U.S. Politics - are you born on this board?

[Hayyoth]

 

I'm not saying we're there yet. I'm saying continued demographic changes, left unchecked, could get us there in the future

Yeah I mean I'm not a Trump fan but this is maybe the dumbest criticism yet. Pay for play politics is not about accepting donations it's about accepting donations in return for favors. Whatever else you think of Trump no one believes he's going to advocate policies in return for money.

 

Anyway in brighter news Jeb's campaign is falling apart (yay!)

http://www.newstalkflorida.com/jeb-loses-staff-will-establishment-abandon-next
 

 

Jeb Bush's campaign lost three Florida-based fundraisers on Friday; Kris Money (appropriate name), Trey McCarley, and Debbie Alexander.

 

While the trio will continue to work for a Jeb Bush SuperPAC, conflicting stories emerged over how or why the fundraisers and the campaign split up. One story says the trio quit because of the "campaign personality differences" while another tale says they were "no longer needed".

Bush, once considered GOP frontrunner in the 2016 presidential campaign, continues a massive slide down the polls. Bush averages around 7% in many polls, tied with Florida Senator Marco Rubio, who is also having trouble gaining steam.

 

 

Apparently an enttitled product of corrupt nepotism is not what Republicans want. Dem voters please take note.

[jarl the climber]

 

Why should they care?

 

I mean, other then blatant xenophobia.

Well when Europeans did it to other people they called it colonialism. Granted what we are talking about with immigration is a quite different but I think its not unreasonable to have concerns about large scale somewhat unregulated immigration and the effects that it might have on the culture, economics and politics of the country.  

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Apparently an enttitled product of corrupt nepotism is not what Republicans want. Dem voters please take note.

 

 We should want a loud-mouthed, racist, sexist, silver spoon billionaire with a dead ferret on his or her lid? Fuck that noise. I'll take our entitled product of corrupt nepotism, thank you very much. At least she has held public office.

[ThinkerX]

Re: ThinkerX



I don't think Trump is doing the opening gambit thing. For one, unlike bargaining for goods, voters don't usually forget or forgive that you just call them a rapist. For two, if Trump tracks to the center, he'd be criticized by the staunch rightists and be called a traitor and a sell out, in due time.

Very true...if Trump went the obvious 'tacking to the left' route. But...

...remember the big Republican insistence on 'repealing and replacing Obamacare?' And how the replacement plans, such as they are, look very close to the ACA? (Yet the 'base' remains convinced this is a grand new scheme altogether.) I am wondering if there is not an issue or three that Trump couldn't do something similar with: point at a suitable 'red meat issue,' proclaim it's time for an overhaul, and when the dust settles, Trumps solution, while very loudly proclaimed 'conservative' is actually centrist or leftist.

[Bonesy]

Manhole, you are mis-representing our options as of yet. I plan on refusing to support either Clinton, Trump, or a Republican for as long as I can.

[BloodRider]

You've just posted a justification and apology for an unregulated labor market. Are you planning to vote for Jeb?

Wow.  There is no nuance with you.

 

Anyway, I take it from you lack of criticism of the points made, you now agree that a wall is parinoidiocy,

[The Fallen]

I'm not saying we're there yet. I'm saying continued demographic changes, left unchecked, could get us there in the future

Well when Europeans did it to other people they called it colonialism. Granted what we are talking about with immigration is a quite different but I think its not unreasonable to have concerns about large scale somewhat unregulated immigration and the effects that it might have on the culture, economics and politics of the country.  

It's not about language. It's about skin color. Ramsay said as much. The children of immigrants speak English even if they retain the old tongue of their homeland. And by the time the 3rd generation comes around, they've lost the old tongue altogether. You guys scare easy.

And hey, if the country becomes bilingual then your kids will speak the other language. And don't worry, they won't morph into non-white colored folk.

You can at least take solace in the fact that Spanish is a European (white) language.

[The Fallen]

I don't think he ever claimed that he'd turn down donations. That would be silly

Yeah I mean I'm not a Trump fan but this is maybe the dumbest criticism yet. Pay for play politics is not about accepting donations it's about accepting donations in return for favors. Whatever else you think of Trump no one believes he's going to advocate policies in return for money.

The insinuation by Trump is that he's above the fray because he's so rich that he can't be bought - through donations, as there is no other way to buy a politician. Yet now he's accepting donations, the same as every other politician, but because he's Trump we're supposed to take him at his word that there'll be no strings attached?

[Shryke]

Well when Europeans did it to other people they called it colonialism. Granted what we are talking about with immigration is a quite different but I think its not unreasonable to have concerns about large scale somewhat unregulated immigration and the effects that it might have on the culture, economics and politics of the country.  

 

No. That doesn't even make sense. This situation is nothing like colonialism.

 

I mean, latino illegal immigrants are not seizing american land and administering the area from afar.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Manhole, you are mis-representing our options as of yet. I plan on refusing to support either Clinton, Trump, or a Republican for as long as I can.

 

 Well yeah, I'm not saying I'm voting for Hilary necessarily. I'm just saying I'd vote for her twice before voting Trumplestilkin.

[jarl the climber]

It's not about language. It's about skin color. Ramsay said as much. The children of immigrants speak English even if they retain the old tongue of their homeland. And by the time the 3rd generation comes around, they've lost the old tongue altogether. You guys scare easy.

And hey, if the country becomes bilingual then your kids will speak the other language. And don't worry, they won't morph into non-white colored folk.

You can at least take solace in the fact that Spanish is a European (white) language.

Well I can't speak for Ramsey but it just seems like you people on the the other side of this issue just keep insinuating that if you want to reduce the amount of immigration coming into the country that automatically makes you a paranoid xenophobe, which is ridiculous. 

 

I could really care less about the language issue. I'm sure that just about anyone who is educated in the US is going to be able to speak pretty decent English. As far as the whole race thing goes most people I know from spanish speaking countries more or less consider themselves to be white or European. Maybe they have some Native American blood but from a cultural standpoint they consider themselves to be Western. I'd just like to see the US let fewer immigrants into the country, I don't care where they come from. 

[IamMe90]

Well I can't speak for Ramsey but it just seems like you people on the the other side of this issue just keep insinuating that if you want to reduce the amount of immigration coming into the country that automatically makes you a paranoid xenophobe, which is ridiculous. 

 

I could really care less about the language issue. I'm sure that just about anyone who is educated in the US is going to be able to speak pretty decent English. As far as the whole race thing goes most people I know from spanish speaking countries more or less consider themselves to be white or European. Maybe they have some Native American blood but from a cultural standpoint they consider themselves to be Western. I'd just like to see the US let fewer immigrants into the country, I don't care where they come from. 

 

No, it's because he literally said:

 

 Does anyone want to wake up and realize their neighbors all look and speak different than him?

 

As a reason for why for he wanted to reduce immigration. That's xenophobic on its face. Anything else you're reading into is mere projection. No one has said or insinuated that any person who wants to limit the influx of immigration is racist or xenophobic. 

[ThinkerX]

Ok...

Conservatives complain aliens are sneaking illegally over (the southern) border.
To fix this 'law-breaking' they recommend the implementation of what amounts to a local, totalitarian police state. They seem literally clueless about just how monumentally disruptive it would be to round up millions of people.

Conservatives complain illegal aliens bring disease with them.
Yet Conservatives insist illegal aliens are a drain on the medical system.

Conservatives complain illegal aliens take jobs away from US citizens - yet at the same time insist illegal aliens are lazy freeloaders. Likewise, I have seen many condemnations of illegal aliens in the comments sections of various articles on the topic, yet a near total silence from conservatives on the corporations and wealthy folk who actively hire such. Instead, I see comments along the lines of 'They're successful businessmen, and anybody who speaks against them is a whining failure.'

Conservatives complain illegal aliens do not speak English and are generally poorly educated.
Yet conservatives complain about school systems overwhelmed by non-English speaking students.

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

Yeah I mean I'm not a Trump fan but this is maybe the dumbest criticism yet. Pay for play politics is not about accepting donations it's about accepting donations in return for favors. Whatever else you think of Trump no one believes he's going to advocate policies in return for money.

Instead, he'll just implement policies for himself and his friends that previously would have tried to pay politicians to implement. Cut out the middleman. It's all about efficiency.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vey7GKNpl4Q

 

I find this to be the dumbest point in favor of Trump. That's assuming it's valid. He's clearly a man who takes minor slights seriously and is in a business where he constantly trades favors. Who's to say he won't hand out favors for somebody saving him from having to spend a couple hundred thousand of his own money on a campaign ad? He didn't go from the two comma to the three comma club by giving money away when he didn't need to or by not reciprocating favors.

[lokisnow]

 
No. That doesn't even make sense. This situation is nothing like colonialism.
 
I mean, latino illegal immigrants are not seizing american land and administering the area from afar.

Nah that would be Chinese buying up American property to extract exorbitant rents. It starts benign enough, but forty years from now WHO KNOWS? OUR CITIES COULD BECOME DEFACTO COLONIES WITH ALL THE CASH PUMPED OUT OF COUNTRY LIKE WHITES USED TO PROPERLY DO TO REST OF THE WORLD IN THE GOOD OLD DAYS!

[Ramsay Gimp]

 

As a reason for why for he wanted to reduce immigration. That's xenophobic on its face. Anything else you're reading into is mere projection. No one has said or insinuated that any person who wants to limit the influx of immigration is racist or xenophobic. 

 

:rolleyes:  You guys have a really low bar for "xenophobic."

 

It's not about language. It's about skin color. Ramsay said as much. 

 

Um, no. I briefly mentioned people "looking different" but focused way more on other factors. Education, cultural/political values, economic impact, etc.

 

This faux-outrage from you guys is really tedious. You're denying basic human nature. People prefer to be around other people that are like them. Why do you think new immigrant communities often self-segregate? Acknowledging the obvious doesn't make you a racist xenophobe

[Bonesy]

The man has a point. Not one to base governance upon, but a point.

[Shryke]

 

:rolleyes:  You guys have a really low bar for "xenophobic."

 

 

Um, no. I briefly mentioned people "looking different" but focused way more on other factors. Education, cultural/political values, economic impact, etc.

 

This faux-outrage from you guys is really tedious. You're denying basic human nature. People prefer to be around other people that are like them. Why do you think new immigrant communities often self-segregate? Acknowledging the obvious doesn't make you a racist xenophobe

 

We don't have a low bar for xenophobia, we have the basic definition.

 

You literally said you don't want people who look and talk different then you around.

[MerenthaClone]

 

This faux-outrage from you guys is really tedious. You're denying basic human nature. People prefer to be around other people that are like them. Why do you think new immigrant communities often self-segregate? Acknowledging the obvious doesn't make you a racist xenophobe

How much of that is "self" segregation and how much is constant slight social pressure is difficult to discern, but an obvious factor would be language.  I would guess that fluent English-speaking immigrants would self-segregate less in the US than those that do not.  I would also guess, though it is impossible to prove, that if there was an area where everyone spoke fluent Mandarin in addition to English that native Mandarin-speaking immigrants would self-segregate less compared to areas without that fluent Mandarin population.  

 

Acknowledging the obvious might not make you a xenophobe (this is debateable) but supporting policy decisions regarding immigration is a completely different ballgame.  

[Bonesy]

And your point has been addressed. In plain English.