3691317.htm#.UbZSEUDVDTc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Here you go: http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2013/02/18/3691317.htm#.UbZSEUDVDTcNot trying to be a pain, but isn't that about naturally forming coal? I am easily confused, so apologies if I'm missing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rahloo Connington Posted August 8, 2014 Author Share Posted August 8, 2014 No, but he sill doesnt need robbe permission to be a king. If anyyhing, robb needed balon more than balon needed robb. He should have been more respectful. He didn't need Robbs permission to be king, but Robb was the only person that would become Balons ally while he had that title. And Balon needed allies, if not it would be the Grayjoy rebellion all over again. Now the Iron Islands have to face the Boltons and the Northmen, and the army Garlan Tyrell commands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Reaver Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Not trying to be a pain, but isn't that about naturally forming coal?I am easily confused, so apologies if I'm missing it. Naturally forming and forming by humans is hardly the point here, is it ? The point is, peat is already halfway there to being coal. All it takes is heat and lack of oxygen. Which humans have found out how to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Sensei Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 He didn't need Robbs permission to be king, but Robb was the only person that would become Balons ally while he had that title. And Balon needed allies, if not it would be the Grayjoy rebellion all over again. Now the Iron Islands have to face the Boltons and the Northmen, and the army Garlan Tyrell commands.Again. Robb needed balon more than balon needed robb. If balon sent robb a letter giving commanding him to march into the westerlands and saying that hed give robb a crown, robb probably wouldnt take it well. Its arrogant and disrespectful. He was the one going around westeros looking people to help him win his war. He was the one who needed allies the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Another huge issue is how they work iron without a lot of wood to burn to make charcoal, but w/e.About Theon, it's less about how long it takes him to get there; warning would only have needed days or hours, and passing ships usually trade information and often cargo. So all it would take is one faster ship that stopped for a chat. Robb actually sent a Raven to warn Balon of Theon's coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UtherSnow Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Though many don't like it, it was probably about keeping him safe. Eddard was still affected by what happened to Rhaenys and Aegon, and being that the King of the land approved of it and was married to the man who ordered it, he wanted to make sure he wasn't needlessly slaughtered. Have you discovered a secret marriage? Which man was the King married to? I thought my eyes were playing up until I read it again. Surely you meant that the King was married into the family of the man instead of 'to'. Back to the thread's question..... Look at how others were treated for lesser charges than staging a rebellion. Balon got off very lightly compared to some who had titles, property, lands and income stripped from them, and hostages to be handed over. Maybe this shows The Iron Islands in some perspective too. There's no strategic value in holding the islands, or stationing a garrison there. To the west, there's nothing within striking distance to guard against. This is worth noting about Balon's Rebellion. Stannis dealt with The Iron Fleet, which Tywin had failed to do. Balon had destroyed Tywin's fleet WHILE AT ANCHOR. (Worse than careless, in other words.) To take the islands: Robert, with Ned, lead the assault on Pike - Stannis dealt with Great Wyk - Barristan Selmy took Old Wyk Had Stannis got his way, Balon would've been lost his head. How do you view what happened with Theon now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Robb actually sent a Raven to warn Balon of Theon's coming.Did he? Cool, that fits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Reaver Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Look at how others were treated for lesser charges than staging a rebellion. Balon got off very lightly compared to some who had titles, property, lands and income stripped from them, and hostages to be handed over. Who exactly did Robert strip of titles, property, lands and income ? Other than the Targaryens, of course. Robert forgave everyone who sided against him during the rebellion. That was his way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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