Jump to content

Question about "dragon has three heads"

purple-eyes

By purple-eyes,
in General (ASoIaF)

Recommended Posts

Drogonthedread Council Member

Drogonthedread

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Well, assuming Jon Snow is the Trueborn son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark, he could be this "dragon," and since his is the song of ice and fire, he would seem to be the principal protagonist, with Daenerys set up by Daenerys to be the red herring. At least she'll be able to add a little lemon juice, but that might not be such a good thing...

The George apparently forgot to change her dialect several chapters later, but I dont think he forgot to remove the lemon tree. I think he transplanted it. The George obviously had a reason for putting that lemon tree outside Daenerys's window, since he left it there after he moved her backstory to Braavos.

But what was the purpose of the lemon tree? Well, Im glad you asked . . . You see, the lemon, of course, is defined by its yellow color and sour taste. In addition to its use as food and drink, lemons can be used to clean. After a brief review of the use of lemons in art and literature, my understanding is that the lemon symbolizes bitterness and disappointment.(Exhibit A would be the Lemon Tree, the Israeli film from 2008, in which a Palestinian attempts to stop her neighbor, who happens to be the Israeli Defense Minister, from destroying the family's lemon grove.

 

Hidden Content

 

The lemon is also used to symbolize power. The fruit appears to have originated in South Asia. Although they were known in Ancient Rome, they were not widely known in Europe until the tenth century. The first significant cultivation of lemons in Europe did not happen until the very end of the Middle Ages. Since they had to be imported to medieval Europe, lemons became associated with wealth and power. This symbolism of wealth and power seems to have been The George's intention when he had

 

Hidden Content

 

Fans of Sansa who think her weakness for lemon cakes is a symbol of her innocence and purity should take note and be wary. They might be comforted at least to note that within the Church, the lemon is considered a symbol of fidelity. But I believe The George included the lemon tree to foreshadow Daenerys's ultimate bitterness and disappointment. 

When we see lemons, things don't usually end well... In Sansa I, Game 15, she was looking forward to lemon cakes in the queen's wheelhouse, but her day ended with her prince's loathing and contempt. Samwell's early childhood went from snitching lemon cakes to contempt, abuse, and banishment by his father. In Sansa II, Game 29, Sansa went from enjoying lemon cakes with Joffrey at the feast following the first day of jousting to being escorted back to her cell by the Hound. In Sansa III, Game 44, Sansa and Jeyne (poor Jeyne) looked for lemon cakes in the kitchen, but at the end of the chapter learned her father was sending back to Winterfell. Sansa shared lemon cakes with the Tyrells before being forced to wed the imp. Before donning the ugly little girl's face, the kindly man gave a girl a drink so tart it was like biting into lemon. That made "no one" think of Arya's sister, and Sansa's fondness for lemon cakes.

In Arya V, Game 65, Arya offered to trade a fat pigeon for a lemon, but ened up at her father's execution. Jeor Mormont drank lemon in his beer every day. He still had his own teeth but his men mutinied and murdered him. At Bitterbridge, Renly's bannermen feasted on lemon cakes. Of course, Renly's campaign ened shortly thereafter. As Davos sailed with Stannis's fleet into Blackwater Bay, he observed Aegon's High Hill, dark against a lemon sky. That's an odd description for a sky, no? As Davos turned downstream, the mouth of the Blackwater Rush had turned into the mouth of hell.

At Edmure's wedding feast Catelyn noted that Ryman Frey had bathed in lemon water but failed to mask his sour sweat, and that Roose smelled sweeter but no more pleasant. The Feast did not end on a happy note. At Joffrey's wedding feast Tyrion had a slice of pigeon pie covered with a spoon of lemon cream. A few paragraphs later he stood accused of regicide. Cersei drank lemon water so tart she had to spit it out the morning she learned that Tyrion had murdered their father.

Lem Lemoncloak just reeks of bitterness and disappointment, and I am glad I'm not associated with House Dalt of Lemonwood. Doran's Water Gardens smell of lemons and blood oranges. Anybody think Dorne is going end up happy with their blood and fire? In The Queenmaker, Arianne noticed that Darkstar preferred lemon water to summer wine, and she served lemonsweet to Myrcella before Darkstar cut off Myrcella's ear amidst lemon orchards watered by a spider's web of old canals.

Stannis enjoys boiled eggs and lemon water for breakfast, and, well, I think we all know his end will be bitter and disappointing. In Jon IV, Dance 17, Stannis offers lemon water to Jon. Wisely, Jon refuses. Stannis drinks more.

The merry band aboard the Shy Maid enjoy a pike with lemon juice, but come on, who doesn't eat Pike without lemon, and Ysilla was from Dorne. Still, I woulda passed. Tyrion suspected Yezzan was drinking lemon water as the yellow whale bid on him and Penny. Tyrion served Nurse lemonsweet with the mushrooms from Illyrio's garden.The Green Grace accepted a goblet of sweetened lemon juice from the Queen's Hand. 

Oh, and dig this... Daenerys's terrace in Mereen had lemon trees... Go figure.

 

 

I believe lemon tree and red door is there for a reason too ...that dany will eventually come to realize that there will be no red door as she imagines and die with the bitter truth ...

But  how exactly that makes her  red herring I don't know ...why bother spending so much time and clues on some red herring ..

No jon can't be a dragon he is only half targ ..

Let me ask this in what way dany is less important or less of a character than Jon in this story to make her as red herring

The author as set up a red herring real one in the story ....but then out of a blue he comes up with another one hey the one you think real is not the real one ...here he is the one ...

A red herring for the universe and red herring for the readers ..Seems like only wishful thinking of fans of certain character ....even if Jon comes to fulfill any part of theories in the coming books...then it must mean there is two chosen one ...not one and another as red herring ..one cant just brush aside and refute the clues and foreshadowings of five books just as red herring

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Lost Melnibonean Council Member

Lost Melnibonean

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Drogonthedread said:

 

 

I believe lemon tree and red door is there for a reason too ...that dany will eventually come to realize that there will be no red door as she imagines and die with the bitter truth ...

But  how exactly that makes her  red herring I don't know ...why bother spending so much time and clues on some red herring ..

No jon can't be a dragon he is only half targ ..

Let me ask this in what way dany is less important or less of a character than Jon in this story to make her as red herring

 

At this point in the story, I don't  think we can sy she is less important than Jon. But consider the original structure that the George envisioned, a trilogy, with the second part being a "dance" of dragons and the third part being the culminating war against the others. I don't see Jon playing much of a role in the "dance," but I do see him playing the leading role in the war for the dawn. Daenerys on the other hand is clearly the protagonist in the "dance," so, the only question I have is weather she will fight along side Jon Snow against the others. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Drogonthedread Council Member

Drogonthedread

Posted
Posted
40 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

At this point in the story, I don't  think we can sy she is less important than Jon. But consider the original structure that the George envisioned, a trilogy, with the second part being a "dance" of dragons and the third part being the culminating war against the others. I don't see Jon playing much of a role in the "dance," but I do see him playing the leading role in the war for the dawn. Daenerys on the other hand is clearly the protagonist in the "dance," so, the only question I have is weather she will fight along side Jon Snow against the others. 

And he goes on to mention that this series is actually a coming of age for this five characters... Daenerys included ...

With the HoTU and its blue corrupted heart and her dream and the overall story feeling of her having a destiny ..

And how much its said and talked about dragons coming back and dragons born again and dragons needed at the Wall and other things ...and also show's HOTU where dany goes to Wall ..

Iam pretty sure she will be leading along side Jon 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
El Guapo Council Member

El Guapo

Posted
Posted
25 minutes ago, Drogonthedread said:

And he goes on to mention that this series is actually a coming of age for this five characters... Daenerys included ...

With the HoTU and its blue corrupted heart and her dream and the overall story feeling of her having a destiny ..

And how much its said and talked about dragons coming back and dragons born again and dragons needed at the Wall and other things ...and also show's HOTU where dany goes to Wall ..

Iam pretty sure she will be leading along side Jon 

Yeah I agree with that. In addition to Jon wishing he had a dragon or three at the wall to help with the fight against the others there is also Tyrion's talk with Aegon where he mentions that Dany is above all a "rescuer" who would never abandon her brother's son in his "time of peril".  Now Tyrion is talking about Aegon in this situation  but I think GRRM is referring to Jon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dorian Martell Council Member

Dorian Martell

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, Drogonthedread said:

There is alos born amidst salt and smoke ..

I believe we will get answers in the next book too not only AAR and TPWTWP but TSWMTW will also be connected to one other and revealed as one ...looking forward to marwyn ...

If anything the show which has not done prophecies so far seem to use the term" the one who was promised " coming season which i believe is clear indication that they three are one and same 

I hope george survives to finish the series. then we will know at least a few things 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
StarkofWinterfell Council Member

StarkofWinterfell

Posted
Posted
On February 1, 2016 at 0:32 AM, Heavy D said:

Correct.  Dany's situation with her three dragon children is indeed unique.   Drogon is the alpha, the lead dragon.  Viserion and Rhaegal can simply follow his lead.  An additional two riders are not needed. 

I don't think this is the case at all. We don't know much about dragon culture and whether they operated in packs like wolves, therefore it's incorrect to call Drogon the "alpha" while saying Vision and Rhaegal will simply tag along.

What we do know is that Drogon is the more independent of the dragons and that the other two have been imprisoned. The three might not be reunited for some time so this whole "pack" thing is false.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Lost Melnibonean Council Member

Lost Melnibonean

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, El Guapo said:

Yeah I agree with that. In addition to Jon wishing he had a dragon or three at the wall to help with the fight against the others there is also Tyrion's talk with Aegon where he mentions that Dany is above all a "rescuer" who would never abandon her brother's son in his "time of peril".  Now Tyrion is talking about Aegon in this situation  but I think GRRM is referring to Jon.

That's interesting. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Wm Portnoy Hedge Knight

Wm Portnoy

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

At this point in the story, I don't  think we can sy she is less important than Jon. But consider the original structure that the George envisioned, a trilogy, with the second part being a "dance" of dragons and the third part being the culminating war against the others. I don't see Jon playing much of a role in the "dance," but I do see him playing the leading role in the war for the dawn. Daenerys on the other hand is clearly the protagonist in the "dance," so, the only question I have is weather she will fight along side Jon Snow against the others. 

Jon could just as easily turn coat and join the White Walkers.  Some people believe he becomes the new Night King.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...