Boarsbane Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Sure he was worse than Craster, Balon, Tywin and Randyll. Because for someone who knows even basic psychology is obvious. Also this:It's not fair to compare him to people like Tywin and Balon who were actually fathers to their children. Robert probably didn't know who most his children were nor did he care to find out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-L Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Robert is a tough character for me. He's likable and jolly (if you're on the right side of him), and we were introduced to him through Ned's eyes, and Ned loved him. But the thing I disliked about him most of all was how he treated women. He treated mistresses and prostitutes like objects and didn't care for his bastards. He claimed to love Lyanna, but Ned himself said he didn't know her or respect her boldness. He didn't love the real her, but the image of her in his mind, and he started a war to take her away from the man who really loved her. And then there's Cersei. Of course, Cersei is a horrid person, and it's easy to see why he despised her, but nothing makes the way he treated her okay. Robert started nothing. He went to war only after the father of the man who had taken his betrothed asked for his head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted June 10, 2015 Author Share Posted June 10, 2015 It was a punishment. Just because it was first said by stannis doesn't make it untrue. It was a punishment and that was an excuse Got to agree with this. Dragonstone is somewhat prestigious and Stannis should be grateful for what he's given. However, it doesn't require a hard ass to keep order. There are barely any houses sworn to it, and there aren't that many people to keep in line there. I think Robert was definitly angry and disappointed he let the Targ kids get away. Im honestly not sure why he let them live for 15 years. But even if Im wrong about everything else, is it disputed that he didn't do crap for 15 years? Sure he snuffed out the Greyjoy rebellion, but he had to do that if he wanted his kingdoms to survive. He never seemed to do anything proactive or positive even though he was in a better position to do that than anyone else. Also, I can't believe people haven't mentioned his propensity to turn a blind eye to injustice (such as Lady's Death, and Cersei's enslavement of his mistress). While Jaime, Tyrion, the Hound and Stannis all have done individual acts that are more blameworthy than Robert, Robert's collective actions and inactions as a person, make him seem ultimately shittier than the above mentioned. At least the above mentioned have done good things along with the bad, and care about goals and things apart from themselves. Robert seems the embodiment of non-agressive selfishness and self-absorption, more than Cersei even (although she is worse). Cersei was all about "loving" and protecting her children, and being the best female version of her father she could be. Robert appeared not really to love anyone except Ned, and only barely it seemed to me as the story went on. Idk. I guess Robert had potential to be good, but just was quite disappointing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khal drogon Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Sure he was worse than Craster, Balon, Tywin and Randyll. He never cared about his children. He knew Joffery's cruel nature yet he did nothing about it considering he is his heir. Joffery turned out to be what he was because of Robert's negligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Santa of House Claus Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 He is another complex character, and I would argue had probably suffered from sever depression for pretty much the entire time he was on the throne. Lyanna became his obsession and one desire and she died, he did not get what he set out to get back and slipped into a sever depression that being king and having a terrible wife could not fix. But I am far from an expert on that sort of thing, but the over compensating with the excessive drinking, eating, and whore, seem to me like a mask or coping mechanisms. Granted he already did that before, but they seemed to have gotten way worse. I still say he was a decent person stuck in a very very bad situation, and no, he did not do his best to deal with it, or try to make the best of it, it is a complex world and you can't just chuck all the blame on one person. Also, from all accounts, it was Jon Arryn who ruled really so blame for lack of improvements during his reign can be placed on him and the Small Council mostly as Robert rarely attended the Small Council meetings. So they would have had a mostly free hand to, say improve the roads and sanitation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted June 10, 2015 Author Share Posted June 10, 2015 Robert just never did anything. He ascended and left the kingship as exactly the same person. Just 15 years of drinking,whoring, and feasting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redxavier Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 What do you expect him to have done? Tear apart Westeros in a revolution for the downtrodden? He kept the peace. What he did with his personal time is irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindrot Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 He clearly hated Targaryen children and wanted them dead. His best buddy keeping the identity of Jon away from him says a lot about him. Ned had nothing to fear from Robert finding out Jon's identity. The reason he does not tell Robert is the same reason he does not tell his wife of 20+ years: "Promise me, Ned." Ned the Honorable is not going to break an oath to his sister on her deathbed. It is that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Santa of House Claus Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Ned had nothing to fear from Robert finding out Jon's identity. The reason he does not tell Robert is the same reason he does not tell his wife of 20+ years: "Promise me, Ned." Ned the Honorable is not going to break an oath to his sister on her deathbed. It is that simple. That is all still assumption, R+L=J is still just a theory. We know Robert wanted all Targ's dead, and that really does make sense, as cruel as it is, because any living Targ would be a threat to his rule. We do not know what the promise was, who Jon's mother truly is, and why Ned kept all that information so close to his chest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wolves Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Ned had nothing to fear from Robert finding out Jon's identity. The reason he does not tell Robert is the same reason he does not tell his wife of 20+ years: "Promise me, Ned." Ned the Honorable is not going to break an oath to his sister on her deathbed. It is that simple.To the bolded is not true everytime Robert expresses his hatred of the Targs it makes Ned uncomfortable. Lyanna's probably made Ned promise to keep Jon safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihlus Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 To the bolded is not true everytime Robert expresses his hatred of the Targs it makes Ned uncomfortable. Lyanna's probably made Ned promise to keep Jon safe.Why did Robert let Vis and Dany live for 13 years, then? His douchebag little brother and some of the other members of his small council wanted to have them killed as children years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Why did Robert let Vis and Dany live for 13 years, then? His douchebag little brother and some of the other members of his small council wanted to have them killed as children years ago. He sent Stannis after them and he failed to capture them. Viserys and Dany complain that they had to constantly move around. This may not have been the first time Robert sent people to kill them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 He sent Stannis after them and he failed to capture them. Viserys and Dany complain that they had to constantly move around. This may not have been the first time Robert sent people to kill them. Renly commenting that he would have had both of them killed years ago implies that Robert hadn't tried yet, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robb stark of the north Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 As Barristan says, Robert was a good man, a good warrior and commander but failed to be a good king. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Renly commenting that he would have had both of them killed years ago implies that Robert hadn't tried yet, though. Yep, here's the quote Lord Renly shrugged. "The matter seems simple enough to me. We ought to have had Viserys and his sister killed years ago, but His Grace my brother made the mistake of listening to Jon Arryn." Viserys saw assassins, it doesn't mean they were there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted June 10, 2015 Author Share Posted June 10, 2015 As Barristan says, Robert was a good man, a good warrior and commander but failed to be a good king. I see the good warrior/commander part. I just haven't seen any evidence that Robert was a "good man" apart from being Ned's friend. Are there really any examples of kindness, restraint, compassion or integrity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Yep, here's the quote Viserys saw assassins, it doesn't mean they were there. Possibly. But Renly has not been on the Small Council for all of Roberts reign and Robert may have been more discreet as he knew what Arryns response would be. Another possibility is that the people who have tried to assassinate the Targ kids saw how Robert rewarded Tywin and figure there would be a reward for killing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I see the good warrior/commander part. I just haven't seen any evidence that Robert was a "good man" apart from being Ned's friend. Are there really any examples of kindness, restraint, compassion or integrity? Giving away castles left and right while he should have kept them and forgiving essentially everyone but Rhaegar and Aerys are a good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindrot Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 That is all still assumption, R+L=J is still just a theory. We know Robert wanted all Targ's dead, and that really does make sense, as cruel as it is, because any living Targ would be a threat to his rule. We do not know what the promise was, who Jon's mother truly is, and why Ned kept all that information so close to his chest. It does not matter that it is an assumption, if Jon is not a Targ, why would Ned need to protect him from Robert? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I see the good warrior/commander part. I just haven't seen any evidence that Robert was a "good man" apart from being Ned's friend. Are there really any examples of kindness, restraint, compassion or integrity? Robert had a knack for making friends. He'd start a day fighting someone and end it drinking with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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