So he's gone? Dead? Not coming back?

[KingsizeKini]

I'm pretty certain he will be back. Littlefinger mentioning Lyanna Stark and Rhaegar to Sansa, as well as the foreshadowing with Maester Aemon about the last Targaryen (with Jon entering the room) would be totally useless otherwise. Also, why even bring Mel back to the Wall? What would even be the point of the scene with her and Jon, where she tries to seduce him? Where she tells him, that he is special? Also, the producers and Kit claiming that Jon is dead for good isn't really something I take too seriously. There were other fakeouts before. I don't know, it wouldn't make much sense from a storytelling point of view, to just end his story arc. There was way too little build up for such an important death. Compared to how they build up the deaths of Ned Stark, Tywin or Robb, this would be a pretty horrible way to kill off a fan favorite.

The only reason I have a bit of a doubt if Jon comes back, is Davos. With Sam gone, Jon was the only real connection to the wall. With Davos, who lost his King, son and Shireen, the NW sounds like a good place for him to be. Especially since he wouldn't really find a place anywhere else as former hand of Stannis. Him & Mel sounds like a good team to lead the NW.

Still, I doubt that Jon stays dead. Killing off one of the most beloved characters in this way, would be a bit stupid. Especially since he is the character who always spawned the most fan theories. The fact that they made it somewhat of a cliffhanger is further proof that they will keep him alive. If they wanted us to actually believe he is dead, why not kill him the episode before? Really show us that he is dead for good and not leave it like that? There are plenty of important characters dying before a season finale. Ned, Robb & Cat Stark for example. Barristan or Oberyn Martell would be another. Leaving it like that, doesn't make too much sense for me.

[KingsizeKini]

Double Post

[evetssteve10]

Let's just say I would go from praising this show like no other, which I've been doing this whole time, to thinking it was one of the worst turn of events in TV history. It would be the equivalent of the show LOST all of a sudden saying Jack doesn't matter and kill him off in the 3rd season. ( and yes I do know about the rumor of them originally wanting to kill him season 1, until they realized how stupid it would be )

[Carty011093]

I've been scouring the web, forum and elio and Linda themselves.

End of the day weigh everything up, you come back to the same old straw We keep on clutching. Which is we "know nothing" until winds and season 6 are out, and this is clearly how D&D and george wanted it.

Yep until we see/read otherwise...... Jon is DEAD, Period.

However...

Elio and Linda say it better than anyone. The whole point of a cliff hanger is to show a 'problem' how will they get out of this? You don't show a cliff hanger POV to revisit it to show them falling off the cliff. As stated before "its bad storytelling" Elio and Linda = nail on head. GRRM is being coy on the subject because, let's face it he can do what ever he wants. However D&D can only do things with the template they have, the show is an ADAPTION not a carbon copy. If D&D say Jon is dead, Jon is dead, they answer what they have been asked. Until they are asked "will he be resurrected?" and they say 'NO' we can worry. Until then I'm pretty sure Jon is dead but coming back.... As stated yet again by Elio and Linda. The whole show feels like a checklist and this event was a big tick. As for the question they answered before adapting the show, it seems like they got the right answer and Jon's parentage is a 'checklist moment' it's hard to tick it off, if the person in question is at the pearly gates.

As for telling each interviewer 'he is dead'

They are businessmen, they know the cliff hanger is left unanswered. If they go around telling everyone he is dead, they will lose viewers. FACT. They are clearly relying on book readers saying 'he may live' to keep viewers interested. If enough people are told he is dead, enough people believe it...... all of a sudden Jon is resurrected, theories are right. RATINGS = SKYROCKET. Actions speak louder then words, if they say one thing but do another end result is HIGH RATINGS. At the moment they are answering what they are asked, maybe lying maybe not, doesn't matter. The fact we are talking about it, is what they want.

[Carty011093]

Bleh adaptation* I meant

[PlayerUp.com]

Has anyone considered this possibility?

What if bran wargs into Jon's body and fights the walkers as Jon.

Let me break this down.

• The story doesn't need Jon Snow warging. If he warged, that just means he's trapped inside Ghost body.

That's why I think if he was going to warg, we would have seen it already. So I'm ruling out any idea of warging and that warging story will only belong to Bran.

The only way Jon Snow is coming back is if:

- Melisandre or another revives him, OR

- He's reborn when being burned, OR

- They don't burn him and he turns into a whitewalker, OR

If during Season 6 Episode 1 you see his body burn and nothing happens, I think that all but rules out him likely returning ever

If during Season 6 Episode 1 you see his body vanish, I think it's a clue for things to come down the road maybe in Season 7

If during Season 6 Episode 1 we see something else other than the 2 above, then possibility he may comeback next season.

His body needs to stay intact. My guess is Melisandre may prevent him from being burned. Maybe she tries to revive him and she can't. That's why we may not hear anything about Kit returning next season and they focus at rushing the stories of the remaining characters before the final Season 7.

[HellasLEAF]

I'm absolutely sure they have NOT filmed any scenes for season 6. Season 6 was not written or designed yet.

The smart thing keep Jon's fate a mystery would be to resurrect Jon at the very end of the season, so they would only need Kit Harington for a couple of days of interior shooting; remember, we hardly get any news of what they shoot in the studio (or in Ireland, for that matter). Only things shot in the southern locations leak frequently.

Also, that would make more dramatic sense. Having Jon back at the beginning of the next season would be just a cheak plot-device to get him free of his oath. However, the return of the saviour after a very bleak season 6 would be a powerful way to set up season 7.

I pretty much came to post this exact thing. They don't even need Kit for season 6 imo. There is so much story to be told without him I would bet. I too do not think his story is over and will continue on in some way. As Jon Targ. perhaps.

[PlayerUp.com]

Season 6 shooting doesn't start until October. 4 months to go. Kit Harrington did say recently if he did begin shooting, he couldn't tell you.

If he is telling the truth and not at all in Season 6, then that almost certainly means his body will go missing or being buried. If however they burn his body, most certainly they'll have to show a scene with his body burning which means he's in Season 6. Considering everyone at the wall is shown having their body burned, you'd have to assume Jon Snow would as well which means if he is truly dead then he'd be in Season 6.

[Baron Bazunor the Twisted]

Oh come on people, at worst he has a season off and returns gloriously in Season 7.

This is exactly what they wanted, the book-fanbase is now doubting what WAS OBVIOUS before the finale. You are all being suckered ahahaha.

[BlueDragon]

Oh come on people, at worst he has a season off and returns gloriously in Season 7.

This is exactly what they wanted, the book-fanbase is now doubting what WAS OBVIOUS before the finale. You are all being suckered ahahaha.

I hope I am being suckered.

Because this story is just a bunch of people getting whacked without a nexus of characters really fighting the WW instead of one another.

Why even write in this genre if everyone we become invested in gets whacked?

[whikjik]

I hope I am being suckered.

Because this story is just a bunch of people getting whacked without a nexus of characters really fighting the WW instead of one another.

Why even write in this genre if everyone we become invested in gets whacked?

But it's people's choice to whack each other instead of fighting the WW. Why override their decisions with supernatural miracles?

[whikjik]

Who said it should be some good-hearted guy who beats the WW? Why can't a murderous rapist (a la Ramsay) fulfill such a mission?

[BlueDragon]

But it's people's choice to whack each other instead of fighting the WW. Why override their decisions with supernatural miracles?

Why not? It is a supernatural story with magic.

Martin may not believe in truly good characters, but that is simply not reality. There are thousands of examples of selfless sacrifice. That doesn't mean said people were wholly good and/or without flaws, but there are real heroes on this planet and always have been.

example: since we are often discussing burning, both Vietnamese and Americans self immolated to stop the Vietnam war. I'm sure these people were not perfect, but they were desperate to do something to push back the evil.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

I believe Jon will be back. All the interview stuff is misdirection.

However, there is a bright side to him being dead. If it is the case, I think it's a certainty that the show will have very limited potential to spoil the remaining two books. There is nothing that says that GOT and ASOIAF need to end the same way, even for major character arcs. With Jon out of the picture, it becomes a very different story. And just because it's different doesn't mean it's bad.

Two words: Blade Runner.

[imaGOTbluray]

Season 6 shooting doesn't start until October. 4 months to go.

I thought they start july.

[cade]

.

[Selena]

I think they played this just right..as much as people have fussed about this season most characters are pretty much exactly where they are in the books,even if they got there in a round about way...including Jon laying on the snow bleeding out after being "ceasered" by Thorne and compnay. So yes, they can very easily look the camera (or a reporter) in the eye and say "Jon is dead dead" because at this point that is what the character is for all intents and purposes. ..and as others have said..they HAVE to play it this way..if they show that ending and then 3 days later have Kit talking about preparing for season 6 or D&D talking about thier long term plans for the character people would be like "cool.. didnt think he was dead anyway" and that would have been that. This way they have show viewers AND book readers discussing and theorizing and keeping up the hype and ready to stand in line to buy WoW when it comes out orin front of the TV for season premier so they can KNOW for sure.

and my 2 cents ...... if Jon were REALLY dead..then FTW happens in episode 9 and the fall out/closure from that happens in episode 10..just like the other "big" deaths (Ned, Cat, Robb)

[TRLR]

Here's why I think Jon is still alive. From a storytelling perspective, it doesn't make much sense. Sure, one can say that this is how readers/viewers felt with Ned's beheading and the Red Wedding only to realize that it really did move the plot forward. If this is the case, again, this time then I'm not impressed with George. Think about it. To move the plot along, he kills Ned Stark. This act resulted in the War of the five kings. Okay, fine. I get it. Next, he wants to put an end to the war to, again, keep the plot moving so what does he do? Oh, let's kill more Starks. In fact, let's include most of the Northern bannermen along with them. So here we are again, another turn in the road. The WW walkers are knocking on Westeros's door. Great. Here's an idea, kill another Stark, albeit the bastard but still Stark by blood! It's laughable really. I don't believe GRRM is a bad storyteller at all. He subverts fantasy tropes, sure but he still needs to form a coherent narrative. Jon's death stops the narrative cold. Pun intended. Not to mention so predictable.

[libertylanding]

Game of Thrones season 6 opener hypothesis. The Night's Watch gathers at the Wall. Jon's body lay on the funeral pyre. "And now his Watch is ended," the assembled brothers chant, and touch torches to the oiled wood. The flames rise. Melisandre, looking gaunt and haunted, tears in her eyes (how could she come to understanding so late?) hurls herself onto the pyre, kissing Jon on the lips, passing to him the gift which Thoros of Myr passed six times to Beric Dondarrion, the gift of life, before the flames consume her and she dies screaming. The brothers watch in horror, a horror which intensifies into awe as the figure laid flat on the pyre twitches, then stirs, then rises, and walks from the flames: Jon Snow, unburnt, alive -- released from his vows by the common consent of his brothers and the reality of his death, his parentage now made clear at last: he is the blood of the dragon... and dragons do not burn.

[Katjushka]

GRRM has said elsewhere that when someone comes back they always lose a part of themselves. It's one of the rules of his universe. If he comes back, it won't be as himself. At least not entirely.

But they do seem to remember their missions. TLL remembered to protect the people. LSH remembered to kill some Freys.

Yes, he'll be somewhat different for sure but I think the point is that if he is resurrected soon after his death and only once then he will have lost a smaller part of himself than Beric and Catelyn.

I thought they start july.

I'm pretty sure they start during the summer yes.. Way before october anyway.

And to someone who said that they couldn't have filmed any scenes for season yet as it is not written.. Well they do know where their major characters are going even before they write the episodes so I could have happened.