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Lord Varys

FIRE AND BLOOD Volume 1

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31 minutes ago, Bael's Bastard said:

The first volume is going to cover the full reigns of at least six kings (Aegon I, Aenys I, Maegor I, Jaehaerys I, Viserys I, Aegon II), Rhaenyra, and at least the regency of Aegon III.

Even if it only covers the regency of Aegon III, that would cover about 136 out of 283 years, leaving 147 years for the rest of the Targaryen kings.

If it covers the whole reign of Aegon III it will cover 157 out of 283 years, leaving 126 years for the rest of the Targaryen kings.

Remember that of the 10 Targaryen kings after Aegon III, three of them combined for less than 10 years (Daeron I, Viserys II, Jaehaerys II), so the fact that there will be more kings covered in the second volume does not mean that it covers a significantly longer span of time than the first.

Maybe but consider also that in that time Daeron I conquered Dorne and Jaehaerys II waged the War of the Ninepenny Kings. Not to mention, Aenys and Maegor together ruled little over a decade but consider how much GRRM wrote for them. To me, a Volume 2 covering the rest of the Dragonbane's reign, the Conquest of Dorne and its undoing, Baelor's slow descent into mad zealotry, Viserys II's reforms, and the gradual corruption of Aegon IV sounds big enough already if what GRRM has written for just Volume 1 is any indication.

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Beyond that, three volumes would be more thematically consistent IMO.

Volume 1: Conquest to regency

Volume 2: Aftermath and the following generation

Volume 3: The unification of the Seven Kingdoms and the Blackfyre Rebellions, which ended with the ousting of the Targaryens in favor of the Baratheons.

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I could see George having the second volume only cover the remainder of the reign of Aegon III (or beginning with the reign of the Young Dragon) up to death of Daeron the Good. Afterwards we have the Dunk & Egg stories and I certainly would like to see the reigns of Aerys I to Aegon V covered in that format because we get a broader overview with FIRE AND BLOOD.

But a detailed account of the Young Dragon, Baelor the Blessed, Viserys II, the Unworthy, and the Good King with the First Blackfyre Rebellion could certainly fill another book if we assume that Gyldayn would use the opportunity to write a history of the Targaryen to also write a detailed history of the Conquest of Dorne, and the First Blackfyre Rebellion, not to mention Baelor's walk and his later exploits, all the affairs of Aegon the Unworthy, the heroics of the Dragonknight, the bastards of Aegon IV (and not just the Great Bastards we already know about), and the details of the union with Dorne and the Iron Throne.

And a very detailed and lively picture of Baelor, Aerys, Rhaegel, and Maekar prior to the tourney of Ashford (not to mention other import players of that era) could be a very interesting prelude for the Dunk & Egg series.

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If he intends to cover the first 136-157 years of the Iron Throne in one volume, I really don't see why it would be necessary to cover the balance of 126-147 years in more than one volume. Obviously he hasn't fleshed out some of these reigns, like Maekar's, as he has the earlier reigns. I guess it will work itself out when he writes those stories. Still not clear on whether these are supposed to be more like a real book, or if they are going be more oversized books. Give me hundreds more pages of words over a few hundred pages with illustrations, personally.

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1 hour ago, Bael's Bastard said:

If he intends to cover the first 136-157 years of the Iron Throne in one volume, I really don't see why it would be necessary to cover the balance of 126-147 years in more than one volume. Obviously he hasn't fleshed out some of these reigns, like Maekar's, as he has the earlier reigns. I guess it will work itself out when he writes those stories. Still not clear on whether these are supposed to be more like a real book, or if they are going be more oversized books. Give me hundreds more pages of words over a few hundred pages with illustrations, personally.

Sure, that would be my view as well. I'd like those medieval-style illuminations of the royal families I mentioned above but I really don't need that kind of stuff. The text is the text, never mind the format.

There seems to be a tendency - as usually with Martin - to make things more detailed as he goes along. The Conquest, Aegon, and his sons are relatively short accounts, Viserys I, the Dance, and the Regency much larger, essentially sort of outlines for novels in their own right. TSotD basically focus on the events at court and puts everything in relation to things Aenys, Aegon, Visenya, and Maegor do. But TRP and TPatQ really paint a bigger picture. Entire sections of 'The Death of the Dragons' should focus on the deeds and campaigns of some generals, just as the Regency account later on focus even more on the regents, Hands, and other courtiers. Alyn Velaryon, Baela, Rhaena, and especially Prince Viserys should also play important roles but the real powers of those era should be likes of Unwin Peake, Grand Maester Munkun, Thaddeus Rowan, Tyland Lannister, the Rogares, etc.

And thinking about that, I really want to see what Aegon III and Viserys later did to Unwin Peake and his ilk. I cannot help it, I want that man to have burned. The murder of Queen Jaehaera is perhaps the worst crime depicted in TWoIaF (immediately followed by Blood and Cheese and the the murder of Merry Meg). This man cannot have gotten away with that in the long run. That is part of the reason why I'd like to have the entire account of the reign of Aegon III in that book.

If that tendency continues the Conquest of Dorne and the reigns of Baelor the Blessed, Aegon the Unworthy, and Daeron the Good could get much longer, and we could get a real feeling of the vast history of the Seven Kingdoms. I really hope for something of that sort for Jaehaerys I. I want to know what made him so great and how he, Alysanne, and Barth really changed their lives of their subjects. With more detail we could really get a picture on the legal landscape prior and after the unification of the laws. That could really help understanding what rights (if any) the smallfolk has in the main series, etc.

And it would also make somewhat more sense if Gyldayn's account got more detailed the closer it got to his own sources. He could consult primary sources on the reigns of the later kings and would not be forced to write his account my citing other historians citing primary sources (like he does with Orwyle being cited by Munkun).

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18 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

@The Weirwoods Eyes

You seem to want to see the black hair as proof that Alys Rivers must be a Blackwood. But it isn't as you well know. The fact that you may have the same hair and eyes as I do doesn't mean we have to be related. And there are quite a few other prominent black-haired people and families in this world, most notably the Baratheons.

The name Alys is used over and over again in that series. We have Alys Harroway, Alys Arryn (the wife of Rhaegel Targaryen), Alys Arryn (the sister of Jon Arryn), Alys Karstark, Alys Beesbury, Alys Frey, and Alys Rivers.

The name Alys doesn't refer to Alysanne Blackwood. It may be shortened version of Alysanne or Alyssa.

The Strongs are actually a rather interesting and prominent house up until the line dies out. They are an ancient First Men line from the Riverlands, and we have Ser Osmund Strong as Hand under the Conqueror, Lord Lyonel Strong as Master of Laws and Hand under Viserys I, and the Harwin and Larys (and Lucamore the Lusty during the reign of Jaehaerys I).

I never said R'hllor exists and sends visions. I said that we only know that red priests can see or teach people to see visions in the flames. That's some sort of magical craft you have to learn, and nothing indicates that the average person can do that. Bloodraven and Melisandre both seem to have an innate talent for magic but they had to learn this whole thing, just as Mirri Maz Duur and Qyburn had, and Bran still does. In that sense it would be very odd to assume Alys Rivers was some sort of professional sorceress or seer. I'm not denying the possibility that she could have prophetic dreams but that's not what Aemond says. He says Alys saw Daemon pretty much everywhere when it was hardly a secret where he was going.

As to the Blackwood-Stark-Targaryen connection: There are hints that there are additional marriages between the Blackwoods and the Starks in the past. Who knows? Perhaps Bloodraven had magical abilities because of his Stark (or Targaryen) ancestry? We don't know.

I won't argue with you anymore. I'm pretty confident in what I have put forth. 

We shall see, hopefully in Fire & Blood if she is significant, if her child matters, and what bloodline she was from.  

  

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1 hour ago, The Weirwoods Eyes said:

I won't argue with you anymore. I'm pretty confident in what I have put forth. 

We shall see, hopefully in Fire & Blood if she is significant, if her child matters, and what bloodline she was from.

The child is not likely to matter if the book only covers the Regency of Aegon III. The child should only be 5-6 years old at that time. And also keep in mind that there is most likely no secret or conscious hint-dropping in the original 'The Death of the Dragons' text. It should cover the first meeting of Alys and Aemond, after all. TPatQ is a severely abridged version of the story.

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20 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

The child is not likely to matter if the book only covers the Regency of Aegon III. The child should only be 5-6 years old at that time. And also keep in mind that there is most likely no secret or conscious hint-dropping in the original 'The Death of the Dragons' text. It should cover the first meeting of Alys and Aemond, after all. TPatQ is a severely abridged version of the story.

I am hoping that it does cover their first meeting and that we learn some more about her. As to their child. I was meaning long term significance. Such as meeting a descendant, later on, like in a D&E story maybe. Or just simply that the mixture of their blood is significant. Which could have repercussions later on for Dany & Jon who are both carrying a mixture of FM and Targ blood. 

I've wondered if she sought him out as a sexual partner deliberately due to a vision or a dream. Could she have been aiming to make TPTWP? If the GoHH is a descendant that too would have an interesting impact in terms of understanding magic users in series. There are all manner of possibilities you see. 

You say there is most likely no secret conscious hint dropping in the original text. But with all due respect how could you possibly know? Have you read the unabridged version? Are you privy to some knowledge the rest of us are lacking? 

Unless that is the case, then I reserve the right to theorise otherwise.  I think there is hint dropping in the published abridged text. As I've laid out and I hope to discover in the unabridged version that I was correct and to hopefully find out a bit more of why GRRM wrote about her. And what may have become of her child and it's descendants. 

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On ‎7‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 11:07 PM, Lord Varys said:

Sure, that would be my view as well. I'd like those medieval-style illuminations of the royal families I mentioned above but I really don't need that kind of stuff. The text is the text, never mind the format.

There seems to be a tendency - as usually with Martin - to make things more detailed as he goes along. The Conquest, Aegon, and his sons are relatively short accounts, Viserys I, the Dance, and the Regency much larger, essentially sort of outlines for novels in their own right. TSotD basically focus on the events at court and puts everything in relation to things Aenys, Aegon, Visenya, and Maegor do. But TRP and TPatQ really paint a bigger picture. Entire sections of 'The Death of the Dragons' should focus on the deeds and campaigns of some generals, just as the Regency account later on focus even more on the regents, Hands, and other courtiers. Alyn Velaryon, Baela, Rhaena, and especially Prince Viserys should also play important roles but the real powers of those era should be likes of Unwin Peake, Grand Maester Munkun, Thaddeus Rowan, Tyland Lannister, the Rogares, etc.

And thinking about that, I really want to see what Aegon III and Viserys later did to Unwin Peake and his ilk. I cannot help it, I want that man to have burned. The murder of Queen Jaehaera is perhaps the worst crime depicted in TWoIaF (immediately followed by Blood and Cheese and the the murder of Merry Meg). This man cannot have gotten away with that in the long run. That is part of the reason why I'd like to have the entire account of the reign of Aegon III in that book.

If that tendency continues the Conquest of Dorne and the reigns of Baelor the Blessed, Aegon the Unworthy, and Daeron the Good could get much longer, and we could get a real feeling of the vast history of the Seven Kingdoms. I really hope for something of that sort for Jaehaerys I. I want to know what made him so great and how he, Alysanne, and Barth really changed their lives of their subjects. With more detail we could really get a picture on the legal landscape prior and after the unification of the laws. That could really help understanding what rights (if any) the smallfolk has in the main series, etc.

And it would also make somewhat more sense if Gyldayn's account got more detailed the closer it got to his own sources. He could consult primary sources on the reigns of the later kings and would not be forced to write his account my citing other historians citing primary sources (like he does with Orwyle being cited by Munkun).

Who was Merry Meg?

I'd agree that the murder of Jaehaera was the most despicable act I can think of, prior to the murder of Elia and her children.  The poor girl spent half an hour dying by inches.  It's one of the things that makes me feel some sympathy for Alicent Hightower, despite her crimes.  She had lost absolutely everything before she died, and no doubt her captors eagerly told her about the hideous death her last surviving child had suffered.

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2 hours ago, The Weirwoods Eyes said:

I've wondered if she sought him out as a sexual partner deliberately due to a vision or a dream. Could she have been aiming to make TPTWP? If the GoHH is a descendant that too would have an interesting impact in terms of understanding magic users in series. There are all manner of possibilities you see.

There is small reason for anyone to try to create the promised prince during a day and age when the dragons are still there. And quite honestly, I don't think the promised prince(ss) is that special a person. He or she will play a crucial role in some war that is threatening a lot of people, etc. Without that war - which, presumably, refers to the Others - there will be no promised prince(ss).

2 hours ago, The Weirwoods Eyes said:

You say there is most likely no secret conscious hint dropping in the original text. But with all due respect how could you possibly know? Have you read the unabridged version? Are you privy to some knowledge the rest of us are lacking?

No, but I do know that Gardner Dozois abridged and edited TPatQ and TRP. This wasn't George. 'The Death of the Dragons' is a much larger account, and there is no reason to assume it does not cover the first meeting of Alys and Aemond (or at least mentions whose bastard she is), making it rather unlikely that her description, etc. are deliberate hints we can find in George's unabridged texts.

37 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Who was Merry Meg?

Are you serious? The second mistress of Aegon the Unworthy, the commoner girl he bought from her blacksmith husband in Fairmarket (with the help of the threats of a Kingsguard). Aegon had four daughters by her and married her in a mock ceremony involving a mummer playing a septon (one wonders whether this was actually just a mummer). When Prince Viserys found out about the whole thing he handed the girls to the Faith and returned Megette to her blacksmith husband - who beat her to death during the following year.

That is one of the worst injustices covered in TWoIaF, even more so since it is mentioned rather casually and was most likely entirely within the law as stipulated by the Rule of Six.

37 minutes ago, SeanF said:

I'd agree that the murder of Jaehaera was the most despicable act I can think of, prior to the murder of Elia and her children.  The poor girl spent half an hour dying by inches.  It's one of the things that makes me feel some sympathy for Alicent Hightower, despite her crimes.  She had lost absolutely everything before she died, and no doubt her captors eagerly told her about the hideous death her last surviving child had suffered.

Jaehaera was Alicent's granddaughter not her daughter. And most likely not exactly one of her descendants she liked best - after all, she was either severely autistic or mentally challenged in a different fashion. But she was the Queen of the Seven Kingdoms by the time she was murdered, and an innocent girl in addition to that. Elia, Aegon, and Rhaenys were also brutally killed but at least that happened during a war (although Tywin was nothing but a cowardly traitor and turncloak there, jumping ship at the last possible moment). Jaehaera was murdered during peace times by an ambitious guy who should have been on her side considering that he supported Aegon II throughout the entire Dance (or at least it looks like that, we don't know when exactly he joined the Hightower army).

I don't think Alicent was still alive by the time Jaehaera was killed. Unwin became regent in 132 AC after Lord Corlys died, but he only seized nearly complete power when the winter fever took so many prominent people in 133 AC. Tyland Lannister, the Hand, Roland Westerling, one of the other regents, and Torrhen Manderly (who didn't die but left for White Harbor after his father and brother had died of the winter fever).

From Ran we know that Unwin Peake did not only succeed Tyland Lannister as Hand but also became Protector of the Realm in stead of Leowyn Corbray (no idea what happened to him, perhaps he died, too). Alicent also died of the winter fever in 133 AC, so I'm inclined to believe that Peake only moved against Jaehaera later in that year, after the winter fever had enabled him to seize power. Westerling and especially Tyland would have done everything in their power to ensure that the queen would be properly protected. Not to mention that they would have done anything in their power to investigate and avenge her death. The fact that this wasn't done suggests that the all the true green loyalists were already gone from the regency council.

It also seems to be pretty likely that Peake was already Hand and Protector when he made his bastard brother Mervyn Flowers a knight of the Kingsguard. In fact, it is quite likely that the winter fever also created some empty spots among the Kingsguard, allowing Peake to give a white cloak to his brother. There have to be free spots in the Kingsguard to enable you to give them to your kin, and one assumes that Aegon II and the first seven regents of Aegon III filled the empty spots in 130-131 AC.

An interesting idea how Unwin Peake may have met his ultimate end is if he was involved in one of those schemes to put those fake Daerons on the Iron Throne. And if Prince Viserys was crucial in putting them down he may even have gone so far as falsely accusing Peake in being involved in that kind of thing just to have a pretext to kill him.

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46 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

There is small reason for anyone to try to create the promised prince during a day and age when the dragons are still there. And quite honestly, I don't think the promised prince(ss) is that special a person. He or she will play a crucial role in some war that is threatening a lot of people, etc. Without that war - which, presumably, refers to the Others - there will be no promised prince(ss).

No, but I do know that Gardner Dozois abridged and edited TPatQ and TRP. This wasn't George. 'The Death of the Dragons' is a much larger account, and there is no reason to assume it does not cover the first meeting of Alys and Aemond (or at least mentions whose bastard she is), making it rather unlikely that her description, etc. are deliberate hints we can find in George's unabridged texts.

Are you serious? The second mistress of Aegon the Unworthy, the commoner girl he bought from her blacksmith husband in Fairmarket (with the help of the threats of a Kingsguard). Aegon had four daughters by her and married her in a mock ceremony involving a mummer playing a septon (one wonders whether this was actually just a mummer). When Prince Viserys found out about the whole thing he handed the girls to the Faith and returned Megette to her blacksmith husband - who beat her to death during the following year.

That is one of the worst injustices covered in TWoIaF, even more so since it is mentioned rather casually and was most likely entirely within the law as stipulated by the Rule of Six.

Jaehaera was Alicent's granddaughter not her daughter. And most likely not exactly one of her descendants she liked best - after all, she was either severely autistic or mentally challenged in a different fashion. But she was the Queen of the Seven Kingdoms by the time she was murdered, and an innocent girl in addition to that. Elia, Aegon, and Rhaenys were also brutally killed but at least that happened during a war (although Tywin was nothing but a cowardly traitor and turncloak there, jumping ship at the last possible moment). Jaehaera was murdered during peace times by an ambitious guy who should have been on her side considering that he supported Aegon II throughout the entire Dance (or at least it looks like that, we don't know when exactly he joined the Hightower army).

I don't think Alicent was still alive by the time Jaehaera was killed. Unwin became regent in 132 AC after Lord Corlys died, but he only seized nearly complete power when the winter fever took so many prominent people in 133 AC. Tyland Lannister, the Hand, Roland Westerling, one of the other regents, and Torrhen Manderly (who didn't die but left for White Harbor after his father and brother had died of the winter fever).

From Ran we know that Unwin Peake did not only succeed Tyland Lannister as Hand but also became Protector of the Realm in stead of Leowyn Corbray (no idea what happened to him, perhaps he died, too). Alicent also died of the winter fever in 133 AC, so I'm inclined to believe that Peake only moved against Jaehaera later in that year, after the winter fever had enabled him to seize power. Westerling and especially Tyland would have done everything in their power to ensure that the queen would be properly protected. Not to mention that they would have done anything in their power to investigate and avenge her death. The fact that this wasn't done suggests that the all the true green loyalists were already gone from the regency council.

It also seems to be pretty likely that Peake was already Hand and Protector when he made his bastard brother Mervyn Flowers a knight of the Kingsguard. In fact, it is quite likely that the winter fever also created some empty spots among the Kingsguard, allowing Peake to give a white cloak to his brother. There have to be free spots in the Kingsguard to enable you to give them to your kin, and one assumes that Aegon II and the first seven regents of Aegon III filled the empty spots in 130-131 AC.

An interesting idea how Unwin Peake may have met his ultimate end is if he was involved in one of those schemes to put those fake Daerons on the Iron Throne. And if Prince Viserys was crucial in putting them down he may even have gone so far as falsely accusing Peake in being involved in that kind of thing just to have a pretext to kill him.

I'd forgotten all about that.  Yes, that is revolting.  It looks like Aegon and her husband both viewed her as a chattel.

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Assuming he still means to cover the history up and until Summerhall by Dunk & Egg, the series should cover up to the Blackfyre rebellion.

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2 hours ago, SeanF said:

I'd forgotten all about that.  Yes, that is revolting.  It looks like Aegon and her husband both viewed her as a chattel.

It is hardly surprising that Aegon viewed her in this fashion. The way her husband treated her is another matter, though. That strongly suggests that wives in general were treated as property by their husbands. The whole Rule of Six thing bettered their lot only superficially. If a husband wants to kill his wife he has to do it more slowly under this law, actually increasing her suffering in the process.

This reflects very badly on the laws and customs in the Westerosi society.

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4 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

No, but I do know that Gardner Dozois abridged and edited TPatQ and TRP. This wasn't George. 'The Death of the Dragons' is a much larger account, and there is no reason to assume it does not cover the first meeting of Alys and Aemond (or at least mentions whose bastard she is), making it rather unlikely that her description, etc. are deliberate hints we can find in George's unabridged texts.

I hope it does tell us whose bastard she is, but that being revealed by the unabridged text would not take away at all from the things which I have pulled out as hints as to her blood line. Her being known as a Blackwood would not remove the fact that she has long black flowing hair evokes the image we have built up of the Blackwood women through their descriptor having twice been Black Ally/Betha.

Nor would her being called Alys evoking the similar name Ally Blackwood in the same text, change by knowing from the unabridged text that she is lets say Black Ally's niece. as an example. Or even sister.

It just means I have picked up on those aspects of the story which still reveal who she is. Despite the actual naming of her parent's House being cut.  

As an example, let's say we meet Robb Stark in a novella and we don't learn his mother is Catelyn Tully because that information got cut. But we do get a physical description of him as auburn haired and blue eyed and we also get the description of Edmure Tully as Auburn haired and blue eyed.  An astute reader might theorise that this Edmure of House Tully may be related to Robb of House Stark.  

 

 

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2 hours ago, Bael's Bastard said:

 

160,000 words sound pretty good. Let's say Jaehaerys I gets another 40,000-60,000 words - quite a few things should happen during his reign - and we get a decent sized introduction and prologue on the Targaryens in Valyria and on Dragonstone then this could be a very fine book.

The ending is somewhat more problematic. The end of the Regency is no good or proper ending for such a history. The remainder of the reign of Aegon III - at least until the death of the last dragon - should be part of the volume. That's essentially were the first half of the Targaryen reign ended.

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1 hour ago, Bael's Bastard said:

I agree. And I am hating the idea that this is going to be another coffee table book.

Well, I've began to think about that. We could get a book containing more words than TWoIaF with art focusing on the era between the Conqueror and the Dragonbane (with, perhaps, a glimpse of Valyria and Dragonstone and Driftmark during the Century of Blood).

That certainly allows for quite a few interesting portraits and scenes to be rendered in art. If you do it systematically one could have those portraits of the royal families I mentioned somewhere above in addition to various portraits of the Kings and Hands. Hell, considering the amount of pages there could even be space enough for portraits of all the advisers and formal members of the Small Councils as well as all the Kingsguard from the Conqueror to the Dragonbane. That list of Hands we want to have is already pretty complete. There might be some gaps during the reign of Maegor and Jaehaerys I (prior to the appointment of Barth) and we don't know what was Hand under Aegon II after he was restored to the throne (most likely Borros Baratheon but that's just a guess, and if he was we don't know who succeeded him after Borros' death, assuming the king did appoint another Hand).

And there would sure as hell be enough space for certain appendices in such a book - a complete list of the dragons and all their riders, for instance (from Aenar the Exile to Aegon the Dragonbane, of course), a complete list of the Kingsguard, the Hands, the Small Council members, the High Septons (including their given names and houses) and Lord Commanders of the Night's Watch for the covered period. And perhaps even for the lords of the great houses and the Wardens of the various regions for the covered period. Proper historians of our day and age tend to put such things in the appendices of their works.

But even if they were to repeat the art thing they did for TWoIaF there are a lot of interesting scenes to be depicted, and many characters we would never expected to be portrayed - from the Vulture King and Savage Sam Tarly to Unwin Peake and Jeyne Arryn. The deaths of Queen Jaehaera or Prince Maelor or Blood and Cheese in all their gory glory could make very impressive illustrations.

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4 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

We could get a book containing more words than TWoIaF with art focusing on the era between the Conqueror and the Dragonbane (with, perhaps, a glimpse of Valyria and Dragonstone and Driftmark during the Century of Blood).

I'm actually hoping that the art in this is as minimal as possible. Maybe just a portrait of each king at the start of their sections, with maybe a few other decorative pieces. A ton of new art translates to higher possibilities of the book getting delayed. The bulk of the writing for the World Book was finished by mid-2013, but it didn't come out until late 2014, partially because they were waiting on so much art. 

4 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

a complete list of the Kingsguard, the Hands, the Small Council members, the High Septons (including their given names and houses) and Lord Commanders of the Night's Watch for the covered period.

I seriously, seriously doubt the book will be that thorough. A full list of Hands seems doable since we're already most of the way there. Complete lists of Kingsguard is, I think, beyond even Martins powers and interest when it comes to world building. In the entire 290 year history of the order we currently have 68 named or identified members. That's probably not even scratching the surface. I wouldn't be surprised if the total number of knights that served in the order was 200+. There's no way Martin's coming up with that many names and bios. Let alone the headache of organizing them, who died when, who replaced  who, etc. I'm one of the biggest Kingsguard fans out there but I'd settle for a list of Lord Commanders at this point. That at least seems doable.

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This is great news!

I have been burning to read the complete material that GRRM had originally written for WoIAF since I learned that it existed and always felt that there was little sense in sitting on it until the whole series was complete (which even back then looked like a long, long, time). It doesn't seem like there was much there about the reign of Dragonbane after his majority, though, so I imagine that the first volume  would end with the end of the Regency.

And yea, it seems to me that there could/ought to be some interesting things from Conciliator's reign that need to be filled in - like, what happened to Prince Aemon, and, seemingly, his dragon as well? What gave "The Queen who Never Was" her fiery reputation - which, according to WoIAF she already had as a young woman? There ought to be something substantial about Alysanne too - frankly, one of the largest negatives of tWoIAF was it paucity of interesting female figures and the fact that having awesome destructive power/incomparably quick transport at their personal disposal seemingly affected social standing and opportunities of female dragonriders so little... which just wasn't very believable, IMHO.

 

On 25.7.2017 at 2:38 PM, Lord Varys said:

@The Weirwoods Eyes

In addition, if Alys Rivers was a genuine seer after all - not a sorceress, a seer - then this doesn't point towards the Blackwoods, either. There is one Blackwood sorcerer - Brynden Rivers - but we honestly don't know whether his special abilities have anything to do with either his Blackwood or Targaryen legacy. What little we know about skinchangers and greenseers does not indicate that they appear all that often in a particular bloodline, and there is no hint whatsoever that there were any other Blackwood sorcerers besides Bloodraven.

Well, there was also Lady Agnes Blackwood, who fought and lost (due to treachery) against Harwyn Hoare and foretold the end of his line in blood and fire - she may have been a seeress also, though, as usual in the setting, it didn't help her much.

But yea, black hair isn't restricted to Blackwoods and neither are the variants of the name "Alys"(-sa, -anne, etc.). And while there may be a certain hereditary component in sorcerous/visionary abilities -  and BTW in this setting, the latter often, though not always, seem to be an early indication of the former, they are certainly not tied to the _male_ line. Since Blackwoods intermarried with the other Riverlands Houses and particularly with their enemies the Brackens so much (as Hoster Blackwood  points out in TDwD), Alys Rivers's abilities, even if they were ultimately tied in some way to the Blackwood descent, wouldn't in any way indicate the family name of her noble parent.

 

 

 

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