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Tana Snow

Did Edmure do the right thing?

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Do you think Edmure did the right thing by yielding Riverrun thus ensuring the safety of his people, or was it a selfish decision to save his son?

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2 minutes ago, Tana Snow said:

Do you think Edmure did the right thing by yielding Riverrun, ensuring the safety of his people, or did he betray his own house by giving up his ancestral seat to his enemies and indirectly causing his uncle's death?

He betrayed them, but he did it for essentially selfish reasons anyway, no matter if it was a good thing or not. Then again Blackfish was behaving selfishly as well. It didn't really matter at that point, Riverrun was already lost.

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Blackfish should have taken Jamie and Briene first offer. He would have helped the Starks and if he choose to continue the war he would have the whole North at his back.

Edmure did right to save his people life, and  the life of his family. And Blackfish has no thought about anything than a heroic last stand.

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1 hour ago, Bogdan said:

Blackfish should have taken Jamie and Briene first offer. He would have helped the Starks and if he choose to continue the war he would have the whole North at his back.

Edmure did right to save his people life, and  the life of his family. And Blackfish has no thought about anything than a heroic last stand.

I agree. Edmure martyring himself and his family would not have achieved much.

Blackfish and Tully men could have helped in the North and then the North could have helped the Riverlands in return. You're going to need a Northern army to seige The Twins from that side in order to bring the Freys to heel.

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2 hours ago, Bogdan said:

Blackfish should have taken Jamie and Briene first offer. He would have helped the Starks and if he choose to continue the war he would have the whole North at his back.

Edmure did right to save his people life, and  the life of his family. And Blackfish has no thought about anything than a heroic last stand.

SHOULD SHOULD SHOULD.

Its not as if people are huge logic machines is it. Both of those characters acted selfishly in their own interests, not really all that bothered about anyone else. 

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Whether he was right or not depends on what he's trying to accomplish. He was trying to save himself, his son & his people. From that standpoint he could have done nothing else.

The Blackfish forced his hand. Were I the Blackfish, I'd have taken Brienne's deal, then returned to Riverrun later with the the support of the King In The North. That prob'ly wouldn't actually happen, but of course Blackfish couldn't have known to allow for future White Walker entanglement.

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Yeah, I feel like for the most part he did, depending on what's going to happen to the rest of his men. If they are allowed to leave and disperse (while giving up their arms) then he definetly did the right thing IMO. If they are going to be taken prisoner then he should of negotiated a better deal with Jaime prior. 

BF was to be taken prisoner, but even in the original deal with Jaime and the BF, Jaime told him he'd let his men go, implying he wouldn't let the BF go. Obviously Brienne got the best deal, let them all go North, including the BF, and keep their arms.

BF took the easy way out IMO. It would of been much harder to leave and help his family in the North, rather than make 1 more heroic last stand.

What was Edmure supposed to do? The Lannisters / Freys weren't going to siege the castle for 2 years like the BF thought, Jaime makes that clear. They don't have the men told hold it for long, is he supposed to let every man in the castle die + is baby child die just to protect something that he is destined to lose, when he can give it up, let the army disperse, and give them instructions to go North and regroup? That way they at least have a chance to retake it in the future.

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I wish the BF would have taken Jaime's original offer of allowing them passage up North to help Sansa but then I remembered what show I was watching where nice endings hardly ever happen. Instead we get Edmure looking like a chump to his men and BF supposedly dying offscreen. Well, at least Brienne and Pod got away with Jaime wistfully waving them off.

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4 hours ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

He betrayed them, but he did it for essentially selfish reasons anyway, no matter if it was a good thing or not. Then again Blackfish was behaving selfishly as well. It didn't really matter at that point, Riverrun was already lost.

Both of them lived up to the tully words....Screw Family, Duty and Honor. Much like Jamie and Cersei have, in forgetting Marcella, proved that Lannisters Don't Pay their Debt and the Northern Houses have shown that the North Forgets. This is all on the heels of the absence of the Iron Bank because, as we know, they never get their due and Euron having trees harvested on Pyke because, ya know, They Sow. While we are at it, everyone is living up to their names. Notice how the Tarly's, other than showing up for a pre war Tourney before Renly was killed, totally avoided the war of the 5 kings....you know, because last to fight. I suppose it all makes sense in the wake of the total dumping of the dornish plot and the ending of the martell line...because, ya know, bowed, bent and broken.

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The Blackfish had been given something to fight for, family in Sansa etc. He believed Brienne was telling the truth but then again, why would he believe Jamie Lannister and the Freys?  Edmure having affection for his supposed son he has never seen, conceived on his one night with a Frey bride who was "in on the slaughter" of his family, under the protection of Guest Rights at the Red Wedding. So, will Jaime send those Tully troops North to fight for Sansa? No, those men will probably be slaughtered anyway once the Lannisters leave the Riverlands, if they leave the Riverlands. Edmure is a fool and the men inside Riverrun, for them to disobey the Blackfish, only to be betrayed by Edmure must be feeling pretty damn stupid, especially when they learn of the Blackfish's death.

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23 minutes ago, Ludo Kressh said:

I wish the BF would have taken Jaime's original offer of allowing them passage up North to help Sansa but then I remembered what show I was watching where nice endings hardly ever happen. Instead we get Edmure looking like a chump to his men and BF supposedly dying offscreen. Well, at least Brienne and Pod got away with Jaime wistfully waving them off.

Yeah, that would of been good knowing the ending, but I believe Jaime's original offer was just to let his men go, not actually the BF though, he would be taken prisoner (Jaime's deal with the BF, not his deal with Brienne).

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5 minutes ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

The Blackfish had been given something to fight for, family in Sansa etc. He believed Brienne was telling the truth but then again, why would he believe Jamie Lannister and the Freys?  Edmure having affection for his supposed son he has never seen, conceived on his one night with a Frey bride who was "in on the slaughter" of his family, under the protection of Guest Rights at the Red Wedding. So, will Jaime send those Tully troops North to fight for Sansa? No, those men will probably be slaughtered anyway once the Lannisters leave the Riverlands, if they leave the Riverlands. Edmure is a fool and the men inside Riverrun, for them to disobey the Blackfish, only to be betrayed by Edmure must be feeling pretty damn stupid, especially when they learn of the Blackfish's death.

Of course Edmure has affection and love for his supposed son, most people would, definitely Edmure given what we've learned about him and his need to protect the smallfolk even at their own detriment at times.

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9 minutes ago, The Dames do Moan said:

Of course Edmure has affection and love for his supposed son, most people would, definitely Edmure given what we've learned about him and his need to protect the smallfolk even at their own detriment at times.

I understand Edmure has been locked up for 2-3 years so, he is a bit weaker than he already was before this huge betrayal . Edmure took the word of a liar and is placing what faith he has left in the hands of one of the biggest traitors in Westeros history. Jamie Lannister, brother and lover to Cersei, father to her 3 bastards.

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Whats really gonna hurt is when they deliver Roslin and its not the same girl. They substitute her for one of Walder's more hideous daughters so they can marry the pretty one off to someone else. The kid will not even be from Brutus, it will be an incest bastard fathered by one of Walder's sons. This is no less than I would expect from Walder Frey.

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37 minutes ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

I understand Edmure has been locked up for 2-3 years so, he is a bit weaker than he already was before this huge betrayal . Edmure took the word of a liar and is placing what faith he has left in the hands of one of the biggest traitors in Westeros history. Jamie Lannister, brother and lover to Cersei, father to her 3 bastards.

We'll have to agree to disagree then, u see it as a betrayal and I see it as doing what's best for his people and the "Tullys" in general. Whether that was his son or not. To each their own though.

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33 minutes ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

Since when was Edmure anything other than a weak man?

He leaves RiverRun to attack the Lannisters in open field, even though he very easily could have avoided conflict, as that's what he was told to do? That's not weak, it may be stupid and may have cost them the war, but its the opposite of weak.

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The Tully motto is "FAMILY. DUTY. HONOR". 

Blackfish said "eff family and duty", basically, in favor of some dumb suicide death. 

Edmure on the other hand, I guess you can say, put his family first? Even though he's never met his son / saw his wife once on his wedding night? 

I'm not so sure Edmure did the right thing so much as it was pretty much the only move he had to make. 

It just felt very unbelievable and unrealistic to expect Edmure to crack and give in to Jaime at an empty threat against a child he's ever met and likely to never see again. 

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