Rory Snow Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 The Vale fought for the Starks and against the Iron Throne appointed Warden of the North. The Vale stood and declared for Jon Snow as King in the North. So what does that mean for the Vale exactly? They have clearly separated themselves from the Lannisters and the Iron Throne, but it's not geographically part of the North which makes it less clear than say the Manderley's in White Harbor or any of the other lords present at the 'crowning'. Has the Vale taken Jon as their King? Are they now an independent state simply at peace and aligned with the North? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Snow Posted June 27, 2016 Author Share Posted June 27, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 Well I'm not sure they are really in violation of the throne yet. LF was ordered to remove the Boltons and place himself in command. LF is still there with the largest army, if he leaves without Sansa's head he will be in violation. I think it's clear that he now see's Jon as a threat since he wants the Iron Throne and Jon has been declared kitn. LF is really the only piece left that we don't know exactly where he stands. Jon will just be fortifying the north, Danaerys will be landing in Westeros and has the Reach and Dorne. Cersei rules Kings Landing, and the Riverlands are seemingly free of any real leadership(how many Freys are still alive? Is Edmure free? The scene was very confusing) LF marrying Sansa right now could propel him to the Iron Throne if it was not for Danaerys. He also still has the offer of seating Sansa in Riverrun now that Jon has Winterfel. Overall I am not sure what his next move will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goomba Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 You know, whats funny is i don't think Littlefinger has factored Daeny and her Dragons into the equation. You raise some good points Rory Snow and it seems Littlefinger is going to have to make some adjustments to his plan :3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Null Infinity Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 I asked the same question in other thread, basically we've reached a point where geography will not play any role, it's time for alliances, it's a matter of life or death now : it's a mirroring to what happened in Robert's rebellion it's a mirroring to the alliance dany + greyjoys + tyrells + martells Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Snow Posted June 27, 2016 Author Share Posted June 27, 2016 15 minutes ago, aryagonnakill#2 said: LF marrying Sansa right now could propel him to the Iron Throne if it was not for Danaerys. He also still has the offer of seating Sansa in Riverrun now that Jon has Winterfel. Overall I am not sure what his next move will be. Does Jon have Winterfell? King in the North would seem to be a different title and set of responsibilities from Lord or Lady of Winterfell. Jon seems more than happy to let Sansa have the castle. Not sure he wants to Lord over anybody. His concern is building an alliance to fight the WW. 14 minutes ago, Future Null Infinity said: it's a mirroring to what happened in Robert's rebellion it's a mirroring to the alliance dany + greyjoys + tyrells + martells Interesting.. I hadn't drawn that parallel. I find it odd that Baelish's strong point has always been his access to information yet he seems to have not accounted for Dany at all. When all becomes clear, and given that Sansa turned him away, does Pinkie now throw in with his old co-conspirator Lady Olenna and join Dany? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 1 minute ago, Rory Snow said: Does Jon have Winterfell? Kinr in the North would seem to be a different title and set of responsibilities from Lord or Lady of Winterfell. Jon seems more than happy to let Sansa have the castle. Not sure he wants to Lord over anybody. Hiw concern is building an alliance to fight the WW. Interesting.. I hadn't drawn that parallel. I find it odd that Baelish's strong point has always been his access to information yet he seems to have not accounted for Dany at all. When all becomes clear, and given that Sansa turned him away, does Pinkie now throw in with his old co-conspirator Lady Olenna and join Dany? KITN as the son of Ned Stark comes with WF. Now whether he will stay in that position or not remains to be seen, but WF is definitely his as far as the north in concerned. Now that I think about it, all those northern lords probably brought men at arms to the castle as well, so while LF still probably has the most men, he may have missed his chance to just murder everyone and take Sansa without a fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Null Infinity Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, Rory Snow said: Interesting.. I hadn't drawn that parallel. I find it odd that Baelish's strong point has always been his access to information yet he seems to have not accounted for Dany at all. When all becomes clear, and given that Sansa turned him away, does Pinkie now throw in with his old co-conspirator Lady Olenna and join Dany? I don't think his story is that he will join danny, The vale is now with Jon the KitN and he have nothing to offer to Danny, Sandor will come to Winterfell and he will say everything to Jon and Sansa, his chances to take the iron throne are too low Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Snow Posted June 27, 2016 Author Share Posted June 27, 2016 4 minutes ago, aryagonnakill#2 said: so while LF still probably has the most men, he may have missed his chance to just murder everyone and take Sansa without a fight. Yup, that ship has sailed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Spider Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 29 minutes ago, aryagonnakill#2 said: Well I'm not sure they are really in violation of the throne yet. LF was ordered to remove the Boltons and place himself in command. LF is still there with the largest army, if he leaves without Sansa's head he will be in violation. I think it's clear that he now see's Jon as a threat since he wants the Iron Throne and Jon has been declared kitn. LF is really the only piece left that we don't know exactly where he stands. Jon will just be fortifying the north, Danaerys will be landing in Westeros and has the Reach and Dorne. Cersei rules Kings Landing, and the Riverlands are seemingly free of any real leadership(how many Freys are still alive? Is Edmure free? The scene was very confusing) LF marrying Sansa right now could propel him to the Iron Throne if it was not for Danaerys. He also still has the offer of seating Sansa in Riverrun now that Jon has Winterfel. Overall I am not sure what his next move will be. I am not so sure that is the case at all. I cannot see Dany aligning with Ollena or The Sand Snakes. Was there any mention of Dany and her dragons in that conversation? Don't you find that odd? I think a more likely scenario is Vary's was setting them both up, have the Reach and Dorne invade the Freys and Lannisters, and then Dany mops up what is left. I mean, if not. what's the point? Dany will arrive with her horde and no one to fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Spider Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 Littlefingers days are numbered. Someone should start a thread guessing in which episode he will die and by whom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 3 hours ago, Ice Spider said: I am not so sure that is the case at all. I cannot see Dany aligning with Ollena or The Sand Snakes. Was there any mention of Dany and her dragons in that conversation? Don't you find that odd? I think a more likely scenario is Vary's was setting them both up, have the Reach and Dorne invade the Freys and Lannisters, and then Dany mops up what is left. I mean, if not. what's the point? Dany will arrive with her horde and no one to fight. Ya there was... Fire and Blood are the words of house Targaryen, thats why he was there. He was also in the final scene along with ships baring Dornes symbol. We are suppose to assume time has past and Olenna was there knowing her house had been wiped out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
permaximum Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 If you mean Jon's King in The North elections, this means nothing for the Vale. As for the outcome of the battle, it means now Lord Baelish and the Vale are enemies of the crown. However, crown means nothing as the North, the Vale and the Riverlands are allies just like the Dorne and the Highgarden and just like the Greyjoys and Daenerys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfgangII Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 Littlefinger said he would declare for House Stark, so he is currently at odds with the Crown. Given that, according with Stark narration, the Lannisters killed the last Lord of the Vale (Jon Arryn), its probable the Vale would not recognize Cercei as their Queen. But I don't know if they would choose to be annexed to the Kingdom in the North (which would be historically histerically) or they would remain as a separate ally kingdom (does this mean Sweetrobin is now king?). Or maybe they would support King Jon "in the wars to come" and they deal with their legal status later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Snow Posted June 28, 2016 Author Share Posted June 28, 2016 4 hours ago, permaximum said: If you mean Jon's King in The North elections, this means nothing for the Vale. As for the outcome of the battle, it means now Lord Baelish and the Vale are enemies of the crown. However, crown means nothing as the North, the Vale and the Riverlands are allies just like the Dorne and the Highgarden and just like the Greyjoys and Daenerys. So if the Vale doesn't recognize Jon as their King, and it doesn't recognize Cersei as their Queen, are they now an independent nation? Does Baelish start calling himself King of the Vale? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Spider Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 4 hours ago, aryagonnakill#2 said: Ya there was... Fire and Blood are the words of house Targaryen, thats why he was there. He was also in the final scene along with ships baring Dornes symbol. We are suppose to assume time has past and Olenna was there knowing her house had been wiped out. Which only means Vary's sold them a bill of goods to further his plan, maybe get a few ships for free, nothing more. What happens when Dany and Tyrion learn of what the SS did to Myrcella? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonSnow4President Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 Vale lords were among those cheering KITN, so it appears they are supposed to be rebelling now, but honestly, who the f*** knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Knight of Flours Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 8 minutes ago, Ice Spider said: What happens when Dany and Tyrion learn of what the SS did to Myrcella? Perhaps Tyrion can explain to Dany why she should care about the death of a usurper's child, born of incest? (The usurper being Cersei not Robbert) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Spider Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 10 minutes ago, The Knight of Flours said: Perhaps Tyrion can explain to Dany why she should care about the death of a usurper's child, born of incest? (The usurper being Cersei not Robbert) Because it was a child. is that so hard to comprehend? Ad the slave children hung on the cross's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
permaximum Posted June 28, 2016 Share Posted June 28, 2016 2 hours ago, Rory Snow said: So if the Vale doesn't recognize Jon as their King, and it doesn't recognize Cersei as their Queen, are they now an independent nation? Does Baelish start calling himself King of the Vale? Why would they recognize Jon as their King? The North and the Vale are different dominions and they are two of the seven kingdoms. The North has been ruled by Starks and The Vale has been ruled by Arryns... There's one independent Lord of The Vale now but as the Lord Protector and the Regent of Robin, Lord Baelish said they're allies with the Starks thus the North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.