ThinkerX Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Ok...the rise of the IS was financed by the Gulf States and wealthy sorts in Saudi Arabia...places that already have a high degree of fanaticism. Further, the totally corrupt house of Saud stays in power via what amounts to bribery and exportation of Islamic fanaticism. So...what is the reaction when all those chickens come home to roost... ...as in a successful IS led or backed coup of the Saudi government and possibly other gulf states? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shryke Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 You mean declaring victory after roping down 20 feet from a helicopter onto an aircraft carrier isn't bad ass enough to win at everything, ever? Seriously, thought i want our politicians out in the field. Otherwise they need to STFU. That's dumb. You hire and train specialists for a reason. The President doesn't lead the charge for the same reason you hire an electrician to fix your wiring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 That's dumb. You hire and train specialists for a reason. The President doesn't lead the charge for the same reason you hire an electrician to fix your wiring. Meh, not talking about leading a suicidal charge. As CIC of the most expensive army in the world you are pretty much guaranteed safety. Anyway yes it's dumb, if by dumb you mean it can result in death. But im tired of listening to politicians talk about justice and "striking" back from behind a podium. Fuck them. If you want to send people off to fight and mayhaps die i want to see you be willing to do the same. So to answer my own question, If I were making grand statements about doling out justice I'd lead by example. One of the reasons ISIS is recruiting so many disenfranchised young men is because of that exact reason, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shryke Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Meh, not talking about leading a suicidal charge. As CIC of the most expensive army in the world you are pretty much guaranteed safety. Anyway yes it's dumb, if by dumb you mean it can result in death. But im tired of listening to politicians talk about justice and "striking" back from behind a podium. Fuck them. If you want to send people off to fight and mayhaps die i want to see you be willing to do the same. Why? If I want a job done, I don't do it myself all the time. Often, I hire someone who knows WTF they are doing to get it done. A world leader is no different. A president doesn't fight a war in the trenches anymore then a general does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Why? If I want a job done, I don't do it myself all the time. Often, I hire someone who knows WTF they are doing to get it done. A world leader is no different. A president doesn't fight a war in the trenches anymore then a general does. One of the reasons Putin is being defended by the right wingers is because he gives the impression that if need be he'd grab an AK and do the dirty work himself, Rambo style. Obviously, the sorry fucker wouldn't do anything of the sort unless he absolutely had to, but it brings to light an interesting dichotomy. ISIS is similar in that it's videos galvanize certain individuals into action. The USA is run by a bunch of suits propped up on corporate interest sticks and inspire a grand total of NO ONE. Maybe we need a leader who DOES what he tells others to do in his stead. Might be useful. Just sayin. (And obviously he/she doesn't need to make tactical decisions. Just being out there in a flak jacket would be enough.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shryke Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 One of the reasons Putin is being defended by the right wingers is because he gives the impression that if need be he'd grab an AK and do the dirty work himself, Rambo style. Obviously, the sorry fucker wouldn't do anything of the sort unless he absolutely had to, but it brings to light an interesting dichotomy. ISIS is similar in that it's videos galvanize certain individuals into action. The USA is run by a bunch of suits propped up on corporate interest sticks and inspire a grand total of NO ONE. Maybe we need a leader who DOES what he tells others to do in his stead. Might be useful. Just sayin. Right, but that's why the right wingers are fucking STUPID. They are getting off to his silly strongman antics. We don't need MORE of that shit, we need less of it. We need less Mission Accomplished wankery and more carefully considered decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Right, but that's why the right wingers are fucking STUPID. They are getting off to his silly strongman antics. We don't need MORE of that shit, we need less of it. We need less Mission Accomplished wankery and more carefully considered decisions.Well, I agree with you. However the reality is not what we want it to be. I watched videos of Kerry and Obama today discussing ISIS and their talk of justice and reach and whathaveyou was gag worthy. I'd prefer to see them in Iraq giving these press conferences. If I was talking all the shit they were I'd back it up, personally. Anyway, like I said before, silly tangent by a semi inebriated me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 If politicians had to get out in the field one of two things would happen. Either wars would cease or countries would be run by fucked-up individuals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Iceman of the North Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 There is all this talk from the White House by the C.I.C. about the reach of America and justice being served, but it all sounds a bit silly being delivered from behind a podium dressed in a suit. It's always been this way in America, as long as i can remember, and it always sounded highly disingenuous. If i was the PotUS I think id lead by example when it came to sending troops into combat. I was about to comment that this was true everywhere, but then I thought about the last one who made this kind of talk in my country, granted a couple of years before TV and even radio, and he never came back alive from his adventure abroad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Hang on. Am I reading this right. Is it being advocated that the elected leader of a country - usually around 60 years of age or more - should lead his troops into battle each time there is a war? This is not the movie Independence Day, folks. At least try to retain a grip on reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Hang on. Am I reading this right. nope, you are not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Political leaders in Rome took to the field. See how well that turned out?;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maarsen Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Political leaders in Rome took to the field. See how well that turned out? ;)Considering that the last bit of the Roman Empire lasted until 1492, it wasn't a bad run. Also Julius Ceasar was a military leader before he became a political leader and he knew how to deal with hostage situations, from personal experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Notorious Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I think the prudent course of action should be that Obama, or any senator can propose I think, a congressional vote on how to deal with the emergence of ISIS. Let that vote be a reflection of the national consensus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clueless Northman Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 When Macedonian kings led their armies to battle, it didn't always end in total disaster, actually. That said, I still think it's better to have the most competent general leading troops and designing the strategy. At least if you want to win - if it's just to prop the leader's ego, then go ahead, of course :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Have the Russians descended on ISIS yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 The Fallen,Putin is powering up his "nipple beams". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 The Fallen,Putin is powering up his "nipple beams".Hehehe. Is that why he's always running around shirtless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Watch the below video only if you have the stomach for it. It is horrific. Showing Isis executing captured soldiers. http://www.military.com/video/operations-and-strategy/terrorism/isis-massacres-shias-in-iraq/3709001666001/ In a discussion like this thread, it is easy to get lost in the attempts at witty banter and snarky retorts, but when you see a video like this, the reality of the evil that is Isis leaves you cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Watch the below video only if you have the stomach for it. It is horrific. Showing Isis executing captured soldiers. http://www.military.com/video/operations-and-strategy/terrorism/isis-massacres-shias-in-iraq/3709001666001/ In a discussion like this thread, it is easy to get lost in the attempts at witty banter and snarky retorts, but when you see a video like this, the reality of the evil that is Isis leaves you cold. At least those guys were soldiers. I think most factions in the region treat captured enemies in a similar fashion, they just don't film it. It's the treatment of "enemy" civilians by ISIS, especially women, that is truly horrific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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