"Lyanna was at the ToJ" = not canon

[Ygrain]

Has anyone eve found an instance of the app being proven to be mistaken?

IIRC, there was a thread where people were pointing out inconsistencies, and they were corrected.

[Voice]

Oh say what now? :bang: Ok well I at least have the good grace to apologize then. No, I certainly wouldn't treat the app as canon. I retract my statements concerning canon and the point being moot, the thread being invalid, etc. *embarassing* :blushing:

However, I don't think the app is meaningless, as George did endorse it and was involved.. but for a technicality like this, I don't think it settles the issue. TWOIAF, unreliable narrator taken into consideration, is canon, 100%, so this statement being in there would be different.

Still, I see no evidence to suspect Lyanna wasn't at the ToJ, which is kind of the real issue here.

:cheers:

The app, while not meaningless, has yet to be verified. Like the wiki, it sounds far more like an interpretation of events, than it does Martin's own words regarding them. He has been far more guarded. Below lies the one and only canonical mention of the "tower of joy." Not only is Lyanna not mentioned, it does not sound like a large enough structure to house anyone.

Eddard X AGOT:

It would have to be his grandfather, for Jory's father was buried far to the south. Martyn Cassel had perished with the rest. Ned had pulled the tower down afterward, and used its bloody stones to build eight cairns upon the ridge. It was said that Rhaegar had named that place the tower of joy, but for Ned it was a bitter memory. They had been seven against three, yet only two had lived to ride away; Eddard Stark himself and the little crannogman, Howland Reed. He did not think it omened well that he should dream that dream again after so many years.

The OP is doing little more than reminding us to heed the author's own admonition, below:

You'll need to wait for future books to find out more about the tower of joy and what happened there, I fear.

I might mention, though, that Ned's account, which you refer to, was in the context of a dream... and a fever dream at that. Our dreams are not always literal.

[RumHam]

Has anyone eve found an instance of the app being proven to be mistaken?

Yeah it had a fair number of errors in it at first, stating that Robert was born on the Dothraki sea for example. As Ygrain said there is a thread for reporting them.

The app, while not meaningless, has yet to be verified. Like the wiki, it sounds far more like an interpretation of events, than it does Martin's own words regarding them.

What do you mean it has yet to be verified? Verified by who? It's officially sanctioned and worked on by Martin and his publisher. It does not need your approval to be a valid source of information.

[The Missing Crannogman]

I believe he only meant that it was not actually written by George. In which case, personal interpretation becomes an issue when dealing with whether or not the information is truly accurate and is exactly what George said happened. George may say "x" happened but it might get written down as "y" happened. Might the two be similar? Sure, but they wouldn't be exactly the same.

[Voice]

What do you mean it has yet to be verified? Verified by who? It's officially sanctioned and worked on by Martin and his publisher. It does not need your approval to be a valid source of information.

Most certainly. It does not require my approval. But it would be nice to have verification of this specific passage, considering it goes above and beyond what is written in the series. It sounds speculative.

[Voice]

Voice, my mistake to confuse the "RLJ deniers" with the entire heretic thread. I was really talking about the specific group of people who do not think RLJ was true, not the entirety of the heresy thread, so my mistake. However, I was referring to the issue the RLJ deniers have had with their threads getting shut down, some people say they have been banned or booted from the RLJ thread, etc. Over on the "other board" it seems like pretty much every other comment was complaining about something along these lines.

Sure I hear ya. I think you would enjoy Heresy though. Your own threads are quite heretical in nature.

Edit, for example:

Been on a hiatus for a month or so and had some catching up to do with the Heresy saga. Seems like I missed out on some craziness. Last thread, someone brought up the Bloodstone Emporer, which I've never read before, but found it to be fascinating with an implication fueled by this line:

He...cast down the true gods of Yi Ti, to worship a black stone that fell from the sky... his usurpation... ushered in the Long Night.

This seems to give credibility to the theory that Dawn is the original Lightbringer. A sword forged from a white meteorite to combat the evil tied to a black meteorite is just too perfect. But, it wouldn't be heresy if I didn't stretch this to tinfoil hat territory. What if the black meteorite was forged into armor (ie - white sword opposes black armor)? Going into full heresy: what if the "black ice" armor that Jon is wearing in his dream is actually black meteorite armor? Jon going to the dark side is not a new theory, but this could be a solid piece to add to it.

Can't stop there, though. There's a lot of theories that also tie Jon to Dawn (aka Lightbringer). So we can't possibly reconcile the above theory with this one, can we? We can with MORE HERESY! I have faith in R+L=J. If we follow the rabbit hole of potential clues. Stark=Ice=Black and Targ=Fire=White. Jon is both Stark and Targ, Ice and Fire. Black and White. Where else is black and white prominently featured? The faceless men and the many-faced god (House of the Black and White). If Jon has the black armor and white sword (Dawn), then his path is a dark one, possibly an avatar of Death itself.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

IIRC, there was a thread where people were pointing out inconsistencies, and they were corrected.

There is indeed..